Profile for Mark-Alexis

"A good regional theater performance"?  Seriously, dude, lol.  Do tell, what was so "good regional theater" about it. 

Give me a more astute review arguing your point like the one below.  Not just some flippant knee-jerk reaction:

from Vulture's Jesse Green:

"Her Mary has a broader emotional palette than any I’ve seen, including that of Vanessa Redgrave, who made her Mary a harrowing wraith dying from the play’s first words. Lange situates the character more as O’Neill depicts her: at the beginning of a relapse, not at the end. She is still a coquette, not only in the moderately sunny opening, but also in flashes throughout, as she continues to wrestle with her illness. It’s the struggle that makes the tragedy; indeed, her descent is far more painful for the shy pride she takes in her apparent good health at the start, and for the pleasure of her brogue as it occasionally flirts out like a well-turned ankle from beneath her long skirts. As a result, when she eventually heads up the long, long stairs of Tom Pye’s set to the morphine vials in the spare bedroom upstairs, you feel every step’s disaster."

http://www.vulture.com/2016/04/theater-review-long-days-journey-into-night.html

Such mean spiritedness, lol.  Thankfully, all of this:

Jessica Phyllis Lange (/læ?/; born April 20, 1949) is an American actress who has received worldwide acclaim for her work in film, theater, and television. The recipient of several awards, including two Academy Awards, one Tony Award, three Emmy Awards, five Golden Globe Awards, one Screen Actors Guild Award, and three Dorian Awards; in 1998, Entertainment Weekly listed Lange among the 25 Greatest Actresses of the '90s.[1] In 2016, Lange became the 22nd thespian to achieve the Triple Crown of Acting.

Lange was discovered by producer Dino De Laurentiis while modeling part-time for the Wilhelmina modelling agency. She made her professional film debut in his 1976 remake of the 1933 action-adventure classic King Kong, for which she won her first Golden Globe Award. In 1982, she became the first performer in 40 years[2] to receive two Oscar nominations within the same year;[3] she won her second Golden Globe Award and the Academy Award for Best Supporting Actress for her role as a soap opera star in Tootsie, and was also nominated for the Academy Award for Best Actress for her portrayal of the troubled actress Frances Farmer, in Frances.

Lange received three more nominations, for Country (1984), Sweet Dreams (1985), and Music Box (1989), before garnering a sixth Oscar nomination and winning, along with her third Golden Globe Award, the Academy Award for Best Actress for her performance as a manic depressive housewife in Blue Sky (1994). Lange was the second actress in Oscar history, after Meryl Streep, to win Best Actress after winning Best Supporting Actress; a record she held for nearly 20 years before being succeeded by Cate Blanchett in 2014.[4] She won her first Primetime Emmy Award for her portrayal of Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis' famed aunt, Big Edie, in HBO's Grey Gardens (2009), while she won her first Screen Actors Guild Award, fifth Golden Globe Award, and second and third Emmy Awards for her performances in the first and third seasons of FX's, American Horror Story (2011–2015).

In 2016, Lange garnered her first Tony Award for Best Performance by a Leading Actress in a Play, an Outer Critics Circle Award for Best Lead Actress in a Play and a Drama Desk Award for Outstanding Actress in a Play for her critically acclaimed performance in the Broadway revival of Long Day's Journey into Night.

When she won, I was all like:

Thanks for playing.

They both won the Tony for their performances, with Lange winning more precursors. 

I'd love to read some comparison and contrast reviews.

Lastly, I must say, drunk-posting is not the tea.

Anyway, I meant no offense in my posts above.  I wrote in drunken jest. 

I just think this legend and true acting genius deserves the love despite the cruel detractors.

 

Love you all! xoxo

It spellchecked b/tches to butches...

How un-apropos, lol.

She was stunning on Rose:

She's so humble and down to earth.  Definitely the nervous type but so unpretentious.

 

 

All of you cold-blooded butches out there, please be kind to her.  She deserves this, both for her monumental, definitive performance and because she's,  you know, Jessica Mother****ing Lange.

Fantastic to see them all together. 

 

Lange was on Charlie Rose last night, discussing Long Day's Journey into Night and Horace and Pete.  Fascinating.

https://charlierose.com/videos/28112

 

So, the Drama League Awards Ceremony is being held this morning at 11:30 a.m.  I'm excited about these.  Who are some of your predicted winners?

Full nominees below from the official website:

2016 DRAMA LEAGUE AWARDS NOMINEES

OUTSTANDING PRODUCTION OF A BROADWAY OR OFF-BROADWAY PLAY

10 Out Of 12

By Anne Washburn

Directed by Les Waters

Soho Rep

Sarah Benson, Artistic Director; Cynthia Flowers, Executive Director; in association with John Adrian Selzer

 

Eclipsed

By Danai Gurira

Directed by Liesl Tommy

John Golden Theatre

Stephen C. Byrd, Alia Jones-Harvey, Paula Marie Black, Carole Shorenstein Hays, Alani Lala Anthony, Michael Magers, Kenny Ozoude, Willette Klausner, Davelle, Dominion Pictures, Emanon Productions, FG Productions, The Forstalls, MA Theatricals, producers; in association with Randolph Sturrup; Associate Producer: Marvet Britto; first produced and presented by The Public Theatre: Oskar Eustis, Artistic Director; Patrick Willingham, Executive Director

 

The Father

By Florian Zeller

Translated by Christopher Hampton

Directed by Doug Hughes

Manhattan Theatre Club

Lynne Meadow, Artistic Director; Barry Grove, Executive Producer; By special arrangement with Theatre Royal Bath Productions

 

Gloria

By Branden Jacobs-Jenkins

Directed by Evan Cabnet

Vineyard Theatre

Douglas Aibel and Sarah Stern, Artistic Directors; Jennifer Garvey-Blackwell, Executive Director

 

Hir

By Taylor Mac

Directed by Niegel Smith

Playwrights Horizons

Tim Sanford, Artistic Director; Leslie Marcus, Managing Director; Carol Fishman, General Manager

 

The Humans

By Stephen Karam

Directed by Joe Mantello

Helen Hayes Theatre

Scott Rudin, Barry Diller, Roundabout Theatre Company (Todd Haimes, Artistic Director; Harold Wolpert, Managing Director; Julia C. Levy, Executive Director; Sydney Beers, General Manager), Fox Theatricals, James L. Nederlander, Terry Allen Kramer, Roy Furman, Daryl Roth, Jon B. Platt, Eli Bush, Broadway Across America, Jack Lane, Barbara Whitman, Jay Alix & Una Jackman, Scott M. Delman, Sonia Friedman, Amanda Lipitz, Peter May, Stephanie P. McClelland, Lauren Stein, and The Shubert Organization, producers; Joey Parnes, Sue Wagner, John Johnson, executive producers

 

King Charles III

By Mike Bartlett

Directed by Rupert Goold

Music Box Theatre

Stuart Thompson, Sonia Friedman Productions, Almeida Theatre, Robert G. Bartner, Norman Tulchin, Lee Dean & Charles Diamond, Scott M. Delman, Ruth Hendel, Stephanie P. McClelland, Jon B. Platt, Scott Rudin, Richard Winkler, Zeilinger Productions, The Shubert Organization, producers

 

Marjorie Prime

By Jordan Harrison

Directed by Anne Kauffman

Playwrights Horizons

Tim Sanford, Artistic Director; Leslie Marcus, Managing Director; Carol Fishman, General Manager

 

The Royale

By Marco Ramirez

Directed by Rachel Chavkin

Lincoln Center Theater

Andrè Bishop, Producing Artistic Director; Adam Siegel, Managing Director; Hattie K. Jutagir, Executive Director of Development and Planning

 

Skeleton Crew

By Dominique Morisseau

Directed by Ruben Santiago-Hudson

Atlantic Theater Company

Neil Pepe, Artistic Director; Jeffory Lawson, Managing Director

 

OUTSTANDING REVIVAL OF A BROADWAY OR OFF-BROADWAY PLAY

Awake and Sing!

By Clifford Odets

Directed by Stephen Brown-Fried

National Asian-American Theatre Company

Mia Katigbak, Artistic Producing Director; Peter Kim, Associate Producer

 

Blackbird

By David Harrower

Directed by Joe Mantello

Belasco Theatre

Scott Rudin, Eli Bush, Roger Berlind, William Berlind, Scott M. Delman, Peter May, Jon B. Platt, Len Blavatnick, Tulchin Bartner Productions, Jay Alix & Una Jackman, Heni Koenigsberg, Stacey Mindich, Wendy Federman, producers; Joey Parnes, Sue Wagner, John Johnson, executive producers

 

Cloud Nine

By Caryl Churchill

Directed by James MacDonald

Atlantic Theater Company

Neil Pepe, Artistic Director; Jeffory Lawson, Managing Director

 

The Crucible

By Arthur Miller

Directed by Ivo van Hove

Walter Kerr Theatre  

Scott Rudin, Eli Bush, Roger Berlind, William Berlind, Len Blavatnik, Roy Furman, Peter May, Jay Alix & Una Jackman, Scott M. Delman, Heni Koenigsberg, Daryl Roth, Jane Bergère, Sonia Friedman Productions, Ruth Hendel, JFL Theatricals, Stacey Mindich, Jon B. Platt, Megan Savage, Spring Sirkin, Tulchin Bartner Productions, producers; Joey Parnes, Sue Wagner, John Johnson, executive producers

 

The Gin Game

By D.L. Coburn

Directed by Leonard Foglia

Golden Theatre

Bob Boyett, Jon Bierman, Jamie deRoy, Eric Falkenstein, Wendy Federman, Roy Furman, Philip Geier, Ruth Hendel, Marianne Mills, Ostar, Ira Pittelman, Sanford Robertson, The Shubert Organization; in association with Loraine Boyle, Barbara Freitag, Carl Moellenberg, Ron Simons, producers  

 

Long Day’s Journey into Night

By Eugene O’Neill

Directed by Jonathan Kent

Roundabout Theatre Company

Todd Haimes, Artistic Director; Harold Wolpert, Managing Director; Julia C. Levy, Executive Director; Sydney Beers, General Manager; in association with Ryan Murphy

 

A Midsummer Night’s Dream

By William Shakespeare

Directed by Eric Tucker

Pearl Theatre Company (a co-production with the Hudson Valley Shakespeare Festival)

Hal Brooks, Artistic Director (Pearl Theatre Company); Jess Burkle, Managing Director (Pearl Theatre Company); Davis McCallum, Artistic Director  (The Hudson Valley Shakespeare Festival); Kate Liberman, Managing Director (The Hudson Valley Shakespeare Festival)

 

Noises Off

By Michael Frayn

Directed by Jeremy Herrin

Roundabout Theatre Company

Todd Haimes, Artistic Director; Harold Wolpert, Managing Director; Julia C. Levy, Executive Director; Sydney Beers, General Manager

 

Sense and Sensibility

By Jane Austen, adapted for the stage by Kate Hamill

Directed by Eric Tucker

Bedlam

Eric Tucker, Artistic Director; Andrus Nichols, Producing Director

 

A View from the Bridge

By Arthur Miller

Directed by Ivo van Hove

Lyceum Theatre

Scott Rudin, Lincoln Center Theater, Eli Bush. Robert G. Bartner, Roger Berlind, William Berlind, Roy Furman, Peter May, Amanda Lipitz, Stephanie P. McClelland, Jay Alix & Una Jackman, Scott M. Delman, Sonia Friedman, John Gore, Ruth Hendel, JFL Theatricals, Heni Koenigsberg, Jon B. Platt, Daryl Roth, Spring Sirkin, producers

 

OUTSTANDING PRODUCTION OF A BROADWAY OR OFF-BROADWAY MUSICAL

American Psycho

Book by Roberto Aguirre-Sacasa

Music and Lyrics by Duncan Sheik

Directed by Rupert Goold

Gerald Schoenfeld Theatre

David Johnson and Jesse Singer for Act 4 Entertainment, Jeffrey Richards, Will Trice, Greeleaf Productions, Rebecca Gold, John Frost/ Clip Service, Trevor Fetter, Joanna Carson, Gordon Meli Partners, Nora Ariffin, Jam Theatricals, Almeida Theatre, Center Theatre Group, R&D Theatricals, Paula & Stephen Reynolds, and The Schubert Organization, in cooperation with Edward R. Pressman, producers

 

Bright Star

Music, Book and Story by Steve Martin

Music, Lyrics and Story by Edie Brickell

Directed by Walter Bobbie

Cort Theatre

Joey Parnes, Sue Wagner, John Johnson, Zebulon LLC, Jay Alix & Una Jackman, Len Blavatnik, James L. Nederlander, Carson & Joseph Gleberman, Balboa Park Productions, The Shubert Organization, Jamie deRoy/Catherine Adler/Cricket Jiranek; in association with Rodger Hess, A.C. Orange International, Broadway Across America, Sally Jacobs & Warren Baker, Diana DiMenna, Exeter Capital, Agnes Gund, True Loves Productions and The Old Globe, producers

 

Dear Evan Hansen

Book by Steven Levenson

Music and Lyrics by Benj Pasek and Justin Paul

Directed by Michael Greif

Second Stage Theatre

Carole Rothman, Artistic Director; Casey Reitz, Executive Director; in association with Stacey Mindich Productions

 

Futurity

Music by César Alvarez with The Lisps

Lyrics and Book by César Alvarez

Directed by Sarah Benson

Soho Rep and Ars Nova

Soho Rep: Sarah Benson, Artistic Director; Cynthia Flowers, Executive Director; Ars Nova: Jason Eagan, Founding Artistic Director; Renee Blinkwolt, Managing Director; in association with Carole Shorenstein Hays

 

Hamilton

Book, Music and Lyrics by Lin-Manuel Miranda

Directed by Thomas Kail

Richard Rodgers Theatre

Jeffrey Seller, Sander Jacobs, Jill Furman, and The Public Theater (Oskar Eustis, Artistic Director; Patrick Willingham, Executive Director), producers

 

iOW@

Book by Jenny Schwartz

Music by Todd Almond

Lyrics by Todd Almond and Jenny Schwartz

Directed by Ken Rus Schmoll

Playwrights Horizons

Tim Sanford, Artistic Director; Leslie Marcus, Managing Director; Carol Fishman, General Manager

 

On Your Feet!

Book by Alexander Dinelaris

Featuring Music Produced and Recorded by Emilio Estefan, Gloria Estefan and Miami Sound Machine Directed by Jerry Mitchell

Marquis Theatre

James K. Nederlander, Estefan Enterprises, Inc., Berne Yuman, Roy Furman, Terry Allen Kramer, Catherine Adler, Caiola Productions, REG · Grove, IPN/Albert Nocciolino, Stewart F. Lane/Bonnie Comley, Pittsburgh CLO, Eva Price, Iris Smith, Broadway Across America, Larry Hirschhorn/Double Gemini Productions, Marc David Levine/Burnt Umber Productions, Stella La Rue/Lawrence S. Toppall, producers

 

School of Rock, The Musical

Book by Julian Fellowes

Music by Andrew Lloyd Webber

Lyrics by Glenn Slater

Directed by Laurence Connor

Winter Garden Theatre

Andrew Lloyd Webber, The Really Useful Group, Warner Music Group & Access Industries, The Shubert Organization, and The Nederlander Organization, producers

 

Tuck Everlasting

Book by Claudia Shear and Tim Federle

Music by Chris Miller

Lyrics by Nathan Tysen

Directed by Casey Nicholaw

Broadhurst Theatre

Grove Entertainment, Arlene Scanlan & Michael Jackowitz, Howard & Janet Kagan, Jeffrey A. Sine, Broadway Across America, Samira Nanda, Matthew Blank, Laurie Glodowski/Susan Daniels, Joan Jhett Productions/Gabrielle Hannah & Marcy Feller, Patti Maurer/Bev Tannenbaum/Sunshine Productions/Karen Humphries Sallick, Warner/Chappell Music/Linda G. Scott, Late Life Love Productions/Alexis Fund, Fakston Productions/Kyle Fisher, Jack Thomas/Caduceus Productions, and Barry Brown, producers

 

Waitress

Book by Jessie Nelson

Music and Lyrics by Sara Bareilles

Directed by Diane Paulus

Brooks Atkinson Theatre

Barry and Fran Weissler, Norton and Elayne Herrick, David I. Berley, Independent Presenters Network, A.C. Orange International, Peter May, Michael Roiff, Ken Schur, Marisa Sechrest, Jam Theatricals, 42nd.club/Square I Theatrics, Benjamin Simpson & Joseph Longthorne/Shira Friedman, and American Repertory Theater, producers

 

OUTSTANDING REVIVAL OF A BROADWAY OR OFF-BROADWAY MUSICAL

The Color Purple

Book by Marsha Norman

Music and Lyrics by Brenda Russell, Allee Willis and Stephen Bray

Directed by John Doyle

Bernard B. Jacobs Theatre

Scott Sanders Productions, Roy Furman, Oprah Winfrey, David Babani, Rom Siracusa, Caiola Productions, James Fantaci, Ted Liebowitz, Stephanie P. McClelland, James L. Nederlander, Darren Bagert, Candy Spelling, Adam Zotovich, Eric Falkenstien/Morris Berchard, Just For Laughs Theatricals/Tanya Link Productions, Adam S. Gordon, Jam Theatricals, Kelsey Grammer, Independent Presenters Network, Carol Fineman, Sandy Block, producers

 

Dames at Sea

Book and Lyrics by George Haimsohn and Robin Miller

Music by Jim Wise

Directed by Randy Skinner

Helen Hayes Theatre

Infinity Theatre Company-Anna Roberts Ostroff & Alan Ostroff, Martin Platt and David Elliot, Patricia M. Roberts & Bert C. Roberts, Carl Berg, Louise H. Beard, Julie Boardman/Sarahbeth Grossman, Douglas & Steven Maine/Chris & Dawn Ellis, producers

 

Fiddler on the Roof

Book by Joseph Stein

Music by Jerry Bock

Lyrics by Sheldon Harnick

Directed by Bartlett Sher

Broadway Theatre

Jeffrey Richards, Jam Theatricals, Louise Gund, Jerry Frankel, Broadway Across America, Rebecca Gold, Stephanie P. McClelland, Barbara Freitag & Company/Catherine Schreiber & Company, Greenleaf Productions, Orin Wolf, Patty Baker, Caiola Productions, The Nederlander Organization, Gabrielle Palitz, Kit Seidel, TenTex Partners, Healy Theatricals, Edward M. Kaufman, Soffer/Namoff Entertainment, Clear Channel Spectacolor, Jessica Genick, Willl Trice, producers

 

She Loves Me

Book by Joe Masteroff

Music by Jerry Bock

Lyrics by Sheldon Harnick

Directed by Scott Ellis

Roundabout Theatre Company

Todd Haimes, Artistic Director; Harold Wolpert, Managing Director; Julia C. Levy, Executive Director; Sydney Beers, General Manager

 

Spring Awakening

Book and Lyrics by Steven Sater

Music by Duncan Sheik

Directed by Michael Arden

Brooks Atkinson Theatre

Ken Davenport, Cody Lassen, Hunter Arnold, David J. Kurs and Deaf West Theatre with Carl Daikeler, Sandi Moran, Chockstone Pictures, Caiola Productions, Marguerite Hoffman, H. Richard Hopper, Learytodd Productions, Markoltop Productions, R&D Theatricals, Brian Cromwell Smith, Invisible Wall Productions Monica, Horan Rosenthal, producers

 

NOMINEES FOR THE DISTINGUISHED PERFORMANCE AWARD

One winner is selected from this category.  The recipient can only receive this award once during his or her career.

Nina Arianda, Fool for Love

Annaleigh Ashford, Sylvia

Laura Benanti, She Loves Me

Reed Birney, The Humans

Alex Brightman, School of Rock, The Musical

Danny Burstein, Fiddler on the Roof

Timothée Chalamet, Prodigal Son

Kelley Curran, The Dingdong

Carmen Cusack, Bright Star

Jeff Daniels, Blackbird

Khris Davis, The Royale

Daveed Diggs, Hamilton

Georgia Engel, John

Cynthia Erivo, The Color Purple

Jesse Tyler Ferguson, Fully Committed

Lynda Gravatt, Skeleton Crew

Michael C. Hall, Lazarus

Anne Hathaway, Grounded

Megan Hilty, Noises Off

Jackie Hoffman, Once Upon a Mattress

Jayne Houdyshell, The Humans

Jennifer Hudson, The Color Purple

Marin Ireland, Ironbound

Andrew Keenan-Bolger, Tuck Everlasting

Leslie Kritzer, The Robber Bridegroom

Jessica Lange, Long Day's Journey into Night

Judith Light, Thérèse Raquin

Zachary Levi, She Loves Me

Lin-Manuel Miranda, Hamilton

Jessie Mueller, Waitress

Kristine Nielsen, Hir

Lupita Nyong'o, Eclipsed

Sophie Okonedo, The Crucible

Annette O'Toole, Southern Comfort

Tim Pigott-Smith, King Charles III

Ben Platt, Dear Evan Hansen

Phylicia Rashad, Head of Passes

Sam Rockwell, Fool for Love

Thomas Jay Ryan, 10 Out of 12

Michael Shannon, Long Day's Journey into Night

Jennifer Simard, Disaster!

Lois Smith, Marjorie Prime and John

Mark Strong, A View from the Bridge

Cicely Tyson, The Gin Game

Michael Urie, Shows for Days

Ana Villafañe, On Your Feet!

Benjamin Walker, American Psycho

Nicola Walker, A View from the Bridge

Ben Whishaw, The Crucible

Michelle Williams, Blackbird

 

The Drama League also wishes to acknowledge the previous recipients of the Distinguished Performance Award who appeared in New York productions this season.  As the Award can only be won once in a performer’s lifetime, they are ineligible this season.  Their exemplary work, however, is recognized and applauded.

 

James Earl Jones, The Gin Game

Patti LuPone, Shows For Days

Frank Langella, The Father

Mary-Louise Parker, Heisenberg

Mark Rylance, Nice Fish

Sam Waterston, The Tempest

 

The Drama League previously announced the 2016 Special Recognition Awards Recipients, as follows: Deaf West Theatre (David J. Kurs, Artistic Director), represented on Broadway this season with the lauded revival of Spring Awakening, will receive the Unique Contribution to the Theater Award; Tony®, Grammy®, and Pulitzer Prize winner Sheldon Harnick, currently represented on Broadway with hit revivals of Fiddler on the Roof and She Loves Me, will receive the Distinguished Achievement in Musical Theater Award; and Olivier® Award winner Ivo van Hove, director of this season’s productions of Antigone at BAM, Lazarus at NYTW, and the acclaimed Broadway revivals of A View From the Bridge and The Crucible, will receive The Founders Award for Excellence in Directing.   ?

Distinguished Achievement in Musical Theatre 

Sheldon Harnick

 

 

Unique Contribution to the Theatre

Deaf West Theatre

 

 

Founders Award for Excellence in Directing

Ivo van Hove

 

 

The 82nd Annual Drama League Awards Ceremony and Luncheon includes a nominees cocktail reception, luncheon, and awards presentation and will be held at the Marriott Marquis Times Square in the Broadway Ballroom (1535 Broadway) on Friday, May 20, 2016 beginning at 11:30 am.

 

10086sunset said: "Oh wait, you can't. You were banned for the same behavior.

 

"

I just read this part (didn't bother the first time).  I'm actually a fully active member of GoldDerby. My username is HoraceandPete and Tom knows who I am.

Cute speech.  You talked about paying for me to go back.  That's what I'm most interested in...

 

It seems you want to make trouble.  Well -

I don't understand.

Anyway, WE LOVE YOU, Cindy xoxoxoxoxo

 

Oh Jeez.  I'm all like, "YAS, QUEEN. YAS!"

I can't wait to see her win the Tony.  A CROWNING ACHIEVEMENT in a spectacular career.

*Side Note; DId you know that Whitney Houston's actual favorite actress was Jessica Lange?  Look it up.

Loving the replies!  Hope more of you theatergoers will continue to reply.

Okay, I'm really liking where this is going.

What makes her superior to Lange and Nyong'o?  I'm still sensing more infatuation with the play than the performance itself, i.e. no one's performed this role better. 

Um, okay...

Why?  I'm serious, too.  Not just baiting.  I want you to write to me why you pick Okonedo to the point where you can convince me to vote for her myself. 

When you pick someone FTW (i.e. for the win), you should be able to passionately articulate why you do.

lmfao!

Bastard!

You know I can't break my own rule and reply in GIFs, lol.

Gawdamn meanie!  Reply properly!  (Though I take it you probably haven't been blessed enough to see either performance, so you probably can't really reply with an intelligent answer.)

"It hurts to look at you." xoxo

I also don't want to read any cop-out replies (e.g. I want Lupita to win to honor "Eclipsed"; Well, "Long Day's Journey into Night" is the best American play, so Lange should win," etc. etc.).

I want real, observant replies, i.e. you've seen the work by each actress that we're discussing here.