#26
Posted: 5/21/04 at 12:27pm
I gots ya room all set my papa, surrender to the Dark Side..
Oh and Bestiality ROCKS!
Oh and Bestiality ROCKS!
What about us??? — Page 2
#27
Posted: 5/21/04 at 12:30pm
I was under the impression that Sweettea was talking about a three way marriage so, that's what I have been basing my comments on. God a person married to two seperate people who are not involved with one another? I have a hard enough time maintaining one relationship where we both still live seperately (you come to my place...no you come to mine...my bed's more comfortable...but your dog gives me allergies).
I can't even begin to imagine the scheduling involved in moving between spouses at different locations.
I can't even begin to imagine the scheduling involved in moving between spouses at different locations.
http://www.danperezgallery.com
#28
Posted: 5/21/04 at 12:31pm
Bisexuality does not equal polygamy. Bisexuality is not two sexualities. It is merely the ability to fall in love or lust with either a man or a woman. Bisexuality removes the requirement of gender in one's choosing of a mate.
Now, sometimes, I'm sure that one might have a craving for a guy one night, and maybe a craving for a female another night. But, that is no different to me then, some nights I might crave a black guy my age, and maybe the next night I crave a white guy who is older; or maybe one night I am craving a red headed guy, the next I am craving a brunette.
I might even fall in love with two different guys (much like on the Bachelorette lol). But on deciding who to marry--I have to choose that one human being that is to be my partner.
It also sounds like (and please forgive me if I read your post wrong) you gave up on the female because you couldn't get married and have kids. Well, then you must not really have been in love with her or your need for "marriage and kids" is greater than your need for a partner, thus choosing a man. But, then you have to ask yourself--do I really love this man, or is he just giving me what I need?
And, I include bisexuals (as well as trangendered) whenever I say "gays". I fight for equal rights in marriage and all things pertaining to sexual orientation to protect heterosexuals as well. Because, in many ways, this all boils down to gender issues and removing the labels. All AMERICANS should be treated equally and regarded as AMERICANS, not these other labels.
I, personally, do not find polygamy offensive--to each his own. But, right now, the issue being fought is for two people to have the right to marry each other---including the right for a bisexual to marry same sex if that is who they fell for. If polygamists want to fight for that right, then they can take that step one day.
Now, sometimes, I'm sure that one might have a craving for a guy one night, and maybe a craving for a female another night. But, that is no different to me then, some nights I might crave a black guy my age, and maybe the next night I crave a white guy who is older; or maybe one night I am craving a red headed guy, the next I am craving a brunette.
I might even fall in love with two different guys (much like on the Bachelorette lol). But on deciding who to marry--I have to choose that one human being that is to be my partner.
It also sounds like (and please forgive me if I read your post wrong) you gave up on the female because you couldn't get married and have kids. Well, then you must not really have been in love with her or your need for "marriage and kids" is greater than your need for a partner, thus choosing a man. But, then you have to ask yourself--do I really love this man, or is he just giving me what I need?
And, I include bisexuals (as well as trangendered) whenever I say "gays". I fight for equal rights in marriage and all things pertaining to sexual orientation to protect heterosexuals as well. Because, in many ways, this all boils down to gender issues and removing the labels. All AMERICANS should be treated equally and regarded as AMERICANS, not these other labels.
I, personally, do not find polygamy offensive--to each his own. But, right now, the issue being fought is for two people to have the right to marry each other---including the right for a bisexual to marry same sex if that is who they fell for. If polygamists want to fight for that right, then they can take that step one day.
#29
Posted: 5/21/04 at 12:32pm
Oh, I hear you Orion. Are we living the same soap opera?
#30
Posted: 5/21/04 at 12:32pm
oh come on, orion. haven't you ever seen a movie about a traveling salesman with families in several states? it's been used as a plotline in, i believe, every hourlong drama ever screened on network television in the history of the medium.
r.i.p. marco, my guardian angel.
...global warming can manifest itself as heat, cool, precipitation, storms, drought, wind, or any other phenomenon, much like a shapeshifter. -- jim geraghty
pray to st. jude
i'm a sonic reducer
he was the gimmicky sort
fenchurch=mejusthavingfun=magwildwood=mmousefan=bkcollector=bradmajors=somethingtotalkabout: the fenchurch mpd collective
...global warming can manifest itself as heat, cool, precipitation, storms, drought, wind, or any other phenomenon, much like a shapeshifter. -- jim geraghty
pray to st. jude
i'm a sonic reducer
he was the gimmicky sort
fenchurch=mejusthavingfun=magwildwood=mmousefan=bkcollector=bradmajors=somethingtotalkabout: the fenchurch mpd collective
#31
Posted: 5/21/04 at 12:33pm
JRB, where you been?
Stop worrying about what I'm doing -- focus instead on what you're eating.
#32
Posted: 5/21/04 at 12:44pm
Well, as we all know, anyone regardless of sexual orientation can fall for more than one person at the same time but we can't marry them both simultaneously (hell, I only got the right to marry three days ago and it may be taken away). If we want to marry, we need to choose. I don't see that being any different for bisexual people. However, if a marriage to more than one person is what you want and you want to lobby for it being made legal, you certainly can, but look at the trouble we are having getting the right for two people of the same gender to marry even after they have a committed relationship for decades. I can't imagine maintaining two seperate marriages at once but if it works for some people, fine.
http://www.danperezgallery.com
#33
Posted: 5/21/04 at 12:48pm
I'd like to clarify: I could support 3 people being married to each other, but I would NOT support a person married to two different people who are not married to each other as well---that would create chaos and would not be fair to everyone when inevitably spouses would not know about the other spouse.
#34
Posted: 5/21/04 at 12:48pm
"oh come on, orion. haven't you ever seen a movie about a traveling salesman with families in several states?"
Yes I do know that story line as well as the airline employee storyline where there are spouses in various countries. Didn't Dean Martin perfect this movie plotline in the late 60's early 70's?
I thinking of a situation where they all live nearby.
If I one guy here and one on the other side of the country, that could be doable.
Yes I do know that story line as well as the airline employee storyline where there are spouses in various countries. Didn't Dean Martin perfect this movie plotline in the late 60's early 70's?
I thinking of a situation where they all live nearby.
If I one guy here and one on the other side of the country, that could be doable.
http://www.danperezgallery.com
#36
Posted: 5/21/04 at 1:30pm
OK.... I'm going to clarify.... My question is in regard to 3 people being committed to each other, together. I must admit that I am really playing devil's advocate, because I have made the choice in my life to commit to a man. My question is based on someone else's situation and views, but those views are shared by many bisexual people I know, and I wanted to get some feedback on them.
For the record, my girlfriend left ME, not the other way around, and it broke my heart. Her reasons that she stated for leaving me were that she wasn't sure she could live her life childless. You can imagine how I felt about that. I am with Joey now because I love him. It took me a long time and alot of different partners (male AND female) for me to find him. I consider myself blessed.
ckeaton - truce. seriously. I AM in fact, on the fence on my argument. Actually, it was never intended to be an argument in the first place.... just a discussion. and I did say "for the sake of argument". That means that perhaps that was not my personal view, but one that I felt was valid and should be expressed. That's all. And I also said that I was being oversensitive and I knew it, but I wanted to say that the WAY you expressed your opinion was offensive to be, not your opinion itself. Still, I appologize to you for letting my feelings get the best of me. Let's just BOTH stop being bitchy about this, OK?
It's an issue that I myself am confused about. I don't know what to push for. So I put it to all of you, so that I can hear arguments and opinions that may help me form some sort of idea about how it can be done. That's the first step, right?
-Tea
For the record, my girlfriend left ME, not the other way around, and it broke my heart. Her reasons that she stated for leaving me were that she wasn't sure she could live her life childless. You can imagine how I felt about that. I am with Joey now because I love him. It took me a long time and alot of different partners (male AND female) for me to find him. I consider myself blessed.
ckeaton - truce. seriously. I AM in fact, on the fence on my argument. Actually, it was never intended to be an argument in the first place.... just a discussion. and I did say "for the sake of argument". That means that perhaps that was not my personal view, but one that I felt was valid and should be expressed. That's all. And I also said that I was being oversensitive and I knew it, but I wanted to say that the WAY you expressed your opinion was offensive to be, not your opinion itself. Still, I appologize to you for letting my feelings get the best of me. Let's just BOTH stop being bitchy about this, OK?
It's an issue that I myself am confused about. I don't know what to push for. So I put it to all of you, so that I can hear arguments and opinions that may help me form some sort of idea about how it can be done. That's the first step, right?
-Tea
#37
Posted: 5/21/04 at 1:35pm
Attempt at humor to diffuse the situation:
Isn't the first step admitting you have a problem? There's 11 more after that I think. :)
Sorry. I understand where you're coming from tea, seriously.
Isn't the first step admitting you have a problem? There's 11 more after that I think. :)
Sorry. I understand where you're coming from tea, seriously.
Hamlet's father.
#38
Posted: 5/21/04 at 1:36pm
ok, tea, hun, i'm going to have to insist that you refrain from this freadful idea of trying to be mature about settling differences with people here. it sets a bad precedent and could if followed lead to genial descussions between people with radically different views. i for one view that possibility with contempt and more than a little self righteous indignation (don't ask me why, i lost my tain of thought after the first line and have continued out of a sense of duty). i must respectfully ask you to resort to the neener neener neener riposte or if truly necessary the rubber/glue clause.
mature discussions on this board...indeed!
mature discussions on this board...indeed!
r.i.p. marco, my guardian angel.
...global warming can manifest itself as heat, cool, precipitation, storms, drought, wind, or any other phenomenon, much like a shapeshifter. -- jim geraghty
pray to st. jude
i'm a sonic reducer
he was the gimmicky sort
fenchurch=mejusthavingfun=magwildwood=mmousefan=bkcollector=bradmajors=somethingtotalkabout: the fenchurch mpd collective
...global warming can manifest itself as heat, cool, precipitation, storms, drought, wind, or any other phenomenon, much like a shapeshifter. -- jim geraghty
pray to st. jude
i'm a sonic reducer
he was the gimmicky sort
fenchurch=mejusthavingfun=magwildwood=mmousefan=bkcollector=bradmajors=somethingtotalkabout: the fenchurch mpd collective
#39
Posted: 5/21/04 at 1:44pm
Sweettea -- It would seem to me that your questions/arguments have nothing at all to do with bi-sexuality per se. Rather they are a matter of polygamy. And, in that case, answers would apply to hetero/homo/bi-sexuals alike.
"We have enough youth -- How about a Fountain of Smart?"
________________________
"I'm not young enough to know everything." - Oscar Wilde
Updated On: 5/21/04 at 01:44 PM
#40
Posted: 5/21/04 at 1:55pm
First, papa.... OK, poo poo head.... If that's what you want. :) I can be immature with the best of them.
Secondly, Donel.... That's the thing. I don't like the idea of polygamy for that very reason.... It's just the only suggestion anyone has come up with. I would HATE the idea of sharing my man with another person. Most straight women would be totally pissed off if polygamy were made legal. But to make it legal for gays, straights, and bisexuals??? The whole WORLD would be turned upside down. To me, that is not OK. But the question remains, is it FAIR that because I can't understand that lifestyle or because you can't understand that lifestyle that it should be illegal to those who can? The root of my question does lie in bisexuality.... Because that is the ONLY circumstance in which I, myself, could even consider polygamy as a solution. And the question is about bisexuals specifically, not the rest of the world. I don't know the answer. I doubt that anyone does. But hearing other views really helps me to formulate, what I believe are less biased and more well informed opinions and views.
-Tea
Secondly, Donel.... That's the thing. I don't like the idea of polygamy for that very reason.... It's just the only suggestion anyone has come up with. I would HATE the idea of sharing my man with another person. Most straight women would be totally pissed off if polygamy were made legal. But to make it legal for gays, straights, and bisexuals??? The whole WORLD would be turned upside down. To me, that is not OK. But the question remains, is it FAIR that because I can't understand that lifestyle or because you can't understand that lifestyle that it should be illegal to those who can? The root of my question does lie in bisexuality.... Because that is the ONLY circumstance in which I, myself, could even consider polygamy as a solution. And the question is about bisexuals specifically, not the rest of the world. I don't know the answer. I doubt that anyone does. But hearing other views really helps me to formulate, what I believe are less biased and more well informed opinions and views.
-Tea
#41
Posted: 5/21/04 at 2:11pm
To repeat, bisexuality does not equal polygamy. Maybe some of the bisexuals you know want to marry a man and a woman, but the only people I have ever heard suggest that were conservatives in Senate hearings trying to discredit the argument for gay marriage.
My first boyfriend married a woman. He fell in love with a person who happened to be a woman. He does not want to add a male to the picture. This is true for most people.
My first boyfriend married a woman. He fell in love with a person who happened to be a woman. He does not want to add a male to the picture. This is true for most people.
#43
Posted: 5/21/04 at 2:23pm
jrb, you and I aggree on that. I am bisexual. I am monogomous. I get the point. I do, however, know several bisexual people who are in relationships that involve 3 people. They are mutually repectful relationships, meaning all 3 people are involved in all aspects. The most successful of these relationships is the one I mentioned before of 13 years. Most of them end in horrible and very soap-like scenes where at least one person gets something thrown at them. It's not pretty.
On the other hand, if I know someone who has made it work, then I feel I owe it to that family to at least explore the possibility that it COULD work, and try to figure out a way that the legal complications and moral restrictions could be less cumbersome for them. That's all. I personally know of 4 families that have made it work past the 5 year mark. If I know 4, there must be more. ALOT more, given that I live in a very conservative area of the south. It happens more often than anyone thinks, and probably the reason you only hear about it from conservative politicians bashing gays is because these people feel so ostricised from society that they don't feel comfortable being public about their family structure.
(Which, incidentally, ckeaton, is why your Jerry Springer post offended me.... Because the idea that the only way people feel comfortable coming forward about that kind of family structure is on television shows that promote conflict offends me. not trying to start anything. Just trying to explain.)
-Tea
On the other hand, if I know someone who has made it work, then I feel I owe it to that family to at least explore the possibility that it COULD work, and try to figure out a way that the legal complications and moral restrictions could be less cumbersome for them. That's all. I personally know of 4 families that have made it work past the 5 year mark. If I know 4, there must be more. ALOT more, given that I live in a very conservative area of the south. It happens more often than anyone thinks, and probably the reason you only hear about it from conservative politicians bashing gays is because these people feel so ostricised from society that they don't feel comfortable being public about their family structure.
(Which, incidentally, ckeaton, is why your Jerry Springer post offended me.... Because the idea that the only way people feel comfortable coming forward about that kind of family structure is on television shows that promote conflict offends me. not trying to start anything. Just trying to explain.)
-Tea
#44
Posted: 5/21/04 at 2:26pm
So, tea, I will echo Donal and say that the issue you are discussing is not about bisexuality--it is about polygamy. Don't lump bisexuals in with this--you are stereotyping.
#45
Posted: 5/21/04 at 2:30pm
Which was my initial point. Thanks JRB.
Hamlet's father.
#46
Posted: 5/21/04 at 2:48pm
What I mean is that the issue that brought it to mind whs a bisexual relationship in which a person equally loved a man and a woman. The polygamy discussion came in DIRECT RESULT and for the sole purpose of discussing how this could or could not work for a bisexual person in this quandry. I limit the topic to bisexual couples because that is the REASON I started the thread in the first place.
I never said "ALL bisexuals should be in 3 way relationships" nor did I say "polygamy should be legal". I put forward a specific situation and asked the question of how we should preserve equal rights for people in that situation. Please don't take it the wrong way. It's a basic question of equal rights. We have made great strides in racial and sexual equality. But it is not enough. 50 years ago, more people thought being gay was wrong than do now. 50 years ago in the south, racism was accepted. This idea of civil and personal freedom is really taking flight. I'm just opening up a discussion about LIFESTYLE freedom, and I'm doing it by suggesting, again, a specific situation which has come to my attention and which happens to involve polygamy AND bisexuality. The topic is getting too broad.
I will summarize the original topic.... If a bisexual person finds themself equally in love with both a man and a woman, and all three people in the relationship love each other equally, what arrangement would be fair and just to preserve that family unit? Does that family qualify for certain rights and responsibilities? And the question IS about bisexuality. This whole thread about straight or gay people being with more than one partner is not what I was getting at. What I was saying is that if a person has a right to be bisexual and they find themselves in that position, what rights should they have and why?
-Tea
I never said "ALL bisexuals should be in 3 way relationships" nor did I say "polygamy should be legal". I put forward a specific situation and asked the question of how we should preserve equal rights for people in that situation. Please don't take it the wrong way. It's a basic question of equal rights. We have made great strides in racial and sexual equality. But it is not enough. 50 years ago, more people thought being gay was wrong than do now. 50 years ago in the south, racism was accepted. This idea of civil and personal freedom is really taking flight. I'm just opening up a discussion about LIFESTYLE freedom, and I'm doing it by suggesting, again, a specific situation which has come to my attention and which happens to involve polygamy AND bisexuality. The topic is getting too broad.
I will summarize the original topic.... If a bisexual person finds themself equally in love with both a man and a woman, and all three people in the relationship love each other equally, what arrangement would be fair and just to preserve that family unit? Does that family qualify for certain rights and responsibilities? And the question IS about bisexuality. This whole thread about straight or gay people being with more than one partner is not what I was getting at. What I was saying is that if a person has a right to be bisexual and they find themselves in that position, what rights should they have and why?
-Tea
#47
Posted: 5/21/04 at 2:59pm
Isn't the bisexual, polygamist horse dead yet?
"Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a handsome and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming "WOW--WHAT A RIDE!!!!""
"Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a handsome and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming "WOW--WHAT A RIDE!!!!""
#48
Posted: 5/21/04 at 3:06pm
Tea-- I WAS talking about bisexuals!
Tea = brick wall!!
Love you, mean it sweetie, but I believe we have more than answered your question. That family would need for polygamy to be legal or to just live together without marriage. It is that simple. What do you want us to do? Start a march on DC tomorrow?? We have answered the question!
Tea = brick wall!!
Love you, mean it sweetie, but I believe we have more than answered your question. That family would need for polygamy to be legal or to just live together without marriage. It is that simple. What do you want us to do? Start a march on DC tomorrow?? We have answered the question!
#49
Posted: 5/21/04 at 4:07pm
Man, this thread has grown! I go away for two hours and you guys are still talking about switch hitters? Go back to Kristin vs. Idina!
"Noah, someday we'll talk again. But there's things we'll never say. That sorrow deep inside you. It inside me, too. And it never go away. You be okay. You'll learn how to lose things..."
#50
Posted: 5/21/04 at 10:08pm
SweetTea -- your questions and arguments have been answered and responded to many times in the course of this thread, but you seem to refuse to comprehend what is being said. Bi-sexuality does not REQUIRE one to love (or make a life with) more than one person at a time. Bi-sexuality only means that one is capable of loving (or making a life with) either a male or a female. So now give up your wordy posts! Enough already!
"We have enough youth -- How about a Fountain of Smart?"
________________________
"I'm not young enough to know everything." - Oscar Wilde
Updated On: 5/21/04 at 10:08 PM
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