Theater Talk speculates about Tony winners

[wickedrentq]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 3:46pm

Hopefully someone will help me fill in details or anything I forgot, but the panel included Riedel, Susan, Michael Musto...Patrick something, and I can't remember the name of the other guy.

They seemed fairly unanimous about the following winners, despite discussing which nominee could be the spoiler: Spring Awakening for musical, Coast of Utopia for play, Journey's End for revival, Christine Ebersole for actress, Mary Louise Wilson for featured actress, Frank Langella for lead actor in play, Spring Awakening for score, and Michael Mayer of Spring Awakening for director.

Otherwise, they brought up some really interesting points. At first, some expressed that they thought Raul would win...he survived Taboo, he survived Chitty Chitty Bang Bang, plays piano...and is also really good. Heh, that was amusing.

But then Riedel said he thought it would go to Pierce because though Curtains isn't the best piece ever, there is some sentimental feeling toward it, being Ebb's last musical, and the Tonys would want to honor it in some way, and they very well could do so by giving the Tony to their leading actor, who is also very good. Interesting.

They seemed to agree that Julie White deserved best actress in a play, and said she was doing everything she could to campaign, remind people of her even though her play closed. They said that if it doesn't go to White, it will probably go to Eve Best.

They also debated revival of a musical...most said Company, but then Patrick and Riedel said 110 in the Shade, and pointed out that Patrick was the only one who predicted Pajama Game over Sweeney last year. He explained that voters tend to vote for the show they were most entertained by, and while he was more entertained by Company, he said most were probably more entertained by 110, and that's why it might win...of course there was also some debate about Company's not even as good as Sweeney which didn't win, but then 110 isn't Pajama Game, etc.

I think the only other debate was choreography. Riedel, Susan and most seemed to agree that it should go to Bill T. Jones for Spring Awakening. Now, they did explain the "choreography" such as that for Bitch of Living that is rather exciting, if not traditional "choreography." Still, Patrick (and me at least) believe there's still too much standing around in SA for Jones to win it and that Matthew Bourne and Stephen Mear would get it for Mary Poppins.

Thoughts?

What Riedel said, compared to what I already thought that Cerveris would take some votes away from Esparza, which might allow Pierce to sneak in. That's gonna be a *really* close race.

[luvtheEmcee]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 3:49pm

But then Riedel said he thought it would go to Pierce because though Curtains isn't the best piece ever, there is some sentimental feeling toward it, being Ebb's last musical, and the Tonys would want to honor it in some way

So then they should give Ebb's work, the material itself, an award. That'd be the logical thing to do.

He's an idiot. He was probably just being contrary to stir up a debate. I think DHP could win, but if he does, I'm not sure I'd buy that for the reason.

Updated On: 5/27/07 at 03:49 PM

[wickedfan]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 3:51pm

These are the same people who predicted that Spamalot was going to win every award in sight, including Score and Book.

[wickedrentq]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 3:55pm

People *actually* predicted that Spamalot would win score? Wow.

Bwaygal PMed me asking what they said about lead actress, but she's not accepting PMs so I'll just respond here.

One said that if anyone's gonna take the award from Ebersole, it would be Audra, but the only thing against Ebersole is time, she's had it in the bag for so long, etc. Still, it would be a huge surprise if Ebersole did not win.

[munkustrap178]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 3:55pm

Reidel is an infamously BAD prognosticator. He admits it himself.

I do feel, however, that David Hyde Pierce will win the Tony.

I would have no problem with Jones winning choreography for SPRING AWAKENING, except for one thing: during "Totally F*CKed" when the cast stands on the edge of the stage and basically, collectively, has a ceisure. It's AWFUL.

[neddyfrank2]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 3:56pm

Why don't they give the Special Tony Award for Lifetime Achievement to Kander and Ebb? That way Curtains will kind of be honored.

[Sondheim Geek]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 3:57pm

Go give Curtains best book of a musical or something... why award their leading man when he has hardly anything to do with Kander and Ebb and there are far more deserving in that category? Riedel is ridiculous sometimes….

Do they mean they’re going with the show they’re more entertained by for best musical, or specifically best revival of a musical? So, he's saying that only fluff wins, no matter what? We underestimate the Tony voters all the time, but this is crossing the line.

[wickedfan]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 3:58pm

Yes, wicked, almost all of them did with I think maybe one saying Dirty Rotten Scoundrels might take Score due to what many now consider a snub for Best Score in 2001 for The Full Monty.

Their argument was that Light in the Piazza was boring but looked great and that the score of Spamalot worked in context of the show, which really means, it's a weak score but when it's performed in the show it's not that bad.

[munkustrap178]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:03pm

SondheimGeek, are you SLOW or something? Why is Reidel ridiculous? They are SPECULATING - meaning, PREDICTING the outcome of the Tony awards. None of them said "They should award Pierce because he's in the Kander and Ebb show." What he SAID was they voters might THINK that way, and therefore he might win. It's called PROG-NOS-TI-CAT-ING. Playing with difference scenarios to help predict an outcome. It's a thoroughly possibly scenario. So, how is Reidel ridiculous?

Again, here you go with the stupid thing. What do you mean "THEY'RE going with the show THEY'RE more entertained by?" Redel and the peanut gallery are NOT VOTING. That are PREDICTING. It was noted that, in the past, the most entertaining musical revival has won the award. They are putting themselves in the shoes of the Tony voters. He said nothing about how only fluff wins. He said that more often than not, the show that wins Best Musical Revival is something just vastly entertaining. He predicted a win by THE PAJAMA GAME last year on the same premise, so he's sticking with it.

Why is is so difficult to comprehend that?

[hilltop]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:04pm

I'm glad there was no "Audra might steal it" talk. She can wait for her 5th Tony, this should be Ebersole's night.

[Sondheim Geek]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:06pm

Eh, excuse me? Rude much? I'm saying his speculation is ridiculous. Gosh...

[munkustrap178]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:08pm

But it's not ridiculous.

Just because the speculated outcome doesn't fare well for Esparza and COMPANY doesn't mean that their theories don't hold any weight.

They're all totally plausible and totally possible.

[nomdeplume]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:09pm

Thanks for sharing this info, WRQ.

You might want to distinguish between Best Actress/Play and Best Actress/Musical as not everyone has had a chance to see the shows and know who's doing what.

[wickedrentq]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:10pm

Damn wickedfan. As the Tonys got closer, I'm sure most predicted Piazza for score...or at least we at the boards did. Odd.

I think the whole point with what Riedel said re: Pierce isn't that that would be the only reason, but combine the fact that most would agree he is wonderful in the show, which most wouldn't disagree with. Some voters would def vote for Pierce just based on performance, it's not like he's someone who has no business winning. I think Riedel's point is when voters have the difficult task between voting for Esparza or Pierce (or Cerveris), if they're having difficulty choosing between them, they might vote for Pierce because of Curtains and Ebb. I mean, if Jonathan Groff was giving his Spring Awakening performance in Curtains, I don't think Riedel would think Groff could win because his performance isn't up to the standards of the big 3.

Wait Munk, are you sure Riedel doesn't vote for the Tonys? I could have sworn he mentioned something about voting for Q at the Show Business documentary.

ETA: Nom, I already mentioned Julie White in terms of actress in a PLAY in my first post, so even though I didn't actually say musical in my next post, I'm very concerned for the deductive thinking skills of people today, so I am going to make readers use them to deduct that since I have said White is for play, that must mean Ebersole/Audra is for musical.

Updated On: 5/27/07 at 04:10 PM

[Sondheim Geek]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:11pm

Again, excuse me? This is a bit rude, and I really don't see where it's coming from. I do not think that Hyde Pierce deserves the Tony, just because I don't think his performance was amazing. I haven't spoken a word about Esparza OR Company. I really don't enjoy you putting words in my mouth. I don't think his prediction has a chance of happening, so therefore, I think it's ridiculous to think so.

[Tom148502]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:12pm

while it certainly looks like Raul Esparza will win the Tony Award, I'd like someone to point out to me just what it is about his performance that makes him deserving, especially in comparison to the others who were nominated in the category. While Esparza may sing well, or at least sound good on a recording, it's very irritating to watch his singing "technique" being formulated as you watch him on stage. I think David Hyde Pierce's performance in Curtains is much more deserving of the award but I'm more than willing to have someone explain what it is about Esparza's performance that has titillared so many

[luvtheEmcee]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:12pm

I think he meant that what he said on the show is his prediction for what other people will do, and not necessarily indicative of how he will vote.

I haven't seen LoveMusik yet, but frankly, as it stands now, if Raúl didn't exist, I'd give it to Gavin Lee over DHP. DHP was adorable, in his awkward David Hyde Pierce way, and it's a good performance, but Gavin's performance was perfect, and just so full of joy. I hope we see more of him.

Updated On: 5/27/07 at 04:12 PM

[neddyfrank2]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:15pm

I wish that the producers did it right and asked for Gavin Lee to be put in Best Supporting Actor and Debra Monk be put in Best Supporting Actress.

Also, I am pretty sure that Riedel votes for the Tonys.

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:17pm

Monk's above the title. That was her choice, and she knew what she was getting into.

It wouldn't be fair to the true supporting women for her to be put into Featured Actress.

[wickedfan]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:17pm

Tom, why I think Esparza should win: He gives a totally new perspective on Bobby and also fully projects the point in the show that Bobby is an observer and doesn't actually participate (until the end). He sings EXTREMELY well, and his "being Alive" is superb. He manages to be completely convincing and interesting even when he's speaking in monotone. He's a powerful presence on that stage, and you can see the burdens his character is facing piling up on him until he eventually has to scream "STOOOOPPP!!!!!", which I felt was entirely powerful. I never knew that moment could have such effect. Every production I've ever seen has Bobby simply stating "Stop!" ala Dean Jones on the OBCR.

Why I think he should get it over Pierce: He has charisma, he can sing, and he knows how to act for the stage. I love Pierce, but not on stage. He was great on Frasier and even managed to be hilarious in his two scenes in "Sleepless in Seattle" but I don't think the man should be on the Broadway stage. Not yet, at least. Maybe with some training. But I think he comes off as a weak presence and I didn't think he carried Curtains in the way that he is supposed to.

[wickedrentq]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:21pm

Now don't get me wrong, I ADORE Gavin Lee, and couldn't have been happier about his Drama Desk win. And I can't say I'd be upset if he shocked everyone and took best actor, but compare how much more Pierce is lead...he carries the show, he's onstage almost the whole time, and Lee's part simply can't compete. I think they both did fantastic jobs, but given the bigger job Pierce has to do (even though we all know some of the difficult things Gavin has to do, I won't spoil), I'd say Pierce deserves it more than Lee.

ETA: Wickedfan, for the record, I disagree, I thought Pierce did a wonderful job of carrying Curtains on his back; I thoroughly enjoyed his performance. I very much agree with what Rath says right under this post.

Em, you think Gavin deserves it over Cerveris as well? (I haven't seen Lovemusik yet, couldn't say)

I too wish Gavin was in the featured actor category, could be close between him and Gallagher.

By the way, I wish I knew why I so randomly interchange first and last names with performers...don't think about it when I'm writing...weird thing I do...

Updated On: 5/27/07 at 04:21 PM

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:26pm

But I think he comes off as a weak presence and I didn't think he carried Curtains in the way that he is supposed to."

You've got to be kidding me. I wouldn't have known him from Adam before CURTAINS, but he completely charmed me, and I honestly can't imagine a more perfect casting for that role.

[neddyfrank2]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:27pm

The only reason that Monk is above the title is because she is a name, if she wasn't a name her part would be considered supporting.

[wickedfan]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:28pm

Why would I be kidding you, Rath? I liked Curtains, but I didn't like Pierce. I'm not alone in that sentiment. It has nothign to do with his casting. I think he as a performer is not very strong. I really liked Monk. What more do you want from me?

[munkustrap178]

Posted: 5/27/07 at 4:30pm

Sondheim: It's not rude. You don't see where I'm coming from? Well, that explain it all. YOU do not think that Pierce deserves the Tony. YOU don't think it does. It was a prediction. Just because you don't agree with a possible outcome doesn't mean that the theory behind it is invalid.

For example.

Let's take Julie White vs. Angela Lansbury. I would like Julie White to win, but I also entertain the notion that Lansbury could win just based on her legendary status. I don't like the outcome of the prediction, but the theiry certainly holds lots of water. Just because I don't think Lansbury should win doesn't mean the person who suggested the theory is an idiot.

How old are you?