Making It On Broadway - th truth?- Page 8

[capnkidd]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 12:51am

ok,bluewizard,
just reread the entire thread(and boy,does my head hurt)-my original post simply thanked the guy for reminding me about the book title.If you hadn't come in w/the shill accusations,it would then likely have died a pretty quick death.My major objection was if any are allowed to shill,all should be allowed to shill-openly,secretly,stupidly,rudely-where do you draw the line?It's an open forum..
It's also worth pointing out that not only did ny2004 not start the thread,he didn't even post until a day after the first post.
Having said that,I certainly understand why you would harbor leftover anger-nyc2004 treated you badly-I never said he wasn't a pompous & condescending & apologise that I didn't make it clear that he was included when I said I didn't understand the hostility on the board.It really doesn't sound like that great(and "groundbreaking")a book,but I do want to read it..
I just wish you didn't let him bother you so much...you sound like a nice person... Updated On: 12/2/04 at 12:51 AM

[NYC20042]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 9:29am

Relax BlueLizard -

I rarely post about anything. However, I read the book (which was recommended), found it so important, and wanted to contribute to a discussion. Hence, someone recommended this chat board. That's the entire story.

When you read a book, love it, and find people like yourself completely missing the boat, it requires a response. Sometimes several.

This book is important. It can save kids from becoming like yourself - Sad and angry.

peace.

[broadwayguy2]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 9:36am

I agree NYC2004, it is FAR better to have a realistic view of what can and does happen in this business so that it doesn't beat you over the head when you start working. Besises, it helps you appreciate the GOOD stuff even more.

[NYC20042]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 9:39am

Thanks Broadwayguy2. Thats all that needs to be said.

And that's why I think this book is so good.

There simply are not any other books out there which provide such a realistic view.

Updated On: 12/2/04 at 09:39 AM

[broadwayguy2]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 9:43am

so you have said

I think a LOT of the problem is the audience DOES only see the 'glamour' part. That is what they have shoved down their throat 24/7 every day, all of their lives. They see this buisness as so glamorous. You can contradict that all you want, but because it challenges what they have seen their entire life, it doesn't sit well with them and they may HEAR it and say "yes, that might have happened to so and so", but they don't neccessarily ACCEPT that and still look at those 'bad events' as a rare fluke.

[NYC20042]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 11:05am

That's exactly right. Each story is representative of thousands more. It is a reality many are too afraid to accept.

[broadwayguy2]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 11:12am

exactly. and like I said.. regardless if EVERY "that bad" or not, you HAVE to be prepared for the worse case scenario.

maybe you have to be an actor to fully appreciate this book........

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 11:15am

Broadwayguy2, exactly how long have you been trying to make it as an actor in New York? You really think you have a better perspective than I, someone who worked in the biz for over a decade and has many friends still in it? Like I said earlier, it's hard just to live in New York. Anything you add on top of that to make it even more difficult is just that. If you want it badly enough, you take the bad with the good. Just like every other profession out there.

This book is not "groundbreaking." It is not lifting a so-called gag order on actors. Anyone who is shocked by most of the revelations in that book wouldn't be reading it in the first place.

[broadwayguy2]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 11:18am

Rath, I'm not saying I have a better perspective than you.... I am saying that working actors have a better perspective of it than teenagers who criticize this book as negative (BlueWizard for example).

Like Is aid... it's best to know the worse case scenario before get into it.

[NYC20042]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 11:21am

BroadwayGuy2 -

I completely agree.

Broadway actors love it, appreciate it, and understand it. Just look at the 150+ contributors, Jason Alexander, and countless others who have endorsed it, including theater professions at Yale, UCLA, NYU, and elsewhere.

Groopies, Broadway-clinger-on'ers, and other such shady characters have problems with it - even some teenagers who have wrapped their whole identity and life purpose in "Making It" on Broadway and becoming a star...

Kinda interesting, huh. Updated On: 12/2/04 at 11:21 AM

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 11:22am

I'll send you my resume, NYC20042, then you'll see what kind of "shady character" I'm not. Shilling is one thing, attacking people's integrity on a message board at the same time is another.

[NYC20042]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 11:25am

Please re-read the message and pay attention to detail. I never called you a "shady character."

You called yourself one.

Go figure.

peace.

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 11:27am

Oh sorry. Groupie or Broadway clinger-on then? Whichever. How long have you worked in the biz? What exactly have you done? I want to know what qualifies you to be so all-knowing. Are you Chita Rivera? Nathan Lane? Jerry Orbach?

[broadwayguy2]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 11:31am

why would nathan Lane be better able to speak to working in the business than XX chorus dancer?? They both work in NYC theatre.....

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 11:34am

He wouldn't be. I'm just talking about years of experience. Not level of stardom.

Perhaps NYC20042 has been a dancer for many years and hasn't achieved the breakout role he desires. I don't know. I just wonder why he has such a strong agenda and can't even discuss anything that doesn't agree with everything in that book 150%. I have a friend who's quoted in that book and even she doesn't agree with everything in the book 100%, and she's worked on Broadway for over 25 years. Everyone is going to have different experiences and we should be able to discuss them. Otherwise, why bother coming on a message board?

[broadwayguy2]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 11:38am

differing opinions is fine, but I think that the book is fantastic because if you really want to make it as a working actor, you BETTER be prepared for the worst case scenarios....

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 11:40am

That's fine. I get that. But you're not attacking me for my opinions. He is. Along with BlueWizard, Plum, and anyone else who dares to bring up a questionable view.

[NYC20042]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 12:17pm

Come on now - there is nothing wrong with healthy debate.

And no one is saying you should agree with 100% of the book. What you should do, however, is respect the performers who have opened up their personal lives and shared them with us.

These stories are real, as are the people who experienced them.

[popcultureboy]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 12:22pm

Come on now - there is nothing wrong with healthy debate

How the hell would you know? You don't engage in it on this thread, that's for sure.

[NYC20042]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 12:31pm

yada yada yada

[capnkidd]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 12:33pm

I think bluewizard was wrong-ny2004 isn't a shill-rather an anti-shill.If you're trying to get someone to come round to your point of view,you don't insult,mock(blue LIZARD?),or talk to them as though they're idiots.
I'll defend your right to shill(even to voice obnoxious opinions),but I'm w/popcultureboy here-you're not engaging in a healthy discussion...

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 12:36pm

Good point, capn. In fact, had I not already read the book, NYC's relentless attacks of everyone here would have kept me from buying it. Who wants to patronize a product shilled by such a person?

Updated On: 12/2/04 at 12:36 PM

[capnkidd]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 12:41pm

I hear ya,rathnait-ny2004 is actually doing a disservice to the authors/book.Still really don't think he's affiliated w/them-he's just found a hot topic & is enjoying pushing people's buttons.

[popcultureboy]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 12:50pm

NYC, what a FABULOUS comeback, your wit is just genius.

[BlueWizard]

Posted: 12/2/04 at 12:57pm

I think bluewizard was wrong-ny2004 isn't a shill-rather an anti-shill

Actually, I just want to clarify that my problem with NYC2004 is less about shilling and more about the rudeness and disrespect for others he's shown on the board - shilling just seemed like a reason for him attacking negative views of the book. For example, his latest post towards me:
It can save kids from becoming like yourself - Sad and angry.
How's that for a personal attack?

you're trying to get someone to come round to your point of view,you don't insult,mock(blue LIZARD?)

I actually think "Blue Lizard" is rather cute! Although my lizard ain't blue...

Updated On: 12/2/04 at 12:57 PM