What constitutes a flop?

[Elphaba]

Posted: 3/12/05 at 9:05am

Something I have always wondered, so I'll throw it out there to all of you...

What constitute a flop? Bad Music, bad acting, weak plot, limited audience appeal, bad reviews?

Example, Dance of the Vampire was, supposedly a total flop in the US, BUT......it has it's following, and in both Austria and Germany it was a smash hit, and is still playing in Germany.

The Civil War is considered a flop, but, the music moves me to realize the pain of that war, when nothing else ever has.

Bombay Dreams was a smash in London, but here only so-so.

Many artists are never "discovered" until they are dead. Can a flop become a hit later in time?

Just Saturday morning musings....

[melissa errico fan]

Posted: 3/12/05 at 9:07am

I usually consider a flop to be a show that didn't do well at the box office. Believe me, I'm a flop addict. If I fall in love with your show, be worried. A closing notice will probably follow very soon.

[riv]

Posted: 3/12/05 at 9:13am

If it's a money loser, it's a flop, whether it's Candide or Kelly.

[Glebb]

Posted: 3/12/05 at 9:14am

I love Pacific Overtures.

Posted: 3/12/05 at 9:18am

There is no formula for a flop (THE PRODUCERS, film or B'Way, offers an illustration). Just as there is no formula for a hit.

Any element, or combination thereof, can be the reason(s) for a show not to find its audience. Sometimes, even timing of the production can make a difference. A flop in at one point in time can be a large success at another. (PORGY AND BESS was considered a flop after it's original Broadway production, to use a broad example) Also, a flop/success in one city can be prove to be the reverse in another city.

It's a crapshoot.

"Luck Be A Lady Tonight," is quite apropos as an unofficial anthem for the theatre.


To answer your question a bit more directly, I'd say that:

to investors - it's a flop if it doesn't return the $$ invested AND profits;
to creators - it's a flop if the artistic vision isn't realized on stage;
to performers - it's a flop if the audience simply isn't there;
to critics - it's a flop if they believe they can do better;
to audiences - it's a flop if there is nothing of interest that compels them to buy a ticket, AND, if they do, they leave the theatre not feeling at satisfied/energized/moved/stimulated, at a minimum, or some combination thereof. Updated On: 3/12/05 at 09:18 AM

[JakeB]

Posted: 3/12/05 at 9:19am

I think of a flop as something that closes before its first booking period ends.

[Elphaba]

Posted: 3/12/05 at 9:34am

well, I must love flops......as Flower Drum Song, Dance of the Vampire, Bombay Dreams...all closed in the US before I could get to them.

Great answer Jose, thanks.......

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 3/12/05 at 9:54am

Critical, Financial or both

[BSoBW2]

Posted: 3/12/05 at 11:14am

Dracula is a perfect example. It cost A BUTT LOAD to produce and ended up making no money and closed 6 months after opening on Broadway.

[Jon]

Posted: 3/12/05 at 11:19am

SUNSET BOULEBVARD ran nearly two years and was a financial flop. When Glenn Close was in it, it was always sold out, but she was making a huge salary, PLUS a precentage of the gross. When she left the show, ticket sales plummeted, fist with Betty Buckley, and even more with Elaine Paige.

[IMsooHyprToday]

Posted: 3/12/05 at 1:53pm

is Flower Drum Song considered a flop?? the revival/rewrite got Multiple extrensions in LA.

[frontrowcentre2]

Posted: 3/13/05 at 1:21am

Variety coined the phrases HIT and FLOP for their season end tally of how ell Broadway shows did financially. (Notice no one cares whether off-Broadway shows are "hits" or "flops.")

Hal Prince's wife Judy once told her husband that a Hit or Flop refers only to the box-office/financial status, and then there are successes and failures in terms of how well regared a show is by its creators, the critics and audiences. A successful show can still be a box office flop.

The final word on this comes from Ethan Mordden: "One, Nothing pays off any more except junk. And, two, It doesn't matter."

[Sumofallthings]

Posted: 3/13/05 at 1:49am

If it starts with "B" and ends in "rooklyn"

[PleaseChangeMe]

Posted: 3/13/05 at 1:53am

Moneywise, a flop is a show that doesn't make a dime, such as Brooklyn. But in some ways, a flop is a show that isn't well made or is just made for money with no creative talent, like Hairspray.

[Sumofallthings]

Posted: 3/13/05 at 1:54am

"Moneywise, a flop is a show that doesn't make a dime, such as Brooklyn. But in some ways, a flop is a show that isn't well made or is just made for money with no creative talent, like Hairspray."


You do realize how much crap you're gonna get about that now don't you?

[Qfan2.0]

Posted: 3/13/05 at 1:57am

the only true way a show can be a flop all the way round is if it doesnt return it's investment. Everything else is just opinion

[Tiny-Toon]

Posted: 3/13/05 at 2:02am

Good Vibrations.