/

[VoiceAnth22]

Posted: 8/22/07 at 11:38am

Updated On: 8/23/07 at 11:38 AM

[Ivan the Wonderful]

Posted: 8/22/07 at 11:58am

Good for her. I hope she gets her stuff together.

[ahmelie]

Posted: 8/22/07 at 1:19pm

I hope this isn't her just bull****ting for the cameras. It really is sad.

[SNAFU]

Posted: 8/22/07 at 4:00pm

If she was really working the program she wouldn't be promoting the fact that she is in AA. This smells of a publicist's attempt to salvage a career that has ended up on the rocks following the Siren's song of booze, drugs and partying. The REAL test will be 6 months from now when she is back on the streets.

[SueleenGay]

Posted: 8/22/07 at 4:11pm

Not all people who join AA chose to remain "anonymous". Some are proud of it. Some feel that by coming out it will encourage others to seek help. I am not saying she is out of the woods yet, but give her a break.
I don't understand the "snicker" part of this thread title. Anthony do you think it is a joke?

[VoiceAnth22]

Posted: 8/22/07 at 4:24pm

Oh Sueleen I adore Linds!! I'm just glad she didn't put on weight and drown herself in oreo cookies...

As for AA - I do feel that crowing from the rooftops about your problems, NEVER MIND A FRIEND'S PROBLEM, is not the way to go and just plain crass....

but in her case, it would a shame to lose as promising a talent as Linds to drink!

[SNAFU]

Posted: 8/22/07 at 4:27pm

Yes Sueleen, some do. AA says that it is through attraction rather then promotion. A scheduled photoshoot for a glossy publication just weeks after entering a rehab reeks more of a publicity stunt then a "look how better my life its through AA" wish to be a role model. I mean she really hasn't begun living a sober life yet!

[artscallion]

Posted: 8/22/07 at 4:52pm

"Not all people who join AA chose to remain "anonymous". Some are proud of it. Some feel that by coming out it will encourage others to seek help.

Some people do feel this way. And the program has no such requirement for membership. Though they do discourage it. You can be a member and do whatever you want, including not following the program, as long as you don't drink.

Following the program, however, does include anonymity. The inclusion of anonymity in the program is not out of fear, shame or protection for its individual members. The concept of anonymity is in place in order that the public actions of people claiming to be in AA do not taint the public's view of the program.

In other words, say Miss Lohan tromps around claiming she is a proud recovered member of AA. The world rejoices and more mediocre movies are made. Then Lyndsay who may, or may not, be doing a good job with her AA stuff, falls back off the wagon....repeatedly.

Some poor schmuck in Peebucket, RI with his own alcohol problems sees Lyndsay, or his dad, or a neighbor go through this and thinks, "gee, I guess AA doesn't really work.' Poor schmuck never tries it and never recovers. End of story.

This is the sole, and important, reason for anonymity. So that AA's reputation might not suffer any damage and thus prevent even one poor slob from going to them for help. Lindsay's coming out as an alcoholic who is in recovery can be a good example and could encourage others to seek help. But she should leave the association with AA out of the public equation.

Updated On: 8/22/07 at 04:52 PM

[SueleenGay]

Posted: 8/22/07 at 5:02pm

I can see that point, artscallion, but it kind of suggests that AA isn't all that sure it DOES work. People relapse all the time. AA doesn't say that you won't fall off the wagon, but by encouraging people to remain in the closet it still levies the stigma that alcoholism is something to be ashamed of because you CAN control it, when I feel they should be saying, yes, there are times when you will fall, but you can't let that stop you.

Do I think Lindsay is "cured?" No. Do I think this is a publicity stunt? Perhaps. But I do think that she should be given the opportunity to get though this rough time without people making fun of her while she is figuring things out because that is just going to make it that much harder for her to live a clean life.

[SNAFU]

Posted: 8/22/07 at 5:36pm

I agree with you Suelee she should be left alone, but she should also be more concerned with her health and getting sober then working a deal for a spread in a magazine! Seems she herself is drawing the fire.

[SueleenGay]

Posted: 8/22/07 at 5:38pm

True, but a girl's got to eat.

[artscallion]

Posted: 8/22/07 at 6:17pm

Sueleen,

You make a good point. It would seem that way. As it is, only 5% of the people who join AA stay sober for more than a year. AA believes these people make it because they've followed the very specific, unchanging program that worked for the founders of AA.

Part of the nature of AA is that it will never change its views on things related to its program. The theory is that AA is, in fact, sure that it works...if you follow it. And with that certainty comes the certainty that variation from "what works" is a big risk. For most alcoholics risk=death, insanity or jail.

This, obviously leaves the other 95% who do not, for various reasons, follow that unchanging, specific program. They either aren't ready/desperate enough to do what the program asks them to do. Or they do it half-way. Or they are still in denial and do some compromised version of the program that they think suits them better, etc.

AA, as a group, spends an awful lot of time listening to this 95% telling them why AA needs to adjust here or change there, or drop the anonymity part, etc. Part of how they work is through the example that the 5% set in following the program as it is laid out, hoping this will move a few of the 95% over.

So AA has kind of dug its heels in and says, "you can do it our way or your way. We don't care. But we aren't changing our way because you think it might work better. We already know this way works and we're clinging to it. If you want to go start your own program, we'll root for ya."

So, in essence, AA is sure that it does work. But they're also sure that most people who join don't actually follow the program. So AA doesn't want all those failures reflecting on them, when it was really the people who failed, not the program. I hope I was clear. It's kind of hard to explain.

Updated On: 8/22/07 at 06:17 PM

[VoiceAnth22]

Posted: 8/22/07 at 6:28pm

My ony real concern is that she does not get fat as she recovers.

[SueleenGay]

Posted: 8/22/07 at 6:29pm

That is a pretty shocking percentage of failure. They sound more like a cult. What sort of program would look at those stats and think, "Yep, it's all their fault they can't stay sober, not OURS. It works for 5% of the people who walk through the door so we must be doing SOMETHING right."
It is institutions like these that don't want to look at new and alternative ways for treatment that make people want to stay away.
But if it works for some, that is great. It is easy to criticize them, but they do do a lot of good.

[artscallion]

Posted: 8/22/07 at 6:55pm

I don't disagree with you, Sueleen. I'm, more than anything, trying to express what they, as a group, think. Though I don't speak for them, obviously, and have my own opinions that are probably closer to yours.

I think they cling to their beliefs partially because, even with those shocking statistics, there isn't any other program that has nearly the success rate.

[don logan]

Posted: 8/23/07 at 1:34am

I look at it like this: if i join the gym, but don't go and work out, I won't lose weight. Same with therapy or AA. If I don't do the work I don't get better. Does the gym "not work" because I haven't lost the weight? I'm a member of the gym, right?