Cut 'n' Runner defeats conservative challenger for RI Senate seat
Cut 'n' Runner defeats conservative challenger for RI Senate seat
Cut 'n' Runner defeats conservative challenger for RI Senate seat#0
Posted: 9/12/06 at 11:07pm
"Moderate Republican Sen. Lincoln Chafee of Rhode Island, who has bucked President Bush on tax cuts and the war in Iraq, defeated a conservative challenger Tuesday in a contest crucial to the larger fight for control of Congress."
Some say the tides are turning on the war. But then again, this article is from the already discredited AP!
Chafee Wins in R.I. As 9 States, DC Vote
Joined: 12/31/69
re: Cut 'n' Runner defeats conservative challenger for RI Senate seat#1
Posted: 9/12/06 at 11:22pm
im very pleased about this.
i think its so interesting that all media focused on Liberman & Lamont, & whether the democratic party was being pulled "too left"...but completley ignored Chafee & Laffey & whether the radical wing of the republican party was purging its moderates.
re: Cut 'n' Runner defeats conservative challenger for RI Senate seat#2
Posted: 9/12/06 at 11:25pm
Guess Chaffee must be one of those wackos who thinks you can't throw a big messy endless war without paying for it! Didn't that's what conservative used to mean?
Oh, wait, no. It's "Tax cut and spend on war!" That's what it means now, right?
Well, I guess the [epithet]s are all happy now that cowardly cut n run Chaffee's got the nom!
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#3
Posted: 9/13/06 at 10:37amprobably, n6, as more than a few publications and websites like the national journal's blogometer have noted, because the groundswell of support that lamont received was so much more pronounced than that which laffey got. for weeks prior to the lamont/lieberman donnybrook in old saybrook you could not click on a "progressive" website without reading about it. the attention given the race was feuled by the internet as much as by the msm. so many major figures came out in support of lamost as compared to the fact that the rnc came out and said that they were not going to support laffey should he win and that they considered it a lost cause if chafee lost. not exactly the gop eating their own. sure club for growth was behind him, but they were pretty much on their own in this one. despite chafee's democratic leanings (he votes with them more than ben nelson, that's not moderate that's borderline treasonous to his own party), there was no huge outcry from the base and organized effort for his defeat like we saw in connecticut. maybe this is due to the fact that the democrats have more influence on the internet. by this i mean that their sites and supporters are better organized and more able to effect their will on the party than their counterparts on the right.
...global warming can manifest itself as heat, cool, precipitation, storms, drought, wind, or any other phenomenon, much like a shapeshifter. -- jim geraghty
pray to st. jude
i'm a sonic reducer
he was the gimmicky sort
fenchurch=mejusthavingfun=magwildwood=mmousefan=bkcollector=bradmajors=somethingtotalkabout: the fenchurch mpd collective
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#4
Posted: 9/13/06 at 10:40amI can't believe someone just called me a wacko in this thread and the moderators just allow it to happen.
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#5
Posted: 9/13/06 at 10:42amthey're animaniacs fans and saw it as a compliment.
...global warming can manifest itself as heat, cool, precipitation, storms, drought, wind, or any other phenomenon, much like a shapeshifter. -- jim geraghty
pray to st. jude
i'm a sonic reducer
he was the gimmicky sort
fenchurch=mejusthavingfun=magwildwood=mmousefan=bkcollector=bradmajors=somethingtotalkabout: the fenchurch mpd collective
Joined: 12/31/69
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#6
Posted: 9/13/06 at 10:58amthank you for the thoughtful explanation, papa
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#7
Posted: 9/13/06 at 10:59am
There's another Republican primary with a centrist against a far right-winger. Arizona? Was that the one?
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#8
Posted: 9/13/06 at 11:09amaz-8. randy graf, a member of the border patrolling minutemen beat the nrcc-endorsed state rep. steve huffman. either one was polling a good deal behind the democrat, gabrielle giffords. huffman was closer, but it's doubtful either one was gonna beat her. put this one in as a pick-up for the dems in november as it was a gop seat until jim kolbe called it quits.
...global warming can manifest itself as heat, cool, precipitation, storms, drought, wind, or any other phenomenon, much like a shapeshifter. -- jim geraghty
pray to st. jude
i'm a sonic reducer
he was the gimmicky sort
fenchurch=mejusthavingfun=magwildwood=mmousefan=bkcollector=bradmajors=somethingtotalkabout: the fenchurch mpd collective
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#9
Posted: 9/13/06 at 11:22am
It's just nice to know that there are some Republicans who don't bust a blood vessel and can discuss Republican politicians who break from the official ideological celebrity-repeated party line.
You know what they say about one dominant bad apple reflecting poorly on the whole bunch.
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#10
Posted: 9/13/06 at 11:24am
Well, Papa's a credit to his party. Too bad so few others are. 
Papa, what do you feel that says about the party? I mean, we've definitely discussed to death the Lamont/Lieberman outcome as some kind of hyper-leftist mandate on the party (when little else is really there to support that - just check out Hillary's landslide)...so do you see a Minuteman's victory - even if pending election loss - as indicative of anything remotely whiffing of a rightist movement?
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#11
Posted: 9/13/06 at 11:45am
no. it's more indicative of how the republican base in arizona is feeling. the fact that there was no widespread movement behind graf other than again the club for growth says to me that the base in arizona is saying that their issue this year is immigration (an issue that's played huge out there for a while, but which has really come to a boil in the last 2-3 years). the fact that the republican establishment threw their weight behind graf's opponent and he lost is more a testament to how pissed arizonans are about the immigration issue. similar to how lamont used iraq as his issue, graf used immigration as his. as much as some (kausfiles and redstate and some others) say that immigration is an issue that has the potential to tear apart the gop, i just don't see it as being as divisive a national issue as iraq. if this were an indication of a more widespread rightist movement, i think we'd have seen more prominent republicans allying themselves with graf and it would have gotten more attention. as it is, his views go against the gop senate concensus for some kind of guest worker program, so he's outside the mainstream of his party as opposed to lamont whose views are much more in line with the democrats in power on his single issue, iraq.
*edit*
polls have shown that anti-immigration candidates poll really well among the general public on the right and left.
...global warming can manifest itself as heat, cool, precipitation, storms, drought, wind, or any other phenomenon, much like a shapeshifter. -- jim geraghty
pray to st. jude
i'm a sonic reducer
he was the gimmicky sort
fenchurch=mejusthavingfun=magwildwood=mmousefan=bkcollector=bradmajors=somethingtotalkabout: the fenchurch mpd collective
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#12
Posted: 9/13/06 at 11:49am
Well, that's a very good analysis of a comparison between the two...and this is probably not the best thread to discuss this, but I'm curious about your comment that immigration isn't as big a make-or-break issue for Republicans...I'd just wonder why you think that only because now we see it backfired in one primary (whether they were going to win it or not ultimately)...don't you think that could happen in other states where immigration is such a boiling kettle?
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#13
Posted: 9/13/06 at 12:01pm
well, that was pretty much the last of the primaries before november so it might be a concern for the next election cycle if there's been no progress at the national level on immigration reform bewteen now and then.
arizona also became a bit of a resentment thing. the nrcc came in in the last weeks and dropped $122k on huffman's candidacy and according to reports from some arizona papers, the rank and file didn't look too kindly on being told who to vote for which was how they saw it.
...global warming can manifest itself as heat, cool, precipitation, storms, drought, wind, or any other phenomenon, much like a shapeshifter. -- jim geraghty
pray to st. jude
i'm a sonic reducer
he was the gimmicky sort
fenchurch=mejusthavingfun=magwildwood=mmousefan=bkcollector=bradmajors=somethingtotalkabout: the fenchurch mpd collective
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#14
Posted: 9/13/06 at 2:46pmDoes it cause the (slightly insane, in my opinion) rabid bloggers who are inspired by talk radio extremists to hear of a Republican having the temerity to criticize the war on Iraq and the president's tax cuts? Is there room for it, or do the locksteppers crush folks like Chafee?
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#15
Posted: 9/13/06 at 2:56pm
i think the response of the nrsc in this case, which basically said, "if linc loses, we're taking our money and going home," should be a testament to the inclusivity of the republicans at that level. hah! i typed that without laughing!
the power of the extremists within the party, while considerable, does not extend to being able to unseat sitting senators in their primaries. yet. on the other hand, laffey didn't have much of an issue to run on. with bush in the dumper in the polls, linc could say, "hey, i told them not to do that" and be believable. the partisan rage was just not there in ri because there wasn't a single issue to drive it. when you've got someone trying to unseat an incumbent in a primary like this, geneally there has to be a single issue that they can really run on. otherwise, you're not going to be able to motivate folks to come out and vote against the person who represents them. there was no clear single issue here.
...global warming can manifest itself as heat, cool, precipitation, storms, drought, wind, or any other phenomenon, much like a shapeshifter. -- jim geraghty
pray to st. jude
i'm a sonic reducer
he was the gimmicky sort
fenchurch=mejusthavingfun=magwildwood=mmousefan=bkcollector=bradmajors=somethingtotalkabout: the fenchurch mpd collective
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#16
Posted: 9/13/06 at 3:00pmWhat I can't grasp is the leap in logic SOME nutty people must have to do in order to make the same exact message a definition of insanity (and to quote a badly coined malapropism from a kind of not very smart person) "cut n runism" when Lamont says it, but acceptable when Chafee does it? And if not acceptable, at least not worthy of even acknowledging, let along going all Tasmanian Devil on the topic.
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#17
Posted: 9/13/06 at 3:10pm
well, namo, ya gotta question anybody who uses the phrase. i mean it's one thing for the president to use it in a speech, sure it sounds great, but as a talking point or a defense of policy or in any practical terms at the lower levels, it's pretty much the functional equivalent of sticking your fingers in your ears and shouting, "la la la, i am not listening to you." but then, i was never a fan of the catch phrases that my party always seems embrace. "cut and run" "flip flop" etc. i understand what they are trying to do, to distill down a larger point to a simple phrase, but i never liked it and i doubt that i ever will.
as far as linc's fate. he'll still suffer the slings and arrows of the pundits and already has. but the gop recognized that sometimes it's better to have the guy who's only sometimes with you happy that you still like him and thus more inclined to help you out when you need it.
...global warming can manifest itself as heat, cool, precipitation, storms, drought, wind, or any other phenomenon, much like a shapeshifter. -- jim geraghty
pray to st. jude
i'm a sonic reducer
he was the gimmicky sort
fenchurch=mejusthavingfun=magwildwood=mmousefan=bkcollector=bradmajors=somethingtotalkabout: the fenchurch mpd collective
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#18
Posted: 9/13/06 at 3:13pm
A question, Papa, as I'm too dang lazy right now to go to that site that shows Rep/Sen. voting records...does Chafee vote with Republicans about as often as Lieberman votes Dem (somewhere around 90%)?
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#19
Posted: 9/13/06 at 3:14pm
"to distill down a larger point to a simple phrase, but i never liked it and i doubt that i ever will."
I'm not just sucking up, but I can't help but ascribe that to the obvious fact that you care about language and communication.
"as far as linc's fate. he'll still suffer the slings and arrows of the pundits and already has. but the gop recognized that sometimes it's better to have the guy who's only sometimes with you happy that you still like him and thus more inclined to help you out when you need it."
It really does always seem to come down to wanting a guy to like us, doesn't it!
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#20
Posted: 9/13/06 at 3:28pm
Bway,
Most of the evidence I have seen shows Chafee voting about 50-50 really depending on the issue, with the edge possibly going to him voting with the Democrats.
He has voted with the Democrats on the last nine issues listed on the Washington Post site, and with the Republicans on 5 of 7 before that. At insidepolitics.org some earlier analysis of Congressional Weekly as far back as 2000 says that Chafee voted with the Democrats 68% of the time on the 67 contested votes immediately before that article.
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#21
Posted: 9/13/06 at 3:30pmI guess AnnMalkinCoulterMichelle would call him a traitor.
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#22
Posted: 9/13/06 at 3:31pm
Wow. with a record like that, I'd really have to question what it is about the Republican party that he finds worthwhile enough to remain in it.
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#23
Posted: 9/13/06 at 3:43pm
I think Chafee may be even closer to the top of the AnnMalkin types list of Traitors than a simple "new york elitist" like you or I, there is some vitriol of the highest order out there about the guy.
Reading over his issue stances and votes it is hard to figure why he might remain Republican. His father the Republican senator he was appointed to replace, perhaps it is as an honor for him and an attempt to hold some accountablity in the party.
It seems his record is more liberal than most of the Senate Democrats.
cut 'n' runner defeats conservative challenger for ri senate seat#24
Posted: 9/13/06 at 3:52pma quick excel spreadsheet analysis (that may be a bit off) going back to 6/6/02 has him voting with the gop roughly 70% of the time overall. he even wrote in george h.w. bush on his 2004 ballot.
...global warming can manifest itself as heat, cool, precipitation, storms, drought, wind, or any other phenomenon, much like a shapeshifter. -- jim geraghty
pray to st. jude
i'm a sonic reducer
he was the gimmicky sort
fenchurch=mejusthavingfun=magwildwood=mmousefan=bkcollector=bradmajors=somethingtotalkabout: the fenchurch mpd collective
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