Butters, go buy World of Warcraft, install it on your computer, and join the online sensation before we all murder you.
--Cartman: South Park
ATTENTION FANS: I will be played by James Barbour in the upcoming musical, "BroadwayWorld: The Musical."
Is this thread a joke? Did anyone really think there was anything good about that turkey? It was one of the worst things I've seen in a decade. Dull, witless, a poor adaptation of the novel, and above all, an amateurish score that was an obvious imitation of Les Miz.
Not an opinion shared by all. It was so bad they had a one night concert in England that they spent tons of money to preserve. Yeah, a really rotten score.
I agree with Mr Roxy. Even most of the reviews seem to like the adaptation of the story and that Jill was able to put as much material from the novel into a 2hr 30 min show, so not sure where you're going there.
Yes, I am a fan of the show, but it truly is a beautiful recording! Not sure if you actually saw the show, but I was very moved when I saw it, much better than plenty of the shows being produced today...
Yup, saw the show. Only read the Times review, because that's the only one that may affect a show's success or failure (although it doesn't always). I don't remember it saying anything positive, but if you feel like pulling quotes, feel free.
The other reviewers' opinions, although perhaps interesting to read if you don't have anything else to do, are meaningless. I know how to analyze what I see myself. Most reviewers (Feingold excepted) have never achieved anything in a creative field, so why their opinion matters more than our own is baffling. Saying Kuchwara liked something doesn't mean it was good. (The reverse is obviously true as well.)
Glad you liked it; my opinion (based on experience you don't know, so no need for you to approve or disapprove) is that the show was a poorly-crafted mediocrity. Poorly-crafted mediocrity is often what sells best. This time, it didn't. No one was having it, and so it quickly vanished. And it didn't vanish quickly like a critical success (like SIDE SHOW); it was widely panned by reviewers (as I recall) and audiences.
Addendum - I look askance at qualitative evaluations from someone who uses a Wonderland poster as avatar - that show made Tale look like My Fair Lady. Unbearable torture in the theatre. Please don't take it personally, perhaps you use the picture ironically.
I say good for them! I love playing this CD on my iPod. Great performances, GORGEOUS orchestrations played with gusto by an amazing orchestra. And Jill's score has certainly grown on me!
Butters, go buy World of Warcraft, install it on your computer, and join the online sensation before we all murder you.
--Cartman: South Park
ATTENTION FANS: I will be played by James Barbour in the upcoming musical, "BroadwayWorld: The Musical."
Everyone has their own opinion. I happened to love this show. The orchestrations were quite good, and James Barbour could sing the phone book and it'd be beautiful. Tale should have been executed better, but I was very moved by the show. As for the performances, can you honestly say Toro, Barbour, Burkhart, Lazar did a poor job? I believe this was one of the most talented casts I have ever seen. These actors made the show, and they deserved a longer run. Great show... Sorry not all agree with me!
While I agree the reviews were general pans, there were plenty of nice ones. "Impossible not to be moved" from USA Today, etc.
I think it's also important to understand that Tale opened as soon as the recession started; Something like SideShow opened with a good economy. Ticket prices are also much higher nowadays. There are several "excuses" why Tale didn't have a longer run, but oh well you probably would fight each one. I will say I thought the direction was horrible, for the most part. Some scenes worked VERY well, but too many were imitation or flat.
I still tell people that it's one of the best casts I've ever seen: Barbour, Burkhardt, Toro, Earley, Edelman, Wyman, Lazar, even McGrath's small part, were all terriffic performances, and if not even that, all incredible Stage talents. I also think there were many fantastic songs - "The Way It Ought to Be," "Reflection," "I Can't Recall," "If Dreams Came True," and especially "Out of Sight, Out of Mind." Unfortunately too many songs ("Until Tomorrow" and "Let Her Be a Child" (I like both anyway)") drew comparisons to Les Mis, and the direction especially of "Until Tomorrow" was laughable.
Re; WONDERLAND - It's a work in progress, no need for shots for that. Wonderland hasn't even been declared for Broadway...it was a world premiere of a new musical. If they announced Broadway for the way it is, I'd agree with you. I very much enjoyed Wonderland, it's book is a disaster in the making, but it's not horrible either. The picture's not ironic, and while you say don't take it personally, I don't see what Tale has to do with WONDERLAND considering they're very different pieces, especially looking at the score / source materials / etc.
I also just want to note (& keep on topic) - I wish that "Without a Word" had been more up-tempo-y like it is on the concept recording. Same goes for "Never Say Goodbye," I feel like they make the songs drag until that final note.
Philly, I have to respectfully disagree. I found "Never say goodbye" to be beautiful. I wouldn't change that song at all. In fact, I found it to be stronger than "Without a word." However, I do agree with the "Until Tomorrow" comparison. It was overshadowed by Les Miserable, and it shouldn't have been. James Barbour should have been nominated for a Tony, but that is just my opinion.
PS... LOVED WONDERLAND TOO! The production at Alley was very good, but the story line? Needs work!
I really really like "Never Say Goodbye," but I like hearing it from the DVD better than the CD. I agree, Barbour at the least should have been nominated for a Tony (Over Spencer for Next to normal). The set design remains one of my favourites of all time. That was the only part of direction that was used innovatively (The opening/beginning of The Way It Ought to Be, and especially Out of Sight, Out of Mind!). I used to think Toro deserved a nomination, but I suppose her part is rather small even for featured part. Still she was wonderful.
WONDERLAND was very good for what it was. I agree that they need to change a bulk of the storyline (I don't see why they don't keep to what the original little bit was with Chloe getting kidnapped instead of her running away), but I also think there's too many types of songs. A lot of character introduction songs, and then there's two 11 o'clock number songs ("Once More I Can See" and "Finding Wonderland") which is another issue...both are too good to cut, but both deserve to be the final song, or OMICS needs to be a reaction of...something!
Oh and with "Without a Word," I feel like it shows Lucie more like a heroine for the story. "Never Say Goodbye" is more of a sappy sad love song. I wonder if they will try to put both in for the next major production of the show..."Without a Word" could easily be the Act 1 finale or even open Act 2 and put "Never Say Goodbye" after the trial!
I think "Never say goodbye" is a more memorable song which was a major problem with the original production. Many critics claimed it to have no memorable songs, but I do believe "Never say goodbye" fits the bill. I disagree! I found "I can't recall" and "Out of sight, out of mind" to be very memorable, but I am biased. As for putting both in, I doubt it. That just seems like overkill even though I would love it! I hope they bring this show back somehow. It truly wasn't given a chance. One of the best shows I have ever seen.
I have to say that I thought "Once More I can see" fit well in the first act. However, if they have to cut one, this is clearly that one. "Finding Wonderland" is too good for cutting. My favorite song was actually "My own invention." I loved that number. I also enjoyed "Misunderstood" and "Love Begins." I think the beginning needs alot of work. "The worst day of my life" and "Advice from a caterpillar" needs some major work. Those numbers didn't cut it for me, but it got better as we went along. I hope they can fix the glitches and make it to Broadway one day.
I think "Without a Word" (one of my favourites) adds more to Lucie's character than "Never Say Goodbye," (as a huge Frank & Brandi fan, obviously loved it) but again, they both have different messages. I actually find it very memorable, but I think the reason why critics found the score having no memorable songs was because it's mostly ballads, and ensemble songs that sound that the same.
There are several regional productions happening this year! I believe one is going on right now in Chicago! Also aren't their talks for either a production tour or concert tour? Who knows!
I actually think "Once More I Can See" is stronger (clearly we differ!), if based off lyrics. I think both will give a chills feel at the end of each, but some of "Finding Wonderland"'s rhymes are horrible - how many times can you end a verse in 'an'd to rhyme it with Wonderland!? But I agree I still love the song. I wonder if they've ever thought of putting "Finding Wonderland" (with major lyric tweaks, through a reprise in before "Once More I Can See" as the finale) as the Act I finale and opening Act II with "Through the Looking Glass." I just get a weird vision of Alice singing OMICS as her next book or to her family....!
I agree 100% about your first statement. "Without a word" definitely shows Lucie's true character, but I still believe "Never say goodbye" would be more marketable. I think that is why Jill put it into the concert version and left "Without a word" as a bonus. However, I love both songs, so it wouldn't matter to me! I hope we see a regional production! THAT WOULD BE AMAZING!
I loved both "Once more I can see" and "Finding Wonderland." I just think that "Once more I can see" fits better into the first act as compared to "Finding wonderland." I don't see "Finding Wonderland" fitting in the first act. However, I do agree that they should both remain in the show. This show could really make some noise if they story was much clearer. The songs are quite memorable, and I loved the set. I hope they can make a run at Broadway one day.
I honestly think that Without a Word is so much better than Never Say Goodbye. and so much more memorable. I love Wildhorn stuff, and this is a good song but the feeling of it doesn't quite fit the other songs that are in the show. Yes, Without a Word shows Lucie's character and that is a huge part of why it belongs there. Plus, hearing Brandi singing the last note of that song live is bone chilling.
<--- the set of A Midsummer Night's Dream that I was assistant stage manager for during the 2007 season at the STNJ outdoor stage.
-Dre-
You must remember all the same that at the crux of every game is knowing when it's time to leave the table... And it's important to be artful in your exit. No turning back, you must accept the con is done... It was a ball, it was a blast. And it's a shame it couldn't last. But every chapter has to end, you must agree. ~Dirty Rotten Scoundrels~
There's a special kind of people known as show people. We live in a world full of dreams. Sometimes we're not too certain what's false and what's real. But we're seldom in doubt about what we feel. ~Curtains~
It is a far, far better thing I do, than I have ever done; it is a far, far better rest I go to, than I have ever known. ~A Tale of Two Cities ~
Exactly Dre2387...Not to say "Never Say Goodbye" doesn't fit the same bill, but again, I really think "WIthout a Word" makes Lucie a heroine, not a just the typical Cosette-like love interest. I still think "Without a Word" is perhaps misplaced in that I don't understand why Lucie questions after his trial why he left "without a word,"... it makes more sense she'd at that point be thinking that she won't see him again.
I think the final notes of "Never Say Goodbye" is more memorable, but overall "Without a Word" is more memorable.
I'm still baffled as to why the producers or whoever (who knows maybe Jill!?) requested Frank to write a song for it, but I assume he wrote it way before the concert. Wouldn't be surprised if he had intentions of writing a Tale musical in the past!
For those who mentioned wanting to see a regional production Jedlicka Performing Arts Center in Cicero, Il (just outside Chicago) is currently performing the first regional production! Opened last weekend and performs Friday Sat Sun this weekend (30th through May 2nd) and then Friday and Saturday May 7th and 8th)
jpactheatre.com
(p.s. I'm in it. :))
and all that I could do because of you was talk of love...
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