#51
Posted: 5/24/05 at 2:57pm
Good catch, I forgot "consenting." Also, I said OVER the age of 17, meaning 18 years or older.
Bitter Republicans Bitching About Defeat — Page 3
#52
Posted: 5/24/05 at 2:59pm
Actually in New Hampshire girls can be marriage as early as 13:
New Hampshire: A female between the age of 13 and 17 years and a male between the age of 14 and 17 years can be married only with the permission of their parent (guardian) and a waiver. A female below the age of 13 and a male below the age of 14 are not allowed to marry under any conditions. If both parties are nonresidents of NH and are below the age of 18 they cannot be married in NH under any conditions.
New Hampshire: A female between the age of 13 and 17 years and a male between the age of 14 and 17 years can be married only with the permission of their parent (guardian) and a waiver. A female below the age of 13 and a male below the age of 14 are not allowed to marry under any conditions. If both parties are nonresidents of NH and are below the age of 18 they cannot be married in NH under any conditions.
#53
Posted: 5/24/05 at 3:01pm
Here's a charming "conservative" response to Andrew Sullivan's calling the compromise "sane." Does the tone of voice sound familiar?
===
Re: The Deal. You confirmed for me what I already knew - it's a raw one for the GOP. The very fact that a bigot like yourself likes it proves to me that Republicans got screwed. AND you got what you really wanted - pIss off the right-wing base in hopes of depressing 2006 turnout so you can gain seats and secularize American culture.
This is far from over. Bush is not going to nominate O'Connor for Chief Justice - get a clue! She will probably retire soon anyway. Scalia for Chief Justice and someone of like mind to succeed him on the Court. You know it, I know it and the left knows it. At that point, the GOP will have to pull the trigger and morons like Lindsey Graham will vote their constituents' interest or be bludgeoned to political death in the next primary. Conservatives still hold the cards Andrew. Don't go wetting your "sane" self just yet."
===
Re: The Deal. You confirmed for me what I already knew - it's a raw one for the GOP. The very fact that a bigot like yourself likes it proves to me that Republicans got screwed. AND you got what you really wanted - pIss off the right-wing base in hopes of depressing 2006 turnout so you can gain seats and secularize American culture.
This is far from over. Bush is not going to nominate O'Connor for Chief Justice - get a clue! She will probably retire soon anyway. Scalia for Chief Justice and someone of like mind to succeed him on the Court. You know it, I know it and the left knows it. At that point, the GOP will have to pull the trigger and morons like Lindsey Graham will vote their constituents' interest or be bludgeoned to political death in the next primary. Conservatives still hold the cards Andrew. Don't go wetting your "sane" self just yet."
#54
Posted: 5/24/05 at 3:02pm
"Actually in New Hampshire girls can be marriage as early as 13:
New Hampshire: A female between the age of 13 and 17 years and a male between the age of 14 and 17 years can be married only with the permission of their parent (guardian) and a waiver. A female below the age of 13 and a male below the age of 14 are not allowed to marry under any conditions. If both parties are nonresidents of NH and are below the age of 18 they cannot be married in NH under any conditions."
Yeah, I recall hearing that before, but wasn't sure of the specifics, whether or not it was still in effect, etc.
And PalJoey, I'm still waiting for you to disprove any of my facts.
New Hampshire: A female between the age of 13 and 17 years and a male between the age of 14 and 17 years can be married only with the permission of their parent (guardian) and a waiver. A female below the age of 13 and a male below the age of 14 are not allowed to marry under any conditions. If both parties are nonresidents of NH and are below the age of 18 they cannot be married in NH under any conditions."
Yeah, I recall hearing that before, but wasn't sure of the specifics, whether or not it was still in effect, etc.
And PalJoey, I'm still waiting for you to disprove any of my facts.
Updated On: 5/24/05 at 03:02 PM
#55
Posted: 5/24/05 at 3:05pm
trp - you said you answered questions directly, but I don't believe you've answered mine. What is the source of your awareness that life is defined from conception onwards? Since you just self-professed atheism, I'm even more curious now.
#56
Posted: 5/24/05 at 3:05pm
In contrast, here's a wonderful letter to the Boston Globe, from a mother, courtesy of Andrew Sullivan again. Goth and trp--please read and reflect. This proud mother represents the FACTS of OUR lives. Open you hearts--and your minds:
---
"We have now had one year of legal same-sex marriage in our state. Despite predictions, we have not witnessed any threat to so-called 'traditional marriage.' There has not been an attack on family, and almost all would admit that very little has changed. In fact, however, something has changed. Many of our citizens have experienced the joy of marriage for the first time where the laws of our state have said, 'You are equal.' We have seen that joy in our son. To take that away would be an injustice. It would be devastating for our family and the real values we believe family should represent.
After seven years in a committed relationship, our son and his partner exchanged vows in front of 125 friends and family members. It brought home the reality that marriage is about two people who love each other and who desire to commit to a life together. We now realize how far our entire family has come in 12 years. Those hopes and dreams we had for our son prior to June 1993 have, in fact, now been realized. What more could we have wished for than to have our son find happiness and share his life with someone he loves?" - the parents of a gay son, in the Boston Globe.
---
"We have now had one year of legal same-sex marriage in our state. Despite predictions, we have not witnessed any threat to so-called 'traditional marriage.' There has not been an attack on family, and almost all would admit that very little has changed. In fact, however, something has changed. Many of our citizens have experienced the joy of marriage for the first time where the laws of our state have said, 'You are equal.' We have seen that joy in our son. To take that away would be an injustice. It would be devastating for our family and the real values we believe family should represent.
After seven years in a committed relationship, our son and his partner exchanged vows in front of 125 friends and family members. It brought home the reality that marriage is about two people who love each other and who desire to commit to a life together. We now realize how far our entire family has come in 12 years. Those hopes and dreams we had for our son prior to June 1993 have, in fact, now been realized. What more could we have wished for than to have our son find happiness and share his life with someone he loves?" - the parents of a gay son, in the Boston Globe.
#57
Posted: 5/24/05 at 3:15pm
"Zygote. This cell results from the union of an oocyte and a sperm. A zygote is the beginning of a new human being."
"This [ a zygote] highly specialized, totipotent cell marked the beginning of each of us as a unique individual."
[Moore, Keith L. and Persaud, T.V.N. The Developing Human: Clinically Oriented Embryology. 6th edition. Philadelphia: W.B. Saunders Company, 1998, p. 2, p. 18]
[Note: This text is used for medical students at the University of Nebraska Medical Center]
"Human development begins after the union of male and female gametes or germ cells during a process known as fertilization (conception).
"Fertilization is a sequence of events that begins with the contact of a sperm (spermatozoon) with a secondary oocyte (ovum) and ends with the fusion of their pronuclei (the haploid nuclei of the sperm and ovum) and the mingling of their chromosomes to form a new cell. This fertilized ovum, known as a zygote, is a large diploid cell that is the beginning, or primordium, of a human being."
[Moore, Keith L. Essentials of Human Embryology. Toronto: B.C. Decker Inc, 1988, p.2
Here's an interesting question: if a baby is born three months premature, does that mean that the parents still have 3 months to kill it?
"This [ a zygote] highly specialized, totipotent cell marked the beginning of each of us as a unique individual."
[Moore, Keith L. and Persaud, T.V.N. The Developing Human: Clinically Oriented Embryology. 6th edition. Philadelphia: W.B. Saunders Company, 1998, p. 2, p. 18]
[Note: This text is used for medical students at the University of Nebraska Medical Center]
"Human development begins after the union of male and female gametes or germ cells during a process known as fertilization (conception).
"Fertilization is a sequence of events that begins with the contact of a sperm (spermatozoon) with a secondary oocyte (ovum) and ends with the fusion of their pronuclei (the haploid nuclei of the sperm and ovum) and the mingling of their chromosomes to form a new cell. This fertilized ovum, known as a zygote, is a large diploid cell that is the beginning, or primordium, of a human being."
[Moore, Keith L. Essentials of Human Embryology. Toronto: B.C. Decker Inc, 1988, p.2
Here's an interesting question: if a baby is born three months premature, does that mean that the parents still have 3 months to kill it?
Updated On: 5/24/05 at 03:15 PM
#58
Posted: 5/24/05 at 3:19pm
trp - it's my understanding that very few actually accept late-term abortions.
What would you say to someone who said they believed in protective status for an unborn child that was individually sustainable with-out the female host?
What would you say to someone who said they believed in protective status for an unborn child that was individually sustainable with-out the female host?
#59
Posted: 5/24/05 at 3:27pm
I apologize for not knowing exactly what you mean by "protective status." I think I know what you're getting at, though.
If Scott Peterson can be convicted of double-murder for killing his wife and unborn son, I think that abortion doctors should be tried for murder as well. And the mother's would technically be accomplices.
If Scott Peterson can be convicted of double-murder for killing his wife and unborn son, I think that abortion doctors should be tried for murder as well. And the mother's would technically be accomplices.
#60
Posted: 5/24/05 at 3:29pm
Hey trpguyy--if you want to have a debate about abortion, start your own thread.
#61
Posted: 5/24/05 at 3:30pm
Actually, I was thinking something similar in regards to you. If you want to have a debate about gay rights, start a new thread. I thought this one was about Bush's judicial nominees. I'm still waiting for answers to questions I asked about that.
Updated On: 5/24/05 at 03:30 PM
#62
Posted: 5/24/05 at 3:34pm
The text of the Senate deal, page 1.
#63
Posted: 5/24/05 at 3:34pm
Senate deal, page 2.
#64
Posted: 5/24/05 at 4:35pm
Various FreeRepublic.com commenters (aka, Freepers):
* I just left the GoP. I'm done with them. Cowards.
* Who would have ever thought that the GOP Senators would have folded to Democratic Demands? I am Shocked! The last time I was this surprised was this morning when the sun came up.
* The GOP is now dead to me. Bill Frist....ah why even bother..
* NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
* Bill Frist cannot control the RINO's in the Senate. The Democrats win again.
* What the HELL is this???????? We don't need a deal!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am furious. I will NOT SEND ANY MORE MONEY TO THE REPUBS. We didn't NEED a deal and we don't WANT a deal!!!
* I mailed my change of registration in this morning. Welcome to the growing ranks of the unaffiliated.
* This is a sad day for the Republican party, and the conservative movement in this country! The Dems will likely gain in Congress in 2006 because of this kind of cowardice. What's the matter with you folks in Arizona????? Is McCain the best you can do??
* It seems like Frist wouldn't have to votes to stop a potential filibuster on a SCOTUS nominee.
* Underneath the chestnut tree; The Republicans sold you, and the GOP sold me.
* Not another frigging dime or a minute of my time, I stay home in 06' or vote libertarian. Unfreakin believable
* If this is true it is truly an outrage. The only deal is the one the crats got. Everything they wanted. We got nothing. Only thing to do now is support a third party that can hopefully pick up 10-15% of the vote and use it as leverage to bargain.
* Republican moderate - horse sugar! What a bunch of stupid little pricks.
* Go to the National Republican Senatorial Committee to voice your outrage. Below is my letter: The "Republican" senators I helped get into the majority have compromised on President Bush's judicial nominations. I will tell every Republican I know not to contribute one thin dime to the NRSC ever again. We in the grassroots worked our tails off for this majority and McCain et al., have betrayed us, our president and his future Supreme Court nominees. I hope you realize that the NRSC will starve for funds for the foreseeable future. The 55-Senator GOP majority wasn't worth our effort. The RINOs made a disgusting mistake taking us for granted.
* I just left the GoP. I'm done with them. Cowards.
* Who would have ever thought that the GOP Senators would have folded to Democratic Demands? I am Shocked! The last time I was this surprised was this morning when the sun came up.
* The GOP is now dead to me. Bill Frist....ah why even bother..
* NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
* Bill Frist cannot control the RINO's in the Senate. The Democrats win again.
* What the HELL is this???????? We don't need a deal!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am furious. I will NOT SEND ANY MORE MONEY TO THE REPUBS. We didn't NEED a deal and we don't WANT a deal!!!
* I mailed my change of registration in this morning. Welcome to the growing ranks of the unaffiliated.
* This is a sad day for the Republican party, and the conservative movement in this country! The Dems will likely gain in Congress in 2006 because of this kind of cowardice. What's the matter with you folks in Arizona????? Is McCain the best you can do??
* It seems like Frist wouldn't have to votes to stop a potential filibuster on a SCOTUS nominee.
* Underneath the chestnut tree; The Republicans sold you, and the GOP sold me.
* Not another frigging dime or a minute of my time, I stay home in 06' or vote libertarian. Unfreakin believable
* If this is true it is truly an outrage. The only deal is the one the crats got. Everything they wanted. We got nothing. Only thing to do now is support a third party that can hopefully pick up 10-15% of the vote and use it as leverage to bargain.
* Republican moderate - horse sugar! What a bunch of stupid little pricks.
* Go to the National Republican Senatorial Committee to voice your outrage. Below is my letter: The "Republican" senators I helped get into the majority have compromised on President Bush's judicial nominations. I will tell every Republican I know not to contribute one thin dime to the NRSC ever again. We in the grassroots worked our tails off for this majority and McCain et al., have betrayed us, our president and his future Supreme Court nominees. I hope you realize that the NRSC will starve for funds for the foreseeable future. The 55-Senator GOP majority wasn't worth our effort. The RINOs made a disgusting mistake taking us for granted.
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