A few questions on "Steel Pier"- Page 2

[lovinlife]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 2:01pm

I am only 22, but remember seeing this show and falling in love with it. The dancing was just incredible and Running in Place was electric. Everybody's Girl brought the theatre to it's feet, Ms. Monk did a terrific job. I remember Steel Pier was to be the sure hit of the year, seeing as the other big new musical contender was Titanic. RCA even said yes to recording SP before the Tony's and were putting Titanic on the back burner until after the awards because they assumed Titanic would surely close. (I was able to buy Steel Pier at the theatre before the Tony's and Titanic was not sure if they were going to be recorded at all.) We all know what happened. Titanic won the Tony, Chicago overshadowed everything, and this gem, which could have used some book work, closed right away. Maybe Titanic won, or became the longer running show due to the Movie with DiCaprio and Winslet that came out right before the musical opened.

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 2:23pm

Good memory, lovinlife. It was indeed supposed to be the big hit, everything was in place - Kander and Ebb, spectacle, and all the buzz - this was poised to be Ziemba's star-making vehicle.

[Marquise]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 2:26pm

i wanted to see this because it's a kander and ebb show.
and of course, gregory harrison was in it...
but when i finally decided to get around to seeing it i realized the show had come and gone.
i do own the OBC though.
good score.

[MargoChanning]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 2:31pm

I can rarely recall being more bored in the theatre than when I saw Steel Pier. I was numb from all the repetitiveness in the staging and total lack of character development. I just remember it being painful to sit through. Titanic was a better show and even the heavily flawed The Life was ten times more entertaining (thanks to Lillias White, Chuck Cooper et al).

[cheezedoodle]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 2:33pm

Am I correct that the story of Steel Pier is based on the film "They Shoot Horses Don't They?" - I don't remember where I heard that, and it has been years since I have seen the film.

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 2:37pm

You are correct, cheeze.

THE LIFE, Margo?? It was only entertaining as a train wreck!! Yes, the cast was great, but STEEL PIER wasn't too shabby cast-wise itself.

[Jon]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 2:38pm

Actually, Kander & Ebb wanted to do a musical of THEY SHOOT HORSES, DON'T THEY?, but the rights were ot available, so they decided to come up with an original story. And that story was the weakest element of the show.

[cheezedoodle]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 2:40pm

Ah! Thanks you guys. I still love the tap number on the wing of the plane - I get chills when I hear the music to this day.

[children&art]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 2:40pm

totally off-subject, but Pamela Isaacs from "The Life" was in the nat'l tour of "Millie" as Muzzy and she was GREAT!

[lovinlife]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 2:48pm

Thanks Rathnait62!! I try.

[Marquise]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 2:51pm

Oooh. I couldn't think of a worse idea for a musical than one based on They Shoot Horses... Talk about depressing....

[MargoChanning]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 2:54pm

At least I was never bored at THE LIFE. And "The Oldest Profession" alone was worth the price of admission. The Cy Coleman score and Michael Blakemore's direction at least knew how to showcase all that talent on stage during the musical numbers -- they only got in trouble when they stopped singing and started talking, because of that awful story -- whereas, the cast in STEEL PIER was so regularly undone by the terrible staging and book that nothing, not even the musical numbers, worked. I've rarely seen so many talented people working SO HARD (and the effort was visible) for such little effect. I still remember poor Debra Monk working her ass off to put over "Everybody's Girl," and the number still just laying there because nobody bothered to (or knew how to) stage it properly. That show was somehow both numbingly dull and painfully frustrating at the same time.

[Marquise]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 2:55pm

Wow! Sounds like I didn't miss a thing then!

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 2:59pm

True, Margo, although every time I saw the show the audience went crazy screaming and applauding and whistling at the end of that number.

However, my heart bled for Ziemba, who was visibly working as hard as anyone I've ever seen on a stage, and for what? I marveled at the fact that she could do that show eight times a week, twice on Wednesdays and Saturdays.

[gstew]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 3:05pm

"Steel Pier" definately had book problems (characters were not fleshed-out enough) and although it was partially about a dance competition, there was WAY too much dancing and movement, almost to the point where it made the audience tired. I felt so sorry for the performers who were sweat-bombs! But the score is fantastic- really, really solid with gorgeous meloides, the kind you don't really hear anymore. Kander & Ebb did their homework as far as the sound of the time period, especially the chorus, on several songs which have the "layered" vocal harmonies you're likely to hear in movies of the 30's. Shows taking place in that time period often try to replicate this sound unsuccessfully, but it's really amazing in "Steel Pier". The Kristin Chenoweth wedding number in Act 2 was a show stopper, on stage and on the recording...it's a perfect take on the Jeanette MacDonald-operetta style of singing, which Kristin pulls off marvelously. I remember the shock of hearing her character sing in that full voice after hearing her character's squeaky, almost braying voice (she was the main female villan-type character that would get the boos and hisses in a 1930's movie theater). The show has an odd mix of fnatasy and reality that didn't completely work, and I'm sure if the creative forces had more time to fine-tune the show and not rush to get it out in time for the TONY's (I even overheard Fred Ebb at that time telling someone that "it's just not done yet") it could be a really magical show. But the score is glorious. I belive they did a slightly fine-tuned version in Australia a few months ago which was very well-received.

[lovinlife]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 3:05pm

Yep, I can still remember her dancing around the piece of scenery in Running... she was pushing herself to the max, and although most would argue that it's her job to make it look easy, I got more of an electric feel from her... It was actually the only show I saw her in where I was wowed by her triple-threat abilities. Contact was just terrible to watch while she was on. She looked like she had rushed into dance school, just to be in the show. And I wont even start with her performance in Chicago. I'm still dumbfounded as to the casting decisions made on a daily basis in that show.

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 3:11pm

"Contact was just terrible to watch while she was on. She looked like she had rushed into dance school, just to be in the show. And I wont even start with her performance in Chicago."

*blink*

[RentBoy86]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 5:12pm

Oh, I never realized Titanic opened right before the movie came out. I would think that would have def. helped its ticket sales. I thought they came up with it after the movie opened, which made me think they were just trying to milk the movie, but nevermind - my bad.

[joeybiltmore1]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 5:21pm

I totally agree about "Everybody's Girl" - there she was just standing there singing what was supposed to be a show-stopper. And we all WANTED it to be - God knows the show needed one. But there it sat. Ugh.

Ziemba's dance in Act Two was great and certainly pleased the crowd but seemed calculated to boost the energy of the show rather than to truly deliver an electrifying moment.

I believe Titanic had been open for several months before the movie came out, and while I'm sure interest in the film bouyed interest in the show for a while, I think the film's overexposure wound up hurting the show more than helping it.

[Enjolras77]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 5:51pm

Joeybiltmore you are correct. Titanic opened on April 23, 1997 and won the Tony Award for Best Musical on June 1st of the same year. The James Cameron movie version didn't open in the US until December 14th. The movie version had nothing to do with the stage show winning best musical. The only thing the movie might have done is give the musical's box office a boost and help keep the show open longer.

[frontrowcentre2]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 6:07pm

I remember Steel Pier was to be the sure hit of the year, seeing as the other big new musical contender was Titanic. RCA even said yes to recording SP before the Tony's and were putting Titanic on the back burner until after the awards because they assumed Titanic would surely close. (I was able to buy Steel Pier at the theatre before the Tony's and Titanic was not sure if they were going to be recorded at all.)



Hmmm..Your memory must be playing tricks. It was THE LIFE that SONY rushed out to be in stores and on sale in the theatre two days after the Tonys because they were sure IT would win the Tony.

RCA didn't get STEEL PIER and TITANIC out until late July. By then STEEL PIER had closed, so the CD was never on sale in the theatre. RCA had recorded TITANIC on April 27 (less than a week after it opened) and STEEL PIER on May 4 (about a week and a half after it opened.) There wasn't a time when they considered not releasing either.

Ethan Mordden has a good report on STEEL PIER in his book THE HAPPIEST CORPOSE I'VE EVER SEEN" n p.233-235. He cites it as a wonderful staging, though admits the book "runs out of content in Act Two." He calls the Kander & ebb score "one of their best." I agree, and I have enjoyed t repeatedly on CD. Seeing a community staging a few years ago reminded me that there is a lot of meandering book scenes among the songs but "First You Dream", "Willing to Ride", "Second Chance" and especially "The Last Girl" are superb compositions.

I came into the Richard Rodgers theatre to see STEEL PIER knowing only where it was set and that it was based on a standard ghost story. Seeing it along with TITANIC, THE LIFE and JEKYLL & HYDE all back-to-back over the Mon-Tue-Wed after the 1997 Tony awards was quite an experience.

Of course since it had just won the Tony the Monday night crowd at TITANIC was pumped and really cheered the show. (Everybody loves a winner, especially when it was considered an underdog.) But the performances were uninspired. It seemed like the director was so busy working on the stage effects that he left the cast to fend for themselves.

Lilias White was amazing in THE LIFE but the lyrics often sounded too poetic for these characters. The score was electric, and the staging was lively but the first act was overlong and had some saggy parts.

JEKYLL AND HYDE - the least satisfying f the 4 musicals and ironically the biggest hit! The stars (Cuccioli, Eder) were sensational but the lyrics were horrible and some of the music was too contemporary sounding for the time period.

STEEL PIER was problematic in the book (too much time spent on minor characters) and also because Stroman had to stage dances where the dancers were getting progressively exhausted, and that's not a lot of fun to watch. For all you Cheno fans, she really didn't make a huge impression in the role, and her number would not have gotten a standing ovation or been a showstopper because it gets interrupted. It wasn't until 2 years later in CHARLIE BROWN that she started attracting attention. (Of course, I love her on WEST WING!)

Interestingly, the critics gave more favourable notices to STEEL PIER (5) than TITANIC (1), THE LIFE (4) or JEKYLL & HYDE (4). After seeing all 4 shows I had to agree with the Tony voters: TITANIC was the best of the lot because its story still resonates with an emotional impact. But STEEL PIER would have been my #2 choice (and I would have given Kander & Ebb the vote for best score that year, not just for STEEL PIER but also for CHICAGO which was shut out in 1976.)


actually think that the supporting characters deserved MORE attention. There were some very interesting types there and I think it widened the "Depression has affected us all" scope of the piece.

Could be... but if so they needed to be fleshed out more and the script needs to make their desperation to win more complelling. Think of it like SURVIVOR: The Dance Marathon! :)

Updated On: 1/12/06 at 06:07 PM

[MargoChanning]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 6:12pm

Well, while JEKYLL & HYDE was the longest running of the group, it wasn't a hit and in fact was a pretty substantial flop, losing many many millions of dollars.

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 6:13pm

"For all you Cheno fans, she really didn't make a huge impression in the role,"

I couldn't disagree more. I was in the business at that time, and she was the surprise star of that show.

[frontrowcentre2]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 6:39pm

I was in the business at that time, and she was the surprise star of that show.

I'll have to go back and re-read the reviews to see what they said about her. It's a small and rather thankless role. Deb Monk made more of an impression in the supporting role of Shelby.

This thread has gotten me thinkng about this show. If they had actually followed the ghost story formula Bill would not have been paired with Rita as a dance partner and by the end she would have realized she had been having conversations with and s falling in love with a ghost, and that no one else could see him!

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 1/12/06 at 6:41pm

I honestly don't remember what the reviews said specifically - I'm talking about the overall buzz among industry folk. Debra Monk was a known quantity - no one was surprised that she was fantastic. Kristin came out of nowhere.

Updated On: 1/12/06 at 06:41 PM