Teachers: Lesson Plan Forms- Page 3

[kate2]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 12:54am

I wish I could skip the rest of college and go right to teaching! I LOVE reading all the stories about students that everyone posts... pretty soon I'll be adding my own! As for the appropriate student-teacher relationship, it's important for students to be comfortable with their teacher. School shouldn't be a place where students feel they need to keep a permanent, impenetrable guard up; it's a place to grow and learn. How can students learn if they don't trust their teacher? One of my high school teachers is now one of my good friends and she has absolutely helped me grow as a person. A relationship between a student and teacher should be comfortable, but definitely not physical or intimate in any way. There's absolutely nothing wrong with a harmless hug though.
Updated On: 12/5/08 at 12:54 AM

[orangeskittles]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 1:57am

While I don't agree with all of Joe's sentiment, I have to say that if a teacher hates their job, they should quit. If I hate my desk job, I take it out on the dozen people in my office. If you hate your job (and the administration, the school system, the government...), you take it out on young, impressionable children. I had too many bad, miserable teachers, who intentionally or not, took out their general discontent on students. A single outburst on a bad day leaves more of an impact than any number of "teachable moments". I can think of maybe 10 teachers out of 80 who behaved in a way that made us believe they truly loved to teach and wanted us to learn and succeed. That is pathetic.


In Europe and Asia they test kids and if they are not "smart" enough they go to trade school or lower tier schools.

My uncle (a teacher for 35 years and still the school favorite) thinks those options should be promoted more here. No Child Left Behind wants every child to be good enough for Harvard, but not every child is good enough for Harvard and not every child should go to Harvard. You (and America as a whole) shouldn't look at trade schools as the "dumb" option. No matter how much time and attention is devoted to teaching to their individual levels, maybe they just want to be a mechanic because they love cars, or be a chef, or make pottery. Why waste time and resources forcing them into SAT prep and AP classes to meet some quota when schools could provide options for instruction that will actually benefit their own paths in life?

Updated On: 12/5/08 at 01:57 AM

[SonofMammaMiaSam]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 7:36am

NCLB at its core, is about assuring that kids can read, write and do basic math and that they aren't left behind. It's not about college prep. Do any of you look at and use the statistics for your classroon, grade, school, district? They are a useful tool to help individualize instruction for your kids who are falling behind. How do you propose to measure success without testing and accountability? Updated On: 12/5/08 at 07:36 AM

[singingwendy]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 7:45am

It depends on the state. Under the current NLCB each state can set the levels for "proficiency". Pennsylvania has decided that proficient means college ready and has declared that all children will be college ready by 2014. ALL children. Even the ones in life skills, multiple disability, and various special education classes.

One of the biggest NLCB issues we're having in our district is finding a way to motivate the high school students when they take their big state exam...the one that ranks the school for NLCB. The test has no impact on their grade or graduation status so the kids don't care, and just draw patterns on the answer sheets. The result is you have kids who are in top level math and english courses who are now forced to do remediations in these subjects.

I have no problem with setting standards of achievement. I think it's a fabulous idea. But there also needs to be some common sense used during the process.

[jasonf]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 7:56am

But Wendy, common sense is EXACTLY what's lacking - as is common knowledge. Any idiot who looks at what NCLB is cannot POSSIBLY in reality think that it can work. And yet, here we are, facing the reality of that situation.

And orangeskittles - you've completely missed the point of these posts. The reason teachers are on here posting is because we have to hold all this stuff inside during the day so that it DOESN'T affect the kids. I don't think I'm stepping on anyone's toes by saying every teacher on here got into the job BECAUSE they love working with the kids. Even now, into my seventh year at this job, my tenth overall teaching (good God!), I STILL love working with the kids. However, our jobs are no longer about just serving the kids AS IT SHOULD BE. We have far too many other hoops that we need to jump through and restrictions that are placed on us that actually PREVENT us from doing the job we want to and should be doing. Since we don't let the kids in on that frustration as much as possible, we turn elsewhere to vent it. It's not a matter of hating the job, it's hating the extra BS we're being told is "necessary" when those of us on the front lines know full well most of it is just to cover the ass of people higher on the food chain.

[StockardFan]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 8:00am

Well said, Jason!

[nmartin]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 8:33am

"NCLB is about assuring that kids can read, write and do basic math, it's not about college prep."

Wrong!!

Edit: By the way you have a run-on sentence.
Updated On: 12/5/08 at 08:33 AM

[violet72]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 8:37am

Exactly Jason

Also there is nothing with a Trade school. I think it is great that a student finds their niche in life. What my whole comment was about is that people always compare us to other countries when it comes to education and you can't. They do things different then us so how can you compare.

Also there are burnt out teachers that should retire, but then there are teachers who are awesome who have had their hands tied due to restrictions and mandates. For example everyday in a 1st grade classroom they have reading 8:45 to 10:30(state mandated), then writing 10:30 to 11:30(state mandated), then lunch, then math 12:45 to 1:50(state mandated) then they have special(gym,computers,music,art,library) or they can teach social studies or science. The day is so jammed pack you can't do the little things that students love, remember these kids are 6 years old. They are only allowed 1 or 2 field trips a year.

Also NCLB is a joke, you can't compare two classes(this years 3rd grade to last years third grade) and in NJ the annual year progress is up to the 90%...so 90% of the class have to pass the state test and score in the 90 percentile or above, this includes special needs students

Saying this I love my job, I love teaching, I wish I was able to teach more and not stick to a manual and let these kids get life experience. To me teaching is not just facts and figures, we should be teaching these students how to learn not memorize facts and figures

[jasonf]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 8:38am

From what I can gather, NCLB is strictly about accountability for districts - it has nothing to do with actual learning. There has been a definite trend of less informed, less intelligent, less capable kids through the years, and I have little doubt that it's due to a shift from giving the kids the tools to learn how to fish to forcing the stinky fish down their throats for them.

[Dollypop]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 9:20am

What ever happened to vocational schools?

[nmartin]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 9:37am

Dolly, those have gone the way of all things. God forbid if someone learned to repair cars.

[SonofMammaMiaSam]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 9:43am

There are county vocational schools in each of the 21 counties in New Jersey, some with multiple campuses. There are three in my county in Pennsylvania. They are very alive and well.

[violet72]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 10:24am

We have a vocational school in my county. Some of the kids go to their district high school for the morning and take core classes such as English and math. In the afternoon they go to the Vocational schools. Or some opt to just go there full time and take their core classes there. If I am not mistaken they are also judged with NCLB. Also I teach ESL and in NJ if a child has been in America more then a year they have to take the standardize test in English. Even though by year 2 I am just getting them to speak and somewhat read in English. They are allowed double the time limit(basically to struggle with it). Also I have to administer a standardize test to measure their AYP in my program(and the percentile of passing goes up 5 pts each year, this year 90% of my students must get an 88% in order to pass).

I am not saying that standardize tests are horrible and shouldn't be used. I think we should have the same standardize test for each state and the same guidelines, standards, and goals for each state. Also there should be a universal teacher test to get your teaching certificate. That way if I wanted to teach in say NY I wouldn't have to take another test(which are expensive, my OPTI test for ESL cost $300 and all I did was talk on the phone in English to some guy for 20 minutes)) or take more classes.

OK I will get off my soap box now

[singingwendy]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 11:34am

It is a shame that the attitude that "you're not truly educated unless you go to college" has permeated our society. I can't tell you how many professors I've talked to who tell stories of having to "dumb down" their curriculum, because students are being admitted to college who really shouldn't be there.

And I agree that our attitude toward vocations and trades needs to change too. My favorite example of this is a man who attends my church. He's a contractor with his own business, but never went to college. He was interested in pursuing one of the lay ministry programs offered through the Lutheran church, but was told that in order to participate he needed a bachelor's degree.

[nmartin]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 11:38am

"There are county vocational schools in each of the 21 counties in New Jersey, some with multiple campuses. There are three in my county in Pennsylvania. They are very alive and well."

Not where I teach. They may be in New Jersey, but I haven't seen one in ten years.

"It is a shame that the attitude that "you're not truly educated unless you go to college" has permeated our society."

I totally agree!

[SweetQintheLights]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 8:44pm

"Also there should be a universal teacher test to get your teaching certificate."

I absolutely agree. I am getting my degree in Florida. I specifically moved to Florida to go to college because I have a learning disability and there is a college program which has helped me through my college years.

I don't know for sure if I want to teach in Florida or move back to PA where my family lives. But, I've been looking into it and if I move back to PA to teach, I need to take 5 tests to teach there. I am a horrible test taker. If I have my teaching degree, what are 5 tests going to show? And, there is a big possibility that I may not pass them- not because I don't know the information but because I am horrible at taking tests.

[caitiesus1522]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 9:14pm

I wish our country would give more funding to trade schools. My county in Ohio had a GREAT one...and teamed up with the county community college to continue the programs so the students could get an associates. I think it is a GREAT option for students that want to do it. It also encourages people to go further.

My best friend's boyfriend went ot the vocational school for welding, continued it at the community college and saw that he could get a mechanical engineering degree with two more years of college. He has a full time job where he wants to work once he has his degree in engineering and loves it. If it wasn't for the program at the vocational school, he never would have found out that he wanted to be an engineer.

And vocational schools train people who get GREAT jobs doing what they love.

[singingwendy]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 9:20pm

Sweet Q--

Have you researched whether or not Florida and Pennsylvania have reciprocal certification? I went to school in NY and no one ever told us we could apply for certification in different states at the same time. However, once you had your NY certificate, there were several states that would grant you a certificate because you held a certificate in another state. I applied for, and was granted primary certification in PA, NJ, CT and MD based on my NY certificate.

[SweetQintheLights]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 9:23pm

singingwendy-

I called both PA and NJ department of education and unfortunately, both require the same 5 tests to teach in either one of those states.

They don't make things simple.

[singingwendy]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 10:11pm

I do know that each state is slightly different. It was either CT or Mass that didn't use the NTE praxis tests, and had their own certification tests (at least back when I was looking...) And I know that...again..at that time...NJ didn't require as many of the tests as PA and NY did.

Oh well....sorry that doesn't help. Just thought that might be an easier solution.

[SweetQintheLights]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 10:12pm

wendy, I wish it was such an easy solution. Thanks for trying to help though; I appreciate it!

[adamgreer]

Posted: 12/5/08 at 10:25pm

Exactly what tests do you have to take?

I was initially certified in the state of Indiana (because I got my master's degree at Notre Dame), and when I moved back to NJ to teach, all I had to do was pass the Praxis II for the subject area I was teaching in. I ended up taking multiple praxis II exams and I'm now certified in three subjects, plus elementary K-5, so I guess I've technically taken 4 tests, but could have been certified with as little as one.

[orangeskittles]

Posted: 12/6/08 at 12:02am

But, I've been looking into it and if I move back to PA to teach, I need to take 5 tests to teach there. I am a horrible test taker.
Considering students are all required to pass tests to prove themselves proficient in a subject, I don't think it's too much to ask that teachers prove themselves in a similar manner. Are you planning to never give tests to your students? I mean, some of them may be bad test takers too- it wouldn't be fair to hold them to standards that you won't hold yourself to.

And orangeskittles - you've completely missed the point of these posts.
And Jason, you completely missed the point of mine. If every teacher got into the job because they love teaching, then why are there so many ineffective teachers out there? Even the nasty, bitter, tenured teachers who hate kids were once just as eager and optimistic as any other new teacher. I don't think any teacher sets out to end up snapping one day and telling at a student he's stupid, or haranguing a class all period over a minor incident, or even just filling their curriculum with pointless busy work that doesn't teach anything new, but that's where the vast majority end up.

So yeah, maybe 100% of the people here love teaching now, but how long before the NCLB BS gets to the point where it starts to encroach on your perception of the career? If you haven't even graduated and you're already ranting about it on message boards, you should rethink your plans before it's too late.

[SweetQintheLights]

Posted: 12/6/08 at 12:20am

"But, I've been looking into it and if I move back to PA to teach, I need to take 5 tests to teach there. I am a horrible test taker.


Considering students are all required to pass tests to prove themselves proficient in a subject, I don't think it's too much to ask that teachers prove themselves in a similar manner. Are you planning to never give tests to your students? I mean, some of them may be bad test takers too- it wouldn't be fair to hold them to standards that you won't hold yourself to."


I have taken all the required test throughout my years. I've taken the tests to prove that I am "proficient" in particular areas. And, I have passed the tests and will be receiving my bachelors degree. I was held up to test-taking standards which I performed because I needed to so I could get my degree. I am not expecting anything less of the children I will be teaching. After I have done what has been required, there is no reason to take more tests in another state to teach. I have taken all the classes and received the credits to have a teaching degree. Unless there is a whole different curriculum I'd be teaching with a bunch of new information I've never learned, that would be a different story. But, as far as I'm concerned (and have researched), they are the same types of tests that I have taken and passed here in Florida.

Updated On: 12/6/08 at 12:20 AM

[LizzieCurry]

Posted: 12/6/08 at 12:46am

I don't think I've ever agreed more with orangeskittles. Bravo to you.