"I often wonder if the genius of Hal Prince was more about his collaborations with Michael Bennett and Boris Aronson."
I've often wondered the same thing, but not about my revered Hal Prince, but about my revered Michael Bennett. I'm not denying that Bennett was a genius, but nothing he ever did topped what he did with Prince (and Aronson). Each show's material got succesively weaker and he was left with little to do each successive time. And yes, I wholeheartedly admit that I am not a fan of Chorus Line's score (and some of its book...the staging is another matter) and I loathe Dreamgirls' score. He never topped Follies. I think some of us will agree with me. Oh, but if he had lived longer than he did! His death was one of the great tragedies of the theatre.
WOSQ I really appreciate your explanation--I find all that fascinating--what people think is the line between opera and musicals. I have to admit, when I started getting into opera (later than musicals--and later than Sondheim, etc) I was kinda shocked at how very little actually happened in these LONG LONG pieces. It's key moments and that's about it (though by that definition Sweeney wouldn't really be an opera)
I adore Passion, so will ignore your problems with it :P but I do get what he meant by a rhapsody--it just kinda unfolds in front of you and to me one thing I love about it is how inevitable each moment seems (if that makes any sense). But certainly something like Sunday doesn't fit this description though it does seem that when Prince/Sondheim broke up, Sondheim also lost some of his love for those "big Broadway razzmatazz" type shows (to put it poorly). Not just the fact that dance became basically a nonexistant elemnent--but the major Prince/Sondheim shows for all their intellectualism still always had these BIG Broadway moments (particularly, not surprisingly, the shows done with Bennett)--so they in a sense had the best of both worlds. I wouldn't wish a world with no Sunday, Passion or even ITWoods (my least fave of the Lapine shows) by any means, but it was a shift (of course this happened just as BIG splashy Broadway shows were getting less dance oriented too thanks to the UK megamusicals post Cats).
ramble ramble--sorry I find this kinda discussion fascinating and could just go on and on...
Taking a look at Harold Prince's pre-directorial days there is TENDERLOIN(1960) which he co-produced with Robert E. Griffith and which flopped after 216 performances, receiving 2 favorable and 5 unfavorable reviews. Everyone was anticipating a hit with TENDERLOIN which was directed by George Abbott, choreographed by Joe Layton, with a score by Jerry Bock and Sheldon Harnick. The book was written by George Abbott and Jerome Weidman. The star was the well known English actor Maurice Evans. To quote the critic Robert Coleman, "Robert Griffith and Harold Prince have been leading the song-and-dance circuit with five straight hits: THE PAJAMA GAME(1954), DAMN YANKEES(1955), NEW GIRL IN TOWN(1957), WEST SIDE STORY(1957), and FIORELLO(1959), but they finally struck out."
I saw TENDERLOIN in the fall of 1960 and was very unimpressed. To put it bluntly, it was a big bore with one supposed hit song, "Artificial Flowers".
I never really think of the pre Cabaret shows as more than learning experiences--though I know everyone but me seems to be in love with She Loves Me (I *like* it I swear. I like it a lot :P ) But Baker's Street in particular sounds like it was an interesting experience (especially with all of Merrick's publicity stunts). Prince's staging of It's Superman did get some good press--and didn't no less than Sondheim apparantly find it hysterical? (there's some anecdote about him roaring with laughter at every joke in the theatre)
Remember Prince could not pull off Whistle Down the Wind, his version had a try out in Washington, think it was the Kennedy Centre and was all set for Broadway (Al Hirshfeld Theatre), then got inexplicable pulled.
jv92 I find your comments fascinating (as usual :P )and would love to hear more. Did you see Follies? Even without having seen it I probably agree with you that it was Bennett's crowning achievement--but then you say he never did anything comparable afterwards--do you think Prince did? It is fascinating to me how the two worked on Follies, who did what, Bennett's love of the material yet uncomfortableness with elements and wanting to hire Neil Simon, etc (in one Bennett bio it states at one point Bennett suggested to Sondheim that he turn it into a through composed opera). It was inevitable I suppose, but too bad that Hal Prince still got more of the actual acclaim (and to this day i think more people think of Follies as a Hal Prince directed production).
I know it's futile arguing about what basically is opinion, but I feel I have to stand up for Bennett's later shows. While I do like Chorus Line's score (but wouldn't rate it with the Sondheim shows he worked on), I've always been a bit cold towards the musical. I'd seen bootlegs of it, read books on it, I'm a huge dance fan with a big background in it, so I appreciated all these elements but I think I did buy into the idea that it was overated, Chicago (not to mention PO) shoulda won the awards, bla bla.
Then I saw the tour of Bennett's production just a few weeks back (I keep meaning to do a post, though I've posted some thoughts in various Chorus Line threads). Even having seen videos of the production I really wasn't prepared for what a fantastic piece it is--yeah due in large part to Bennett's staging. it really is a case of the whole being greater than the sum of its parts. But I also realized that in many ways the staging doesn't just have elements of stuff he did in earlier shows (notably Company--the montage even quotes directly from Company- -and Follies) It truly takes what worked so well in those and grows from it. It's a thrilling, often surrealistic, and utterly visceral staging of a show--I honestly walked out of the theatre believing, briefly anyway, that maybe the slogan of the revival ("THE greatest musical") was absolutely true after all.
I know Prince (and I guess Sondheim) were slow to embrace the show and I do think some of that was unavoidable sourness--afterall Bennett had managed to take nearly everything great he had learned from working with them (though of course much of this was his own natural ability) and put it into a show that was still smart, yet also was an "audience pleaser" in a way their shows weren't--and probably didn't want to be. Still I get why there was resentment there. I do think Prince's oft repeated criticism of Bennett only working in the world of showbiz is a bit unfair (I really wish we had gotten Scandal--not just cuz of how fascinating it sounds but he was working with one of my fave pop composers of the time, Jimmy Webb--who incidentally writes very smartly and with love about Sondheim's work in his book on songwriting).
Anyway, seeing a great production live really has made me re-evaluate ACL, not just as a show, but how it fits with Bennett's earlier shows.
Oh and it took me a long time to have patience with Dreamgirls score but I've somehow grown to really like it. It's a lot smarter than it seems at first, I think--but Bennett's staging and the fluidity of it is awesome to see (I really wish the current tour had recreated it--I would travel to see it) I actually think some of it was an influence on Prince's Phantom staging.
"Remember Prince could not pull off Whistle Down the Wind, his version had a try out in Washington, think it was the Kennedy Centre and was all set for Broadway (Al Hirshfeld Theatre), then got inexplicable pulled."
In one of the new editions of the two books on Prince--I think it;'s A Director's Journey, they talk at some length about Whistle. Interestingly Lloyd Webber himself admits he was partly to blame for what happened (I guess when it ran in DC Webber and Steinman decided they were good with it, Prince wanted further revisions before going to Broadway).
I did find it interesting that at around the same time he was unable to make two shows work, with two of his most successful past collaborators (Whistle with ALW, and Bounce with Sondheim)
Wow I wonder why I was sure it was Merrick. Maybe cuz of all the notorious publicity he caused--didn't he do a parade in the city? And painted up so many billboards, some that remained into the 80s?
That all sounds right. The puppet parade was a highlight apparently. I guess I just assumed the gimmicky publicity sounded like Merrick. (my two Hal Prince books are at home, not here...)
