VT Gunman's Family issues statement- Page 2

[AbbaRabbit]

Posted: 4/21/07 at 6:20pm

well greek, that's the thing about opinions. they dont have to be right for you to go around sounding off about them, luckily for you and unfortunatly for us.

you even made a point to tell us that you are "not even an american" but you seem to love that whole free speech thing.
glad you can enjoy such a right while being so close minded.

[amasis]

Posted: 4/21/07 at 6:51pm

"...I have so much sympathy for the innocent victims families', that I can not spare much for the family this monster was bred, raised and got his values from !"

Compassion can can be limitless. It's an option you have. It is possible to have "so much sympathy" for the innocent victim's families and still extend the same to the killer's family. It doesn't cost you anything to do it.

In many cultures, family play a big part on how a kid turns out to be. Mine included. But even in those cases it's just so much more complicated than that. Have your parents never been stumped, wondering about certain choices you've made they don't approve of and feeling helpless or maybe even angry and confused about having very little control over them? I know mine have. I know my sister has occasionally felt the same in regards to her kids. It's just never so simple.

[Greekmusicalfan]

Posted: 4/21/07 at 7:34pm

Tiff, the daughter was evidently a healthy, balanced person, while the killer was a troubled unstabled individual. There must have been signs, all I am saying is that someone should have noticed !

Abba, I never thought that you thought of me as closed-minded ! It's the first time I've been caled that. So, in order to be open minded, I should agree with you or lie about my feelings? Ok, I'll keep that in mind.
And on a side note, Yes, I love America and everytime something happens there I hurt ! But sweetie, FREE SPEECH is NOT an American exclusivity, you know. Actually, if I am not mistaken, it started right here in my country, along with democracy, a little while back, let's say hmmmm, about 3,000 years ago ???
And I NEVER judged anyone about feeling sorry for the family, I always respect everyone's opinions, I just stated MINE. You attack me for my point of view, how very open minded of you !

Updated On: 4/21/07 at 07:34 PM

[AbbaRabbit]

Posted: 4/21/07 at 11:11pm

that's cute.
so if someone says that gays should not be allowed to marry, and i disagree, than i'm being close minded for chalenging their opinion?
you blamed his family, i'd say that's pretty close minded. you specifically said that you dont have any compassion for his family beacuse "He was their offspring and he had their DNA, they ARE a bit responsible" and "that I can not spare much for the family this monster was bred, raised and got his values from"

you can teach someone good values and they can still go out and do something like this... you just said it yourself that cho was obviously troubled... how can you blame a mental illness on someone's upbringing?

and i never thought of you as close minded untill you started with this crap.

[AnnaK<3LMIP]

Posted: 4/21/07 at 11:53pm

My culture is all about family too. But my Dad is all about supporting Bush and I am all about not supporting him. See, I have my Daddy's DNA and yet he didn't pass on all of his morals to me. You know it's not just the WAY people were raised, it's WHERE they were raised and in what conditions as well. Obviously, my dad went through SO much more than I could ever imagine, so he has his own personal reasons for having his opinions, while I grow up in a country where I'm allowed to laugh at Jon Stewart jokes. My uncles are all close-minded, completely and utterly religious people, and if you don't agree with them, they yell. My dad is not like that at all. He was raised right next to them. A person's demeanor is not a reflection on their family at all times. In some cases, I completely agree, it is. I'm all about giving my family and friends hugs like 24/7 because my mom hugged my 24/7 when I was a girl. But by all means, the shooter was a very unstable grown-up. Only HE had the power to take his actions into his own hands. If he was surrounded by family that didn't do well for him, his sister was able to take that and prosper regardless. I always always disagree with this idea that how you were born and what you were born into is what you become. This is not a Charles Dickens novel. That's all I'm saying.

No one is trying to gang up on you, greek. I know it seems that way, and I'm sorry to give you that impression. But do you understand where we're coming from too?

[Type_A_Tiff]

Posted: 4/22/07 at 12:44am

Greek, the parents perhaps should have seen the signs (although retrospect is always 20/20, the darned thing) but I just don't agree with your argument "that I can not spare much for the family this monster was bred, raised and got his values from". This has nothing to do with the family's lack of values, which is why I pointed out that the rest of the family turned out seemingly healthy and well. Perhaps there were signals the parents should have noticed, but I as far as I can tell, they were hardly the Manson family.

[ashley0139]

Posted: 4/22/07 at 1:36am

In this particular case, weren't there a LOT of signs? I mean, wasn't he thrown out of classes and no professors would take him? I am hardly blaming the parents, and, of course, hindsight is 20/20. But there are signs in hindsight and then there are SIGNS. From what I've heard, he was obviously messed up way before this happened, even from an outsider's view. I am honestly curious, and still of course have many sympathies for ALL families affected by this.

[Type_A_Tiff]

Posted: 4/22/07 at 1:40am

Ashley, I buy THAT argument for sure. I'm curious about how things were for him in elementary and high school. I figure since he lived in a dorm during his college years, his parents may not have been aware of his daily going-ons, but should've noticed his behavior and problems at school while he was living under their roof.

[AnnaK<3LMIP]

Posted: 4/22/07 at 1:41am

Yeah, ashley, I think he even threatened girls he stalked, and the police had to intervene at one point and he was even hospitilized for a night. Which goes back to what I was saying way before when there just wasn't enough HELP for him. I'm sure people saw signs, and I'm sure people tried to help. His fate was in his own hands (and sadly, the fate of many others), and I am a firm believer in changing your own future, but there are certain precautions that should have been taken with him. Hell, I know of a kid who was asked to leave his college just for a temporary amount of time so he could sort out his depression. I've heard that this is actually quite common for mentally instable students in universities that show obvious signs of their instability. I think the signs were there, according to all of this leaked out in the media, but there's only so much other people knew about him. He didn't have a lot of friends, so the only people who probably knew about his problems were his family, but even THEY were not around and had no control over him. It's a nasty cycle of helplessness, is what it is, and that's the saddest part about this because it doesn't have to be that way.

[AbbaRabbit]

Posted: 4/22/07 at 1:44am

from what i understand there were some warning signs that something was up, but what parent looks at their child and thinks "he's going to kill 32 people if we dont do something"?

i did read in an article that he was hospitalized the previous year, so it's not like his parents were compleatly ignoring the situation.

[AnnaK<3LMIP]

Posted: 4/22/07 at 1:47am

EXACTLY AbbaRabbit.

[Greekmusicalfan]

Posted: 4/22/07 at 9:12am

I'd really like to put this argument to rest, because I hate fighting with people, especially with people I like, like AbbaR

I never said that I don't feel ANY compassion about his family ! I just said that maybe, MAYBE, they could have done something about it and prevent it. I already said that there was absolutely no way to imagine he'd do something like that ! Maybe my view is clouded, because the tragig death of so many innocent young people seems incomprehensible to me ! Had he survived, I'd like to see him torn from limb to limb, I don't care how cruel that sounds ! When I see his picture and videos on TV I shout " May you rot in hell, crazy bastard" ! Some people may say " Poor kid, noone loved you " I am not one of them. And I hate that he brings this awful sentiments in me, because generally I am very liberal, but I can't lie ! But I am Greek and we are very sentimental, sometimes clouding logic and political correctness !

I understand where everyone is coming from ! That's why in all my posts, I NEVER judged anyone else's opinion about the subject, I just stated mine ! I am really sorry if most people don't agree, but please respect them, as I do everyone else's.

And I do HOPE that his family can find peace and comfort, but I PRAY for the victims' families !

Updated On: 4/22/07 at 09:12 AM

[DG]

Posted: 4/22/07 at 9:34am

"I just said that maybe, MAYBE, they could have done something about it and prevent it."

On what are you basing the opinion that they didn't?

[iflitifloat]

Posted: 4/22/07 at 10:19am

Sometimes the last people to know something are the parents, because the individual goes to the greatest lengths to hide "the truth" from them.

Add a cultural component where there may be a more codified interaction between parent and child...honor for the elder, for instance...and this phenomenon is compounded.

Think about how many openly gay persons are still not out to their immediate families...and that's not even remotely similar to having homicidal tendencies, rage, or a fascination with guns.
The guy clearly had issues with interpersonal relationships, especially with women. He shared little to nothing of himself with others. The parents, in this case, would have been the last people to whom he would have mentioned his weaknesses or creepier tendencies.

He is also 23 years old. Not a minor. My understanding is that he was voluntarily hospitalized. You cannot disclose medical information to anyone without the consent of the individual. His parents may not have known about it at all.

That, and what AbbaRabbit said.

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 4/22/07 at 10:39am

They need to have some way of individuals that have problems such as he did not being allowed to buy guns.

Unfortunately, due to some privacy laws, much of the information about how sick he was was not known & could not be made known to relevant parties. There needs to be a total revamping of gun laws. Hopefully, this tragedy will bring about real reform instead of having another blue ribbon panel looking into it & accomplishing nothing

Updated On: 4/22/07 at 10:39 AM

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 4/22/07 at 10:46am

"Hopefully, this tragedy will bring about real reform ..."

Change begins at home. One small step would be for you to stop tacitly endorsing the kind of candidates who stymie reform of this type. What else might you do to encourage this kind of reform, Mr. Roxy?