LES MIZ: Giant plot hole??

Welcome Guest. Please Login or Register.

LES MIZ: Giant plot hole??

Posted: 9/15/14 at 4:51pm

This has always bothered me about this show. Not sure if it is just a huge plot hole or if there is some other explanation. Valjean turns himself in to save another man from being punished for the crimes committed by Valjean, that other man being mistaken for Jean Valjean. But couldn't they have just checked that other man's chest for the "brand upon his skin"? Javert says that will cement the deal. When they check for that brand they will not find "24601" branded on him. So why does Valjean feel the need to turn himself in when the proof will be found out on the other man's chest??

Am I missing something here?

LES MIZ: Giant plot hole??

Posted: 9/15/14 at 5:11pm

As the picture above shows, the prisoners don't seem to be branded with their numbers. They are branded with "GAL," universally identifying all the prisoners as "Galley slaves." Their numbers are on their clothes, which the other man mistaken for Valjean wouldn't have been wearing.

Updated On: 9/15/14 at 05:11 PM

LES MIZ: Giant plot hole??

Posted: 9/15/14 at 5:48pm

This is interesting: as pictured above the current revival doesn't have the numbered brand, but I could have sworn that the London and original cast have "24601" branded on Valjean and not the current "GAL." Or am I totally remembering this wrong?

And no matter what, then why does Valjean bother to rip his shirt open at the end of "Who Am I" (unless of course you're Ramin: no reason needed)? If the brand is correct, then all it says is he was a prisoner at one point. If the brand says "24601," then Mikey's point is totally valid. How the heck did they pick the wrong dude?

Updated On: 9/15/14 at 05:48 PM

LES MIZ: Giant plot hole??

Posted: 9/15/14 at 6:01pm

could the other man have been marked with a number, but then reinked over it - so everyone knew he was a prisoner, but couldn't see the number???

LES MIZ: Giant plot hole??

Posted: 9/15/14 at 6:15pm

From what I remember in the actual book, the man who is being tried as Jean Valjean accrued a whole bunch of former prisoners that have sworn up and down that they have the correct man. But then Jean Valjean reveals himself and tells each former prisoner a story from back when he was in prison with them to make them realize that they have the wrong man.

But I guess that really has nothing to do with the musical.

Does anyone remember if they did the shirt-opening during the recent tours? I cannot for the life of me remember if he ripped his shirt open or not.

LES MIZ: Giant plot hole??

Posted: 9/15/14 at 6:24pm

^^^^^^
When I saw the tour last January he did NOT open his shirt. I remember thinking that was odd because it seemed like pretty standard staging.

Keeping BroadwayWorld Illustrated

LES MIZ: Giant plot hole??

Posted: 9/15/14 at 6:44pm

That's what I thought! I remember searching online photos and media of Les Mis before going to see the show and I found it strange that they didn't do the no shirt part. Thank you.

LES MIZ: Giant plot hole??

Posted: 9/15/14 at 8:21pm

Promisepromises is right. In the book (as well as in real life), convicts didn't have brand (numbers or letters). In the book, Champmathieu (the other man) was arrest whit a branch of apple (thought to be stolen) and bring in the local jail. An other convict recognize him as Jean Valjean. When Jean Valjean see Champmathieu, he thought that he was the man he could become if he didn't change his life (a dumb brute).

In the trial, the witness didn't recognize Jean Valjean because of his transformation (a la Cinderella) and all the court thought that Mr Madeleine beacame crazy. So, to prove them that he is really Jean Valjean, he said things about the convicts (his old chain mate) that only the true Jean Valjean can know.

It is a very good part of the book, but I think that Boublil and Schomberg thought that it was too long for the musical, so they change it for the brand on his skin (first by his number). The change made for the letters was maybe because of the plot hole you mentioned. The letters are more generic, since an other man who went in jail would have it too.

But you're right, there is an error in the plot. But, unless you want the autor to write a new song about Jean Valjean trying to convince the others about his true identity, you have to go for the brand on his skin (and for Ramin's open shirt).

Maybe I do not speak English as well as you, but I can perfectly pronounce the names of all characters of Les Misérables.

Updated On: 9/16/14 at 08:21 PM

LES MIZ: Giant plot hole??

Posted: 9/15/14 at 11:49pm

"And no matter what, then why does Valjean bother to rip his shirt open at the end of 'Who Am I' (unless of course you're Ramin: no reason needed)?"

In the new production, I'm assuming it's so Valjean can prove he is Prisoner 24601 by showing off the "GAL" tattoo to the court, thereby labeling himself as an ex-convict. Now, I saw the London production quite a while ago, so I might be remembering wrong, but I could have sworn that Valjean did indeed have "24601" branded on his chest. If that IS the case, then the reason for ripping open his shirt would be self-explanatory. I guess the fact that the mayor himself was an ex-convict is shocking enough for them to arrest him, given the fact that he is lying about his identity. (There must be prison records somewhere that could indicate whether there was a "Monsieur Madeleine" ever locked up. If not, then they should know he's undercover.)

"Was uns befreit, das muss stärker sein als wir es sind." -Tanz der Vampire

Updated On: 9/15/14 at 11:49 PM

#10

LES MIZ: Giant plot hole??

Posted: 9/16/14 at 12:32am

The other thing that people seem to be forgetting is that Javert THINKS he could be Valjean. That + GAL tattoo (that a mayor wouldn't really have) + him knowing the prisoner number = definitely guilty.

#11

LES MIZ: Giant plot hole??

Posted: 9/16/14 at 12:51am

Other productions of Les Miz definitely had the brand be the 24601 number. (This is from the Walnut Street production from several years ago.)

"It's Phantom meets Hamlet... Phamlet!"

#12

LES MIZ: Giant plot hole??

Posted: 9/16/14 at 8:05am

Wow that Walnut Street tattoo is the blackest and most vivid tattoo I've ever seen. I guess the tattoo artist did it on the prisoner to make sure it could be read from the balcony!

#13

LES MIZ: Giant plot hole??

Posted: 9/16/14 at 2:52pm

I vaguely remember the original but from pics Ive seen, in the court room scene he opens his shirt and there is just a big ole mark like a bar straight across, not a number

http://www.flickr.com/photos/27199361@N08/ Phantom at the Royal Empire Theatre

← Back to Message Board

View all Videos

Tickets From $70

Tickets From $77

Tickets From $106

Tickets From $99