WOMEN ON THE VERGE - both versions

[egghumor]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 4:17pm

In the current thread discussing the Drama Desk winners from last night, there seems to be a battle royal brewing on the merits (or not) of WOMEN ON THE VERGE (as well as BOM). I did not see the show, but a year ago I saw the film again, knowing it was being adapted into a stage musical. I'm a huge Almodovar fan, but I thought the film did not cry to be staged as a musical – in fact, I thought the idea of doing so presented monumental chellenges. Therefore, I was not surprised by the Broadway-bound problems that ensued and that were never (apparently) solved. To me, the film is highly specific in its cultural-specific psychology and farcial nature. Ambitious? Certainly, but I can see why it's also easy to argue simply that it was impossible, wrongheaded – especially once I realized how closely the creators were sticking with the original concept, tone, etc, as a sort of homage to Pedro Almadovar.

I'd love to hear from those who have seen BOTH versions. Who agrees with me that the idea of translating WOMEN ON THE VERGE into an American musical was a rather misguided notion to begin with?

Such strong talent in the Broadway community on the same stage(LuPone, Mitchell, Benanti, Scott, Sher) just couldn't make the enterprise fly.

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 4:29pm

I'd love to hear from those who have seen BOTH versions. Who agrees with me that the idea of translating WOMEN ON THE VERGE into an American musical was a rather misguided notion to begin with?

I saw both versions and I disagree with you completely. I thought the musical was delightful, fleshing out some of the characters that were more glossed over in the film, especially with respect to the father/son relationship. The musical stayed pretty close to the original story. The only MAJOR change was in the ending, which was less cynical and ambiguous than in the film. I honestly don't think the psychology of the film is so culture-specific, especially when compared to most other Almodovar works. The heart of the film and its characters expressed pretty universal emotions that are easily relatable to anyone who has had their heart broken. After reading the reviews, I got the feeling most of the critics were either not familiar with the film or had not seen it since the 80s. I saw it shortly before it closed and was expecting a train wreck based on the reviews and comments here, but I was pleasantly surprised not only by the show as a musical, but at how well they captured the spirit of Almodovar's film. I was actually glad they didn't try to relocate and Americanize the story as with The Full Monty. Yazbeck did a wonderful job at capturing the diversity of Spanish music in his score. I loved the show from start to finish.

[bwayphreak234]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 4:41pm

^ I agree 100% Mister Matt.

[egghumor]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 5:06pm

Mister Matt: "The musical stayed pretty close to the original story. The only MAJOR change was in the ending, which was less cynical and ambiguous than in the film. I honestly don't think the psychology of the film is so culture-specific, especially when compared to most other Almodovar works. The heart of the film and its characters expressed pretty universal emotions that are easily relatable to anyone who has had their heart broken."

Ok, well that would certainly explain why the show ended its run even before the original LC subscription booking; seeing as it all worked so well. I can also understand that the show worked well when Pepa didn't emerge as the most interesting, compelling character in the story, but Candela instead. No problems there!

BTW--I never said they should have relocated the story to America.

Updated On: 5/24/11 at 05:06 PM

[Lavieboheme3090]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 5:54pm

I made sure to see the movie before I saw the show. To me the biggest problem was the direction. The show moved so slowly, it felt like there were major set changes about every five minuets and those would take anywhere from 30 seconds to a minuet with nothing going on but a set change. A friend of mine and I were joking after hearing the score again on the OBC that we would have enjoyed the show better as a staged reading.

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 6:00pm

Ok, well that would certainly explain why the show ended its run even before the original LC subscription booking; seeing as it all worked so well. I can also understand that the show worked well when Pepa didn't emerge as the most interesting, compelling character in the story, but Candela instead. No problems there!

Didn't you say you hadn't seen the musical? I'm just giving my opinion of the show. Not sure why you're being so snarky when you asked for the opinions of those who had seen both the musical and the film. I certainly made no mention of Candela emerging as the most interesting, compelling character in the story. I guess you only want to hear from people who will say what you want to hear, but you should probably be more specific about that.

BTW--I never said they should have relocated the story to America.

I never said you did.

[egghumor]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 6:00pm

Thanks, lavie. For all the technical wonder of the set design, it was also the primary reason cited for the continued delay in previews and as yet another unworkable aspect of the production, or at least one that did not serve the production well.

By the way folks, to discuss why a show did not "work," is not the same as saying is was bad or awful, etc. I never said such.

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 6:08pm

By the way folks, to discuss why a show did not "work," is not the same as saying is was bad or awful, etc. I never said such.

Um, okay. I don't think anyone made a point of that, but it's nice to know.

Basically, it sounds like you're only seeking validation on an opinion you formed long before the show even hit the stage. I think you could have saved a lot of time with a thread entitled "Told You So" and left it at that. People can disagree with you and it's perfectly okay.

[egghumor]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 6:17pm

I was ASKING why the show didn't work. Mister Matt, you responded by basically claiming there was nothing wrong with the show, and that it was the critics' fault. I think the audience response as to whether or not the show ultimately worked, speaks volumes.

Let me add that today I listened to the cast recording in its entirety and I think it's hands-down Yazbek's best score to date. But again, that does not convince me that the show worked very well.

Calm down, Mr. Matt, you might blow some feathers.

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 6:29pm

I was ASKING why the show didn't work.

Sorry, I was responding to your question "I'd love to hear from those who have seen BOTH versions. Who agrees with me that the idea of translating WOMEN ON THE VERGE into an American musical was a rather misguided notion to begin with?"

As a matter of fact, I couldn't find anywhere that you asked why the show didn't work until much later.

Mister Matt, you responded by basically claiming there was nothing wrong with the show, and that it was the critics' fault.

Is that sort of like saying your first post was asking why the show didn't work? I'm perfectly calm, I'm just baffled by your responses which make less sense after each post. The show worked for me. I'm not going to pretend it worked for anyone else other than me. Spring Awakening did not work for me, but saying it was a critical and financial success is not going to make it work for me. I'm not sure what it is you want me to say, but I've no doubt you'll come up with something new and creative that I didn't say. Or you didn't say, but you say you said. Or maybe something entirely new.

Updated On: 5/24/11 at 06:29 PM

[egghumor]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 6:42pm

MisterMatt, your attitude from the start seemed to be to shut me down by stating the show was great; end of discussion.

That would certainly explain all the bickering on the Drama Desk winner thread that prompted this thread to begin with.

I get it. You LOVED the show. I thnk at this point, even Bartlett Sher would admit the show didn't work.

BTW--I saw SPRING AWAKENING, and I'm with you.

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 7:03pm

Nothing Mister Matt said made it sound like he was trying to shut you down; if anything, it seems like you are the one with something under your collar because he's not agreeing with your suggestion that it was misguided from the start.

[americanboy99]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 7:06pm

I found it quite awful with about two great moments - "Model Behavior" and "Invisible." I thought the show moved much too slowly and all the farcical bits fell quite flat. I adore the score as I listen to the recording but distinctly remember only being impressed by the two aforementioned songs when I saw it in the theatre.

Benanti was, however, absolutely perfect and gave the hands-down best performance I saw all season. And yes, I saw every new musical/revival.

[egghumor]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 7:09pm

No, Phyllis, I think the critcial and audience response to and the run of the show support the fact that it was "misguided from the start."

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 7:11pm

You truly are insufferable.

[americanboy99]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 7:14pm

I don't think one can really tell if the show was misguided from the "start" since none of us actually witnessed "the start." We saw the first preview (a nearly finished product) and on.

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 7:20pm

MisterMatt, your attitude from the start seemed to be to shut me down by stating the show was great; end of discussion.

Huh? I had no intention of "shutting you down" at all. You asked if people who saw both agreed with you. I said I saw both and don't agree with you. Then I stated why. It was nothing personal or intentionally malicious or controversial. Maybe you should try reading my original response again with an objective eye to the question you posed.

No, Phyllis, I think the critcial and audience response to and the run of the show support the fact that it was "misguided from the start."

So why did you even ask in the first place if you will only accept your answer? Shows close for a variety of reasons. Because a show flopped doesn't mean it was misguided from the start. A show can easily be a good idea, but a failure in execution. Or there can be a singular element that failed, but it doesn't make the entire idea misguided. Regardless, perhaps you should have seen it so you could judge for yourself. Or admit that you only want to hear your opinion parroted back to you. Otherwise, what is the point of this thread?

Updated On: 5/24/11 at 07:20 PM

[egghumor]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 7:23pm

Yeah, Miss Phyllis, and you are truly not Jan Maxwell, or Lee Remick, or Donna Murphy.

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 7:27pm

I think this thread has gotten TooDarnHot.

[egghumor]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 7:29pm

From poster Brick on another thread only moments ago:
"From the recording, the VERGE orchestrations are some of the best I've heard in a lone while. It's sad so much of the production didn't work in the theatre..."

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 7:31pm

Well, then Brick's opinion is clearly the only one you should listen to, as it fits in perfectly with what you've already chosen to believe. Discussion over!

[egghumor]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 7:38pm

Oh, I see how this all works, Madame Stone, you have spoken! YOU decide when discussions are "over."

I suppose WONDERLAND and IN MY LIFE worked for you as well.



Updated On: 5/24/11 at 07:38 PM

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 7:42pm

What does Brick's comment on another thread have to do with the original question in this thread? It sounds very nonspecific and I'm curious to know if he says the entire production was misguided from the start. But that would be relevant to the original post in this thread, so perhaps it doesn't belong here. Regardless, it has nothing to do with my own opinion of the show. And I'm not saying that to shut Brick down in case there is ANY confusion.

End of conversation!

[americanboy99]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 7:44pm

This got SO heated so quickly. Such fun!

[egghumor]

Posted: 5/24/11 at 7:45pm

Wow, Mr. Matt, you and Phyllis should headline a production of SIDE SHOW together (assuming you're actually two different people).