Success in MT without college

[sleepyguy1717]

Posted: 12/16/07 at 3:24pm

This subject kind of came up in another thread I started but, do you think you can be successful on Broadaway and in musical theater without college? Some people say college training is vital, while others say people are just as successful with or without college.

What are your thoughts?

https://forum.broadwayworld.com/readmessage.cfm?boardname=bway&thread=947317#3296150
^Original post

[B3TA07]

Posted: 12/16/07 at 3:31pm

Becky Gulsvig, the u/s for Laura Bell Bundy, didn't go to college...and we can ALL tell.

[Juliash]

Posted: 12/16/07 at 3:39pm

Personally, I think that even if you're really talented college is a good transitional experience and its a good place to learn about the business aspect of theatre before you're in total financial ruin. :)

[BillFinn]

Posted: 12/16/07 at 6:17pm

Laura Benanti didn't go to college.

A friend of mine didn't go and she got into final callbacks of Spring Awakening (I don't think she got a part in the tour, but STILL!).

It depends on your talent and drive. If you're okay with ugly jobs, but constantly working on your craft via independent classes, workshops, and other resources. Auditions. Etc. If that's your lifestyle; aim for the stars.

Know this though. College is the new high school degree. That's what they're telling us in the classroom. It's the new, expected requirement. I doubt this applies to Musical Theater, because talent outshines technicalities. But for what it's worth...

[B3TA07]

Posted: 12/16/07 at 6:41pm

^That aside, I'd say at least 90% of HS graduates are still so raw and underdeveloped with their talents that they need the 4 years of experience and talent of college to develop themselves as performers. Grad school is just to get roles on your resume, really.

[AKDPerformer]

Posted: 12/18/07 at 12:40am

This was an original post of mine that I put up awhile back on the thread that sleepyguy originally provided the link for.

The point I was trying to make is that specifically performers in this business don't need a degree to land...for example an ensemble job in a show. Everyone has a different path and sometimes that path doesn't involve attending college.

The casting director is going to be looking at you and what you can do/are capable of doing on that day the audition is taking place. Having a degree is not a primary/mandatory requirement to be on Broadway. I honestly believe the most important things on your resume that they truly take into consideration and really look at is if you have regional theater/summer stock experience and credits.

I'm not saying college is a bad thing, it's just not for everybody. I attended a conservatory and gave it a shot for a bit and then left because it just didn't fit for me. Despite me doing well, I couldn't stand the curriculum. Education is always an important thing to have and i'm not denying that, i'm just trying to state that you don't always have to graduate from a top university to be considered for a role on Bway. Trust me, I have a bunch of friends that go to NYU/Syracuse etc. and forgive me for sounding like an ass...but some of them got in based completely on grades. A lot of them have no potential or talent. You can train years and years and YEARS and i'm sorry...being tone deaf to begin with and then training at a 4 year institution and getting your degree isn't going to make you sound any better. "Oh WOW! He went to (whatever school and graduated!) oh but...wait a minute...he sucks and can't sing a damn note!" You need something to start out with, or else your just wasting tuition money/time and it is pointless. In my opinion atleast...

Its inspiring though to hear about performers (a lot by the way) who are either college dropouts or who never went because its proof that you don't need a BFA/MFA what have you to get to that plateau. I'm not saying you should follow in their path, because not everyone is blessed with natural talent/ability and 90-99% I do know that professional actors are out of a job.

Honestly, I ushered at a Broadway show this past year and after watching it night after night I can honestly say I learned more in 5 months than I ever did at my 1 year at the school I attended. But then again, that's just me...I learn better in an environment where i'm either being privately trained and I can choose what I want to do and where I want to learn it. I know i'm not perfect, and everyday I constantly read/educate/train to become a more knowledgable, better person/performer. I just don't want to do it within the 4 walls of a college.

I know i'll probably get a lot of crap for this...but whatever...I do know what i'm talking about. Thanks to anyone who took the time out of their day to read this long/rambling post.

Oh and also...
"One time I was talking to Joe Papp and said that I sometimes feel very shy because everybody here has gone to this university and that, and I didn't. He said, what are you talking about? In college people learn what is given to them. You learned what was important to you. You have a mind of your own, a universal education that a lot of people don't have. So why should you feel badly? It's still intimidating when someone has gone to Yale...but now as I go to speak at these colleges I always start by saying I have no academic credits...but I have experience...*Experience*."-Graciela Daniele from the book So You Want To Dance On Broadway.

Updated On: 12/18/07 at 12:40 AM

[buffyactsing]

Posted: 12/18/07 at 2:28am

I'd boost that up to a Masters in many cases...with the exception of some Tech education. A Bachelors won't even get you very far these days.

[chinto1984]

Posted: 12/24/07 at 11:45pm

I did dinner theatre for 2 years straight and learned more about theatre in all aspects compared to what I learned in college classes. Not saying dinner theatre is great but being able to learn from all experiences is necessary. Actually performing is also a must. You can't just take classes and expect thats it. You have to audition, you have to do ensemble or parts you are not happy with to discover what you need to do to grow and how you work. You find out what warm ups are vital for you. How you work with different directors and actors. How demanding doing multiple shows for multiple weeks. You learn so much about acting, style, technique when you crew or do small ensemble parts. Everything is a learning experience in theatre.

[nate2]

Posted: 12/25/07 at 7:57pm

I'd say if your going to make a move to NYC to study acting without college you MUST attend the Jen Waldman Studio! I was very fortunate enough to work with her when Wicked came to cleveland and she is extrodinary! She has numerous students working in Wicked, Young Frankenstein, Drowsy Chaperone etc. And a few big names that have gone to her are Jonathan Groff. www.jenwaldmanstudio.com

[B3TA07]

Posted: 12/26/07 at 12:12am

"And a few big names that have gone to her are Jonathan Groff."

Jon Groff is one person...

[nate2]

Posted: 12/26/07 at 12:57am

I meant to list more sorry! If you go to her website you'll find all the names and people she's trained and their testimonies. It's probably one of the best training programs outside of college!

[Little-Lotte]

Posted: 12/27/07 at 8:51am

I can bet that more than half of the people that went to that studio went to college first. Just look at the bios of cast members in the shows they mentioned, most of them went to college specifically for theatre.

The fact is very few people really have the chops to work professionally without any training. Child actors are the few fortunate ones who had a natural talent, but honed it working with professionals. This business is so hard even for the very talented people who have been working for years and years. I have friends who have starred on Broadway/Off-Broadway many times and they still can go months between jobs.

I would suggest, get an education no matter what. There is a high probability that you won't make it and then you'll be screwed because you don't have a degree. If you really think that you don't need to go to school try auditioning for regional and summer stock theaters, both equity and non-equity. If you get cast, well then maybe you MIGHT be able to get away without going to college. If not, then I would suggest to go! Either way some type of education is better than none and unless you wanna go broke, I wouldn't suggest moving to NYC and just taking classes. Start small in regional theatre, you're gonna need those credits to compete with the actors who have years of experience more than you do.

There are very few Sutton Fosters/Johnathan Groffs in this world, just because they dropped out of/didn't finish school, doesn't mean you'll be as successful as them.

Posted: 12/27/07 at 2:51pm

nate2- i am such a fan of Jen Waldman. she's amazing!

[AKDPerformer]

Posted: 1/7/08 at 12:24am

Little lotte-But what if you've tried college/conservatory life and it just WASN'T for you?

You have to think of that as well. Its not that some kids just flat out don't wanna go, its that the college experience just isn't for them.

Also, starting at summer stock/children's theatre/touring/regional theaters is probably the 2nd next best thing to be doing instead of taking on the college route.

Honestly, and I know and have heard this people who have and are working professionally the one thing that they love to see on your resume more than anything is regional credits. It doesn't guarantee you the job. Nothing in this business is ever a guarantee. But it shows that you have the mass potential as a performer to handle that type of theatrical experience and level of professionalism.

[DaneSaw]

Posted: 1/7/08 at 5:50pm

You can obviously be successful in musical theater without college, just look at all of the actors who auditioned for Broadway shows while still in high school or those who got a part a year into college and dropped out.

However, it never hurts to be educated on things. It's very rare for raw talent to be...well...talented enough to make it big without any kind of formal training. Hell, a lot of theater majors aren't even good enough for regional theater, let alone to make it to Broadway.

And I agree with those who said that casting directors probably don't care much about your education. They're focused more on what you do on the day you walk in ready to perform, and subsequent auditions after.

[AKDPerformer]

Posted: 1/7/08 at 10:53pm

Its so true though. No matter how talented you are its about being in the right place at the RIGHT time.

Its all about the timing and you being and fitting the exact description of what they want/need to cast.

Sometimes talent may not even be the number one necessity. I had a friend who I went to school with who dropped out because she got cast in the national tour of Rent as Mimi. She was an amazing dancer but her vocals/acting were lackluster.

Updated On: 7/9/08 at 10:53 PM

[DaneSaw]

Posted: 1/9/08 at 2:57pm

Gee, I wonder who that could have been...hah