What does "Democrat"/"Republican" mean to you?- Page 3

[Taryn]

Posted: 9/25/04 at 11:58pm

https://www.canufly.net/~leonf/politics/rep-dem.html

I sure love things that make fun of both sides. *considers herself an Independent*

[bwaysinger]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:03am

Taryn, hun, you can consider yourself an independent but you'd better damn well look closely at the policies of our Republican President and our soon-to-be Democratic President and cast your vote accordingly. One of the two will be affecting your life for four more years.

[Mattio98]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:04am

And one of the candidates has the potential to set this nation back decades. That candidate (before Papa or Gotham can interject) is Bush.

[Gothampc]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:05am

Taryn, I thought that website was funny.

[LadyGuenevere]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:06am

In response to Zola-

Take my words, twist them, and call them my ideology.

I really did agree with what welfare meant to do...when it began. Turned into a twisting, corrupt thing, with people standing in line to collect drug money. I'm paying for people to get drugs and alchohol. That really makes me feel better for what I've done for the world.

If we must have welfare (which we do need, unfortunately), they should be smaller, private organizations where these things can be MONITORED. While there is a large percentage of people who need it, there are a large percentage of people who become dependent on welfare money. I would agree if the programs were more private. How many people run around and check how people are spending the money that they get?

Like the U.N., a nice idea- at first.

The people who pay most of the tax money are the people in the upper bracket. These are also the people who have the potential to create companies and hire workers. Even the people who look like they did not deserve to get paid that amount of money (pop stars, baseball players), branch out into different things- fashion, music, movies, and each self-owned company is run by PEOPLE. People who need work.

When you put tax money from the rich into corrupt programs, you're taxing capital.

Anyway, I'm just babbling- here's a site that has a couple of good points about the system - http://www.cato.org/testimony/ct-ta3-9.html.

It is morally good to give money to the poor, is it necessary to 'punish' the rich for happening to have more money? If we earn the money, and the amount that we earn is usually controlled, why should we have to be told who to give it to as well?

Updated On: 9/26/04 at 12:06 AM

[bwaysinger]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:06am

Potential, Mattio? He's already set us back to the stone ages in our standing with other once-friendly countries, he's taken us much farther than Reagan ever dreamed of in our national debt, and the Civil Rights movement might as well have never started.

[Mattio98]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:07am

Good point Bwaysinger.

[bwaysinger]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:10am

"I'm paying for people to get drugs and alochol. That really makes me feel better for what I've done for the world."

LG, dear, one can only wonder if you got this belief from Sean Hannity or Bill O'Lie-elly.
You have no proof that the entire welfare system is flawed...and god help me but I hate the typical Republican response of "privatize it!" When there's a problem with a government program, the typical Republican response is to let a bunch of rich, white Republicans make money off of it.

[Taryn]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:12am

Unfortunately, I won't have that capability until the 2008 election. My eighteenth birthday doesn't fall until next June. :P

[bwaysinger]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:13am

I was going to just edit my above message but I want to make sure everyone reads this. I have a GREAT idea about how to test out the Republican mantra of privatizing every government program...let's privatize Bush's little "kill anyone who's not Christian" agenda. Let's put Halliburton and Bechtel in complete charge of the war on Iraq...err, Terror, and let them foot the bill for the mess over there. Let's see how it works.

[Mattio98]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:14am

Sounds good to me!!!

[LadyGuenevere]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:21am

"LG, dear, one can only wonder if you got this belief from Sean Hannity or Bill O'Lie-elly."

Actually, to be honest, I don't remember them talking about welfare... I formed my "I hate Robin Hood mentality" opinions myself. And I have seen and read different reports about it. None by said above! Sorry for proving that one wrong.

"When there's a problem with a government program, the typical Republican response is to let a bunch of rich, white Republicans make money off of it."

Why would I want a private welfare system to be run by all Republicans? I love how you assume that every Republican thinks that way (unfortunately I sometimes do that with Democrats too...ugh). Privatizing it will help people who truly NEED welfare, and maybe it might encourage them to get a JOB. Which is what is the cure for welfare.

What irks me is you think that I ripped off all my opinions off of Sean Hannity or O'Reilly. I have my own mind to think, you know. But of course I have to learn to expect cheap shots from liberals.

I also just realized today that a number of years ago, I might have been a Democrat. I just die reading about how worse and politically correct they have gotten over the years.

EDIT: And how about I get some proof that the welfare system is NOT majorly flawed?
Updated On: 9/26/04 at 12:21 AM

[bwaysinger]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:34am

So now you're going to ask me for proof that the welfare system is majorly flawed when you can offer nothing to confirm your assertion that your money is going to pay for drugs?

Again, privatizing government programs is going to help one particular set of people: rich, white corporate CEOs.
We live in a day and age when more and more power and money is residing in fewer and fewer corporations in America, where the average salary of a CEO has risen well over 100% while they're downsizing left and right and the average salary of the "little" man has gone down or, at best, fails to keep up with inflation.
I see nothing in the privatization of welfare that would suddenly make Joe, or, let's be honest with what you really think, Rosheka the drug addict with 8 illegitimate children finally realize she needs to get a job.

And I'll tell you what. When you can spout off something that doesn't sound like it came from the Republican spin machine that is Fox News, I'll take your word for it.

As for proof that the welfare system isn't majorly flawed, I offer none to you yet. However, let's see what our wonderful president was doing this last four years to help fix it?
What's that you say? Nothing? Oh, right. He was too busy making sure Iraqis get it. Oh, wait, unemployment is over 50% there in this wonderful country where Democracy is an exciting and new (read: dangerous and costly to us but ultimately profitable to CEO heads) place and we must let it grow slowly.
And expensively.
And continue to siphon off money from all those government programs that are so terribly flawed to continue financing Shrub's little Crusade to rid the world of anyone who isn't just like him.
By just like him, I mean evil.

[LadyGuenevere]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:41am

"So now you're going to ask me for proof that the welfare system is majorly flawed when you can offer nothing to confirm your assertion that your money is going to pay for drugs?"

I have seen reports done on news shows (not fox news), and I have read different reports. While the links are not here in this laptop (and certainly not committed to memory), here are a couple I just looked up this second:

http://www.agrm.org/welfare/reform.html
http://www.fff.org/freedom/0197c.asp

And the rest of your message is liberal spin (except the unemployment numbers, which I am not too thrilled with either), so I guess we cancel each other out, don't we? Updated On: 9/26/04 at 12:41 AM

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:47am

Being a Christian does not equal being anti-gay or anti-gay marriage. There are many Christians who support gay marriage. There are many gay Christians.

And, yet, I am constantly amazed to find theatre people who are anti-gay because of the particular church you go to. You should know better. You can always choose a different church or to even ignore that aspect of your own church. But they don't.

So, why would you love theatre and want to be a member of this very gay community if you are anti-gay? It doesn't make any sense.

[LadyGuenevere]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:50am

JRB, does loving theater have to go hand in hand with not being anti-gay rights?

I DO support it, but I just don't understand your reasoning. Are you telling people that if they do not agree with gay rights, they can't sit in a theater and enjoy a performance?

[Mattio98]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:51am

Or better yet, why would you want to live in a country that preaches tolerance when all you want to do is condemn?

[Gothampc]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:51am

jrb, you need to rethink you post. It doesn't make sense on so many levels.

The Bible speaks out against homosexuality. You're not a Christian if you are for it.

Why would a person choose a religion and ignore aspects of it?

Just becuase a person likes theater, doesn't mean they support the gay lifestyle.

Updated On: 9/26/04 at 12:51 AM

[iflitifloat]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:52am

I want to scream when I hear the line about how people should just go out and get jobs. That's not the answer when the jobs for which many are qualified don't pay a livable wage or supply health insurance. Complicate the situation by adding on the need for transportation and childcare, and many people can't afford to work. The elements that go into creating an underprivileged class are multidimensional.. they don't just happen overnight.

Are there some people who misuse welfare? Absolutely. Just as there are wealthy who misuse tax breaks and loopholes. That doesn't mean that all welfare recipients are drug addicts or alcoholics. Just as everyone rich isn't necessarily a right wing creep.

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:54am

My post asks why someone like gotham would want to be here with all of us gays. And how could someone who hates gays be such a huge lover of theatre--written, directed, performed, designed, teched, ushered and about, etc. a large number of queers?

I am also thinking specifically of people I majored in theatre with who are now Christians and anti-gay all of a sudden. They know better. They could have chosen to be a part of gay friendly Christianity.

[LadyGuenevere]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:55am

"I want to scream when I hear the line about how people should just go out and get jobs."

I KNOW that it isn't that easy. But did you read the letter on one of the links that I posted? Before, I had learned that a healthy percentage of people stay on welfare for about 4-5 years. And that one says eight?! No really, that's too much.

Privatizing the institution will provide more personalized help for people, and if they have that kind of attention, it wouldn't be so corrupt anymore. (Well, 'shouldn't.') Updated On: 9/26/04 at 12:55 AM

[Mattio98]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:57am

"Privatizing the institution will provide more personalized help for people, and if they have that kind of attention, it wouldn't be so corrupt anymore."

I hope that the private welfare institution will turn out as warm and fuzzy as the insurance companies.

[LadyGuenevere]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:58am

It's not going to be perfect, but really, a big institution covering 50 states...a bit harder to regulate and personalize, don't you think?

[Gothampc]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 12:58am

Before, I had learned that a healthy percentage of people stay on welfare for about 4-5 years.

Yeah, really. You can only stay on unemployment for 6 months before they kick you off. And that's people who have had jobs and just had a bit of misfortune.

[LadyGuenevere]

Posted: 9/26/04 at 1:00am

I'm confused- restate the facts, Gotham?

I may have heard wrong, I just don't...understand exactly what you are saying.

And if you are saying that people who are on unemployment for more than 6 months don't get welfare money anymore...the reports I have seen of people who have lived for years without working and get money...