IRENA'S VOW Reviews- Page 5

[MiracleElixir]

Posted: 4/1/09 at 1:56pm

"Perhaps this is another example of needing to let a piece challenge your way of thinking instead of wanting it to affirm your way of thinking. I think that line is haunting and succinct in explaining such a delicate matter in a simple way.

In general, I think it wouldn't be frowned upon for me to pass on the sentiment at the Walter Kerr Theatre--despite some negative reviews, this company believes in the piece. The producers stand firmly behind it. Audience responses have been tremendously positive--standing ovations every night as I understand it."


I have no doubt everything in your second paragraph is true. I don't think anyone doubts the company's/producers's sincerity, and while I think the play itself is remarkably mediocre, I don't think those who like it are misguided or wrong. Although, not to say anyone's opinion is right or wrong, but it's not exactly surprising that people choosing to go see a Holocaust play (even one with poor reviews) will give a standing ovation to a true story of courage and survival. I still don't think standing ovations and the company's sincerity lessens or invalidates the vast criticisms/complaints of the show's detractors.

However, I do find your insistence that those who weren't receptive to the show simply wouldn't let the piece "challenge your way of thinking" more than a bit condescending. I personally don't have any issue with that line of dialogue in particular, but perhaps some people simply felt the production was trite, manipulative and/or heavy-handed -- I don't think their opinions can be presumptiously explained away by saying they "wanted to show to affirm their way of thinking rather than being challenged."

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 4/1/09 at 2:47pm

I was being VERY specific referring only to that line. Please don't put words in my mouth.

Too often, somethings strikes us as odd in a show. And most of the time, I find that instead of trying to wrap our minds around why or how that something was, people automatically jump to it being wrong. It must be wrong--that doesn't compute with how they see things.

And this is a possible example. She really did say that. Those are her actual words. Thus, I'd argue it's in no way anything but honest and accurate to include it as she said it. You think it's an odd thing to say? Oh well. She really said it. Get it?

As for whether or not the standings Os are genuine, I know firsthand that so many people have been genuinely moved by this production. Don't presume to downplay or discredit that response as their merely honoring a Holocaust piece as if these people would cheer ANY Holocaust piece.

I stood and watched a Holocaust survivor from Auschwitz give unbelievable praise to Ms. Feldshuh last night at the stage door.

If I had to choose between the seal of approval of him & Ms. Smith's and others (I'll just say "others"), I'd have to go with the former. Just my feeling on the subject.

As for people having the right to dislike the production or the play, I have no problem with that. (Even if I did--GOD FORBID I deny any of you your precious opinions and the chance to wax eloquent about them ad nauseum lol)

Updated On: 4/1/09 at 02:47 PM

[MiracleElixir]

Posted: 4/1/09 at 2:55pm

"As for whether or not the standings Os are genuine, I know firsthand that so many people have been genuinely moved by this production. Don't presume to downplay or discredit that response as their merely honoring a Holocaust piece as if these people would cheer ANY Holocaust piece."

Yeah, once again, like I said, I believe the standing Os are genuine, and people are being genuinely moved by this show. However, let's not assume it's all of them -- I know all too well (and I'm sure you do) being "forced" to stand due to pressure of being the only one not standing. Also, I don't think they would cheer ANY Holocaust piece, but certainly anyone labeled "inspiring" or carrying a "message" like this one does. Seriously, some Holocaust dramas are great and some are awful, but every single one, I hear raves of "Excellent" from the same people. I believe people genuinely love this show, I just think they love it due to it being hammered into their head that this is a true/important/moving story, and they MUST be inspired by it.

[MiracleElixir]

Posted: 4/1/09 at 2:55pm

"As for whether or not the standings Os are genuine, I know firsthand that so many people have been genuinely moved by this production. Don't presume to downplay or discredit that response as their merely honoring a Holocaust piece as if these people would cheer ANY Holocaust piece."

Yeah, once again, like I said, I believe the standing Os are genuine, and people are being genuinely moved by this show. However, let's not assume it's all of them -- I know all too well (and I'm sure you do) being "forced" to stand due to pressure of being the only one not standing. Also, I don't think they would cheer ANY Holocaust piece, but certainly anyone labeled "inspiring" or carrying a "message" like this one does. Seriously, some Holocaust dramas are great and some are awful, but every single one, I hear raves of "Excellent" from the same people. I believe people genuinely love this show, I just think they love it due to it being hammered into their head that this is a true/important/moving story, and they MUST be inspired by it.

[WhizzerMarvin]

Posted: 4/1/09 at 3:24pm

So do you think the only reason I love this show and was very affected by it was because I was manipulated into it? Do you think my mind was too weak and caught up in the "true story" aspect of it that I couldn't separate my emotions from my critical analysis of the show?

You know I'm not trying to attack you, just trying to see if you think someone can like the show based on the merits of the play and acting.

[MiracleElixir]

Posted: 4/1/09 at 4:14pm

"So do you think the only reason I love this show and was very affected by it was because I was manipulated into it? Do you think my mind was too weak and caught up in the "true story" aspect of it that I couldn't separate my emotions from my critical analysis of the show?"


Yes to the first question. I personally feel the show is very manipulative, and that's a fault of the show, not anyone who liked it. By reason of logic, I think if someone feels strongly about the show in the way that you did, it's because the show emotionally manipulated them. That's not a weakness of character or diminishing of anyone's enjoyment.

To the second part, don't get ridiculous, of course I don't think your mind is weak. But in my opinion, I think the only explanation for strong enthusiasm for this show is either (a) falling prey to the 'true story' element, or (b) falling for its emotional manipulation.

Look, you and your friend(s) even say what you loved about this show was that it was so moving and powerful and you were "blown away," etc. That, by definition, is an emotional reaction, and not, as you say, "critical analysis." Which isn't to say it's a bad thing. There's certainly nothing wrong with having an emotional reaction to something as opposed to a cold, objective, critical one. I was just giving what I see as the reasons this show has found some ardent supporters.

Please don't parse my words and try to turn this into a personal matter like your friend, WithoutATrace, would do.

[chiguy]

Posted: 4/1/09 at 6:24pm

i don't think anyone has any qualms with the incredible story and courage that is the life of irena.

but an incredible story is an incredible story, just as a poorly constructed play is still a poorly constructed play. if the lines that don't work in the play are actual quotes that's great to know. but if for some, they detract from the depth of the story and the experience of the play then i don't see how anyone can argue with an opinion.

disregarding a person's point-of-view as "wrong" and saying you "despise" someone for stating theirs gets into some very dangerous territory. seems like there was a movement about 70 years ago that horrifyingly dismissed people and their beliefs as wrong also. let's show a little respect.

p.s. before you fire off those angry responses, no i'm NOT comparing the holocaust to a silly message board. just making a point, that's all!!!

[April Saul]

Posted: 4/1/09 at 9:19pm

It seems like the crux of it is this: Miracle and ChiGuy, you don't have to like this show because it's about the Holocaust, or because Irena's daughter has explained a direct quote of her mother's that's in the script. But you also can't presume to tell those of us who like it that we're merely being manipulated; that would be presumptuous, insulting, and just as wrong as if we painted you insensitive or even anti-Semitic for NOT liking it. Are we all right now?