"Wicked" and George W. Bush

[alf]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 9:40pm

Just saw Wicked this afternoon. Idina btw got caught in the trap door in the 2nd to last scene and bruised or broke a couple of ribs. Looks like she'll be leaving a few days early.

Anyway, loved the show as a musical, but at the same time I've never seen anything so anti-W short of Al Franken's "Lying Liars and the Lies They Tell". Now am I crazy, or did I just blow it now by revealing it to the masses?

ALF

[BSoBW2]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 9:41pm

what are you talking about?

[wicked1]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 9:42pm

alf...please explain yourself!?!

[bjivie2]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 9:46pm

Ha, if you were to widdle the script down to the basics, it's that Elphaba is an animal rights activist. I don't know where you got war from that.

[StickToPriest]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 9:47pm

Are you trying to suggest that the Wizard is modeled after Dubya?

[renthead2005z]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 9:47pm

What is going on??
I don't understand the connection.

[Mythus]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 9:48pm

Compare the statements made by The Frogs and Wicked and then tell me which is more anti-Bush.

[ChicagoBwayFan]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 9:48pm

I find it rather pathetic that some people spend every waking minute of their days trying to relate all negative aspects of life to the President.

[StickToPriest]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 9:49pm

No matter what his/her connection is, it is invalid in terms of it being intended, as the novel was written in '96, before W. entered the national politics scene.

Updated On: 1/8/05 at 09:49 PM

[BSoBW2]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 9:58pm

i was just gonna say priest...

but then again, the idea of the book is still there - but there have been other added things in...

well, welcome, Alf!

[broadwaystar2b]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 10:05pm

Forget Frogs and Wicked
Avenue Q baby!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

oh yeah...

[WiCkEd4LyFfE]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 10:06pm

I think what he/she is trying to imply is that the Wizard is supposed to represent Bush (lying to the people etc) but this is totally untrue. The book on which it is based was written before W came into office and Stephen Schwartz and Winnie Holtzman have both been quoted to say that the show is not in any way anti Bush (even though Im sure they both are).

Thats my two cents

[bwayfan3]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 10:19pm

I either read or saw Gregory Maguire say something to the effect of "It's scary when something you write about turns out to be true" with respect to George Dubya. I think however, you have to think about it in broader terms. One of the themes of Wicked is abuse of power and parallels and connections from it can be drawn about a lot of leaders, politicians, not only our fearless "president."

[BSoBW2]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 10:22pm

i wanted kerry to win for ONLY one reason: to hear the new AQ line...

would they say like, George Bush - was only for then...?

Well, I guess Wicked parallel's Michael Moore's Fahrenheit 911 pretty well - unfortunately F911 is pretty inaccurate...

[WhatDoINeedWithLove?]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 10:39pm

It has a lot bigger relation to Nazi Germany then our "WONDERFUL" (haha, totally jk) president

[MissEmilyArden]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 11:02pm

I saw Wicked, The Frogs, and Ave. Q, and even though I really didn't like The Frogs all that much, it did have the most "political" message of the three. Ave. Q only had one line...

[buddhaismymom]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 11:02pm

i know that the book alludes to nazi germany (the Animals arent like us, we're better than they are, they shouldnt hold important jobs, etc) but most of that is lost in the musical which is much more lighthearted. i mean, compare the endings...but whatever i liked them both for very different reasons. i dont, however, see the bush connection (or Fahrenheit 9/11) but if you then go for it.

and speaking of F911... we all know that everything michael moore says has to be taken with a grain of salt. hes very liberal and very biased (and to his credit he admits it) but hes allowed his piece whether you agree with it or not. my dad made me watch this ridiculous documentry called FahrenHype 9/11 (which i watched because, unlike him, i can examine both sides of an issue) and they tried to prove that 9/11 was inaccurate. okay i admit they found some things that were wrong, but mostly they were just spun or creatively edited. anyway they only found about 5 things, and oddly enough none of them related to the centrel message of Fahrenheit 9/11. probably because anyone watching FahrenHype had not seen Fahrenheit andtherefore didnt actually know what it was about and were merely content with the fact that Hype was a film bashing moore. which shows how both documentaries are flawed. Fahrenheit 9/11 didnt open anyones eyes. it gave those against bush more reason to hate him and bush supporters more reason to hate moore. if you supported bush, you werent goingto go see 9/11. its that simple. and although i enjoyed it and have tremendous respect for moore, i think he is an egomaniac and im glad hes out of the oscar race. (super size me deserves it..lol)

but i still would like to know how anyone can see a connection bt wicked and W/Fahrenheit 9/11

[BSoBW2]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 11:08pm

well, Farenhype 911 is actually true - and someone who was VERY VERY VERY involved in the movie spoke at my school...

I think you meant that farenheit was edited in certain ways - very cleverly (word?) i must say...

but i don't feel like arguing - what's done is done, and it's 4 more years...deal with it...

P.S. I don't support either of the candidates necessarily, but i don't beleive in knocking the president when he is trying to get us through a war.....nor do i believe in that being done by LYING to people...

There's a reason the movie is more popular in France and Germany and other European countries... Updated On: 1/8/05 at 11:08 PM

[buddhaismymom]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 11:20pm

"I think you meant that farenheit was edited in certain ways - very cleverly (word?) i must say..."

i did actually..sry my wording was a bit ridiculous.

and i believe you that farenhype is true, it just didnt concentrate on any of the big questions posed in fahrenheit.

and i suppose ill have to deal.

i didnt particularly like either of candidates either. if i was old enough i would have voted kerry simply because he wasnt bush. which isnt the best reason, i know.

i do, however, believe in knocking a president when he is trying to get us through a war we shouldnt have been involved in in the first place.

[bronxboundexpress]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 11:29pm

Did anyone laugh when Idina fell into the stage?

[BSoBW2]

Posted: 1/8/05 at 11:45pm

bronx, it's not even funny as a joke...

"i do, however, believe in knocking a president when he is trying to get us through a war we shouldnt have been involved in in the first place."

Forgetting about the war being a good or bad choice, i think that once we were involved in it, we should do what we could to get through it...

Posted: 1/8/05 at 11:55pm

I certainly thought there were some contemporary references in Wicked-- Which I could see as referring to George Bush (or at least the current political climate). When the Wizard says that the best way to bring people together is to give them a good enemy (which is not in the book) was the one to spring to my mind.

Personally I don't see it! Wicked tells the story of a ruler who had no legitimate claim to his post until he was able to solidify his position because of terrorist attacks by a wily and elusive enemy. Nothing like the US at all!

Of course, reading things into an old text is nothing new to this story. The Wizard of Oz is constantly re-interpreted as a political allergory, or as the story of the oppression of the Native American and the colonization of the West, to mention but two.

[Chip1012]

Posted: 1/9/05 at 12:14am

I'm pretty sure "I'm an unelected official" refers to Bush. Thats why it gets a big laugh every night.

[bronxboundexpress]

Posted: 1/9/05 at 12:22am

I can't remember how this trap door thing works but my question is: Could you actually SEE the fall or was something in the way? Is it when she's behind the curtain? Did ANYONE get this on tape? Was there even one small laugh from anywhere in the theatre. Sorry, not trying to be mean but moments like there are so rare I like to know details.

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 1/9/05 at 12:35am

It shouldn't be a surprise that the themes in Wicked are universal---Shrubya isn't the first idiot leader. He's not the first to lie to the people. He's not the first to take his people to war for greed and corrupt reasons. He's not the first to try to make certain citizens second class.

Oh--and while Moore may have edited 5 things (out of an entire FILM!) to get the answer he desired, not ONE thing is false. He had the film fact checked and double fact checked before releasing it.