boycotting non-equity tours.- Page 4
boycotting non-equity tours.
re: boycotting non-equity tours.#75
Posted: 6/3/04 at 9:18pmWow, WayWicked, you sound JUST like WSS2 and Dude. Well, welcome to your new personality. :) :) :) :)
Broadway Legend Joined: 3/25/04
re: boycotting non-equity tours.#76
Posted: 6/3/04 at 9:23pm
WayWicked, that was incredibly stupid. JRB is passionate about this subject (like many of us who have not weighed in here yet) and doesn't deserve your ignorant vitriol.
An apology is in order.
re: boycotting non-equity tours.#77
Posted: 6/3/04 at 9:24pmAM I THE ONLY GOD DAMNED PERSON WHO LIKES MUSICALS?
Featured Actor Joined: 5/21/04
re: boycotting non-equity tours.#78
Posted: 6/4/04 at 2:09am
Hi Zola:
Perhaps you missed the little tantrum Mr. Professional threw early Thursday morning where he thought it propper to use swear words.
That's responsible and professional?
If so, then you to belong together.
Broadway Legend Joined: 8/2/03
boycotting non-equity tours.#79
Posted: 6/4/04 at 2:29am
I doubt anyone has missed ANYTHING. Especially the games being played. And I hardly think the throwing of a tantrum was by jrb. Seems to be in the court of someone attempting to blow things out of proportion...attempting to deflect.
And just to show that perspective is everything, I would proudly stand together with jrb. What you imply as an insult, I view as an honor.
Swing Joined: 3/13/04
boycotting non-equity tours.#80
Posted: 6/4/04 at 2:51am
I'd like to say first this whole thread is very interesting.
Now, about Equity versus non-Equity . . .
I live over 1300 miles from Broadway. And the area I live in Florida isn't exactly overtly cultural as far as shows go. We get what we get.
Quite frankly, (Going back to the Tour of Millie here) I saw Millie when it was in Clearwater (as close as it got to me) and I must say . . . the cast was fabulous. Equity or non-Equity (and again, I didn't know they were not Equity, I just wanted to see the show I'd heard so much about from a friend!) doesn't always matter. Talent can be found anywhere, and don't you think it's just a little unfair to boycott non-Equity tours? EVERY ACTOR NEEDS A PLACE TO START! They need to work their way up to becoming Equity, pay their dues, like all of you currently in Equity did before them.
Think on it, those calling for this boycott? How would you have felt however many years ago it was before you joined the union if someone were doing this to you? Pretty darn cruddy I'd think.
I've seen shows in many formats *coughs* and holding a card doesn't make you TALENTED. I've seen both crappy and excellent Non-Equity productions, and I've seen both crappy and excellent Equity productions. It all goes both ways.
*Steps off her soapbox* sorry, I just needed to get that out. I know it's likely been argued to death already anyway.
Broadway Legend Joined: 5/1/04
boycotting non-equity tours.#81
Posted: 6/4/04 at 3:04am
My My, the newbies have attitude, don't they? WayWicked, how about posting for a few more days before alienating yourself from every member of this board.
JRB thank you for your posts. I really didn't know some of that. You learn something new every day, don't you?
And how come you never call anymore? 
Broadway Legend Joined: 6/9/03
boycotting non-equity tours.#82
Posted: 6/4/04 at 3:08amActually, to clarify, iminsidethemusic, MILLIE is an Equity tour.
Broadway Legend Joined: 5/1/04
boycotting non-equity tours.#83
Posted: 6/4/04 at 3:09amSueleen, I love your icon! But where did you get that press photo of Kristin's replacement from???
boycotting non-equity tours.#84
Posted: 6/4/04 at 3:39am
I just wanna say that I in no way want to imply that I think that the current actors in non-Equity tours are not talented. The point that I want to make is that the current actors should be treated better, thus made Equity and guaranteed certain rights.
If you have no respect for how actors and stage managers are treated, fine, but the rest of us choose to fight for their protections.
Updated On: 6/4/04 at 03:39 AM
boycotting non-equity tours.#85
Posted: 6/4/04 at 5:10am
AND, iminsidethemusic, you had a desire to see the Millie that was on Broadway, correct? Therefore, you saw the Broadway approved tour and was able to see that. Most non-Equity tours do not have the rights to present the same production as what was seen on Broadway. And seeing how many folks depend on the Broadway tour as giving them what they could not see without traveling to NYC, I suspect you wanted the direct from Broadway production?
And, as I said before, there are plenty of ways for an actor to gain experience. But when they are considered grand enough to participate in a tour, all Equity asks is that a Producer pays them a fair wage and provides them with fair treatment---that is what Equity requires. Nothing more. Nothing less. THAT is what I am trying to convey!
Updated On: 6/4/04 at 05:10 AM
Broadway Legend Joined: 3/25/04
boycotting non-equity tours.#86
Posted: 6/4/04 at 6:31am
JRB, we belong together. There it is in black and white. Someone finally said it. Well....kinda. What he said was "If so, then you to belong together." I think he meant "two" but I'm not sure now.
And, I love dirty talk, so bring that filthy mouth right over here, big boy.
Broadway Legend Joined: 4/10/04
boycotting non-equity tours.#87
Posted: 6/4/04 at 8:56am
Here is a quote from yesterday's Atlanta Journal and Constitution regarding the RENT tour that is town this week:
"Is this rent still worth paying?It was tr`es hip and edgy when it opened on Broadway and won all the big awards. But that was eight years, a bunch of road shows and countless cultural changes ago. Does "Rent" still have it? Not sure - especially in this production, which is non-Equity (which means nonunion, which usually means a cast of less experienced, lower-paid performers)".
It seems like one of our local theatre critics is making an attempt at educating the general populus about Equity vs. Non-Equity.
boycotting non-equity tours.#88
Posted: 6/4/04 at 9:29amToo many people seem to be missing the point here. Boycotting non-equity tours is NOT boycotting the (possibly) great talent on stage - it is boycotting the PRODUCTION and those responsible for getting it sold.
boycotting non-equity tours.#89
Posted: 6/4/04 at 10:43am
"Equity doesn't want to cancel the current tours--they want to make them Equity." Like Aida? That tour was promptly cancelled. What would the strikes, boycotts and picketing accomplish? If the producers do not wish the tour to be Equity (which is their right), then they shut down the tour, which Equity celebrated in the case of Aida.
"And, as I said before, there are plenty of ways for an actor to gain experience. But when they are considered grand enough to participate in a tour, all Equity asks is that a Producer pays them a fair wage and provides them with fair treatment---that is what Equity requires."
Not so. Equity is picking and choosing which tours should be eligible for their cast conversion as you mentioned earlier...
"Tours that are presented by Equity theatres or union houses should be Equity without question. These are the tours that have upset Equity. I don't think Equity was bothered by the smaller bus and truck tours."
And why do you think that is? Equity has not threatened to boycott any of the smaller tours, only the ones that directly threaten their business. You say they want to protect the actors, but only the actors in the tours they choose. But what happenes when the actors in the tour they specifically chose to perform as non-union actors join Equity, finish the tour, and go back to their homes in cities like Houston with extremely limited Equity work? They pay their $1100 initiation fee for the one tour and go back to mostly non-Equity cities. Which is the most likely scenario.
"Equity is not elitist or exclusive--you have to either be that good to get cast on the spot, or earn it in the way that I did"
Those are two ways to get cast, plus the new tour option, but there is one interesting anomoly in Equity admission requirements. Though they require someone to work an equivalent of 50 weeks in an Equity-contracted theatre, or perform under an Equity contract by permission of the producer (who pays a fee to Equity which may include a length of employment clause at Equity's request), now they say "if you're in a tour we think is good enough, we'll let you join Equity, but we might boycott, picket or strike the tour, causing cancellation of the tour and your unemployment, and celebrate it to boot!", but there is also the admission of those that requires no stage work at all - the Four A's Affiliation described on the Equity website "Membership is also available by virtue of prior membership in a performing arts sister union (such as Screen Actors Guild or the American Federation of Television and Radio Artists). Applicants must be members in good standing of the sister union for at least one year, and must have worked as a performer under the union's jurisdiction. (This sister-union policy is not applicable to non-resident alien members.)"
Admission to the Screen Actors Guild is granted one of three ways:
Working in a principal or speaking role ONLY ONCE in a SAG production.
Working a minimum of three days as a background character (non-speaking) on a SAG production.
Being a member of Equity, AFTRA, or other affiliated unions.
Hmmm.....
So I can work my butt of for years to gain points to be deemed a worthy enough actor for Equity on stage, tour in a show Equity deems worthy enough, or work as a featured extra without having to speak a work in a film for 3 days and hold a SAG card for a year.
Like I said before, I'm not anti-Equity. I just think Equity has good intentions, but poor practices.
"Then you gripe that Equity hasn't made more small theatres Equity--which I believe is actually a theatre's choice, not Equity's."
And why do you think so many theatres choose not to be Equity? What is Equity doing to protect all those actors in non-Equity theatres (most of the US)? Where are all those boycotts and strikes and meetings and concerns? They are nonexistent. Just like they are nonexistent for the small bus and truck tours. Equity is only interested in protecting certain actors. Not all of them. And certainly not even a large percentage of them. That is what makes them elitist. If Equity did control the majority of theatre and did not have such absurd admission requirements, then I would probably have much more respect for them, but they are going about gaining control in the worst possible ways. They are trying to behave like a standard union in one of the most non-standard job fields representing a tiny fraction of the workers on a national scale, yet trying to make decisions that will affect national productions.
Sorry, jrb, but you won't change my mind on this. If Equity is working out for you, then I'm very happy for you.
"I knew it wouldn't be any use to be Equity outside of NYC, as the tours and NYC shows audition in NYC, and, yes, most regional theatres cast out of NYC, using only non-Equity locals. But, I was given the choice to decide when I joined by earning the points."
Unless of course, you want to tour. Equity does not want to allow that decision. And non-Equity tours audition outside of NYC as well, so.....well, I don't need to state the obvious.
boycotting non-equity tours.#90
Posted: 6/4/04 at 6:05pm
Well, Matt, we will have to agree on disagreeing. I feel like I have sufficiently answered the questions with all the energy I can muster. We are just running in circles and then into brick walls. :)
I will just conclude with saying that if any of you want to be on Broadway, Off-Broadway, National Tour, or a lead in an Equity theatre production--if that level of theatre is what you are aspiring to do, you will have to join Equity to do so--either on your own within the EMC or by simply being cast in an Equity role from an open audition. Whether you like it or not--whether you agree with me or not, that is how the business works.
Read up on Equity at http://www.actorsequity.orghttp://www.actorsequity.org>http://www.actorsequity.org
It was confusing as all heck before and even after I joined. But eventually it all makes sense. And, best wishes to all of you regardless of what theatres you want to work in--just take care of yourselves! :)
JRB out!
(for the moment)
Updated On: 6/4/04 at 06:05 PM
boycotting non-equity tours.#91
Posted: 6/5/04 at 1:16am
how many non-equity tours are out there right now?? the only one i can think of is miss saigon.
correct me if i am wrong but are equity actors allowed to act in non-equity shows?? if so why jeniffer paz (she plays kim) in the non-equity tour?? it says in her bio that she played kim in one of the broadway tours so that must mean she is equity right? or can non-equity acots act in equity tours??? thanks :)
Featured Actor Joined: 5/21/04
boycotting non-equity tours.#93
Posted: 6/5/04 at 7:08pm
Thank you MisterMatt for being one the few here who can actually articulate their opinion in a rational, clear manner and present the facts without accusing others and using childish deflection techniques. I appreciate your contributions....
unlike the contributions of others who are removed by the owner of this board because they decide to use swear words to other members.
(just waiting for the double talk that will follow....
:) :)
boycotting non-equity tours.#94
Posted: 6/6/04 at 12:24am
May 21, 2004
NYC Central Labor Council Passes Resolution Supporting Equity
SUPPORT OF ACTORS' EQUITY IN ITS FIGHT FOR A FAIR AND EQUITABLE CONTRACT FOR BROADWAY AND TOURING SHOWS
www.nycclc.org/news_views/press/Resolutions.asp
Whereas, for 90 years Actors'Equity Association has struggled to improve the lives of actors and stage managers; and
Whereas, because of the solidarity of its members and other working people, Actors' Equity has been able to secure fair wages, hours and working conditions for its 45,000 members; and
Whereas, Actors' Equity, through its work on behalf of its members, has built Broadway theatre into the world's greatest theatre; and
Whereas, as a result, Actors' Equity is a symbol of excellence in American theatre; and
Whereas, Broadway is now the number one tourist attraction in New York City, generating over $3 billion per year for the City; and
Whereas, the touring shows, that grow our of Broadway hits, revitalize other cities and generate millions of dollars in revenue throughout the country; and
Whereas, Actors' Equity is currently engaged in contract negotiations with the League of American Theatres & Producers; and
Whereas, the wages, benefits, and working conditions for Broadway actors are at stake in these negotiations; and
Whereas, Actors are facing an erosion in job opportunities, and Broadway Road Shows are being operated more and more on a nonunion basis, thus threatening the quality of the Broadway brand as well as undermining the conditions of Equity members; and
Whereas, Actors' Equity members are facing an assault on their health care benefits and are fighting for full funding for their health fund; and
Whereas, if Actors' Equity loses its fight for a decent contract, it will affect all working people in the New York metropolitan area; and
Whereas, Actors' Equity is fighting the proliferation of nonunion tours across the U.S.; Now, Therefore, Be It
Resolved, "If it's NOT Equity, it's NOT Broadway"; and, Be It
Resolved, that the New York City Central Labor Council supports Actors' Equity in its "Fight for Broadway and the Road" contract campaign; and, Be It
Resolved, that the NYC Central Labor Council will do whatever it can to assist Actors' Equity--from participating in demonstrations and rallies to communicating with members and the broader public; and, Be It Finally
Resolved, that this resolution be forwarded to other unions, councils and labor organizations, as well as other organizations to which working people belong, such as churches, synagogues and mosques, as well as City, State and Federal elected officials and office holders.
(Approved by Executive Board May 20, 2004)
boycotting non-equity tours.#95
Posted: 6/6/04 at 12:30am
April 4, 2004
If `Cheap' Shows Are Broadway, Velveeta Is Cheese
By Frank Rizzo
Hartford Courant, Sunday, April 4, 2004
Copyright, Hartford Courant, Sunday, April 4, 2004
Reprinted with Permission
Now more than ever, theater fans attending Broadway touring shows are wise to remember the shopping adage: Buyer, beware.
Like quick-weight-loss programs, amazing real-estate deals and solutions for improved sexual performance, advertising come-ons for touring shows sometimes promise far more than they deliver.
They promise Broadway shows.
They lie. Some shows that are part of a "Broadway" series have as much to do with Broadway as Velveeta has to do with cheese.
Blinded by the "Broadway" moniker, familiar logos and memories of past performances, theater goers can easily be duped into thinking the show they will be getting is straight from Broadway.
Many are knock-offs, cheap shows that reflect little of the original production. Look at their programs, and in the actors' bios you'll find they are just-out-of-school kids in starring parts whose major credits include work on cruise ships, theme parks and university productions.
It would be hard to tell the difference if one were to just look at the ad for the show, which has the same logo as the original Broadway production. Theaters aren't likely to volunteer the information that they are presenting a non-union show. You probably won't find that information in most newspaper, radio or television reports in advance of the production. (The Courant attempts to indicate the quality of production whenever possible.)
In the past, there haven't been many non-union shows in the Broadway series lineup in major venues. If there is one, it's seen as an occasional lapse in programming necessitated by perilous economic times.
But non-Equity touring shows are increasing and threaten to dramatically change the theatrical landscape, and the quality of shows we see on our best stages in Connecticut.
In the past, the practice was for a Broadway hit to launch a national union tour and play large theaters in major markets, including Hartford's Bushnell Center for the Performing Arts, New Haven's Shubert Theater and Wallingford's careerbuilder.com Oakdale Theater. This would be followed by a second wave of touring - still with union performers and musicians - playing smaller markets or returning to major cities for a second, third or even fourth time.
After several years, a non-union tour finally would emerge, designed to play the hinterlands, smaller cities or less grand theaters for one- or two-night stopovers.Theater-goers at that point would know what they were getting. They knew they weren't seeing anything resembling the original Broadway production but rather a show with inferior production values and no stars but that would hopefully be entertaining. For that trade-off, they would pay considerably less for tickets.
But now there's the possibility of non-union shows of recent Broadway shows hitting major theaters in prime markets for longer runs - and at significant ticket prices.
Several years ago, Susan Stroman's revival of "The Music Man" became the first major Broadway show to hit the road directly as a non-union show. That production played the Bushnell on its tour and was met by demonstrators outside the theater. It was not a very good production. (Harold Hill looked like he had just graduated from college.) Still, the show was lucrative for producers and presenting houses across the country.
The current revival of "Oklahoma!" (which Stroman choreographed) is touring as a non-union show. That production played the Oakdale last month, and the top ticket price was $71. (That price didn't include a $2 surcharge if you bought a ticket on the day of the show. That ploy is the latest attempt to milk more bucks out of the consumer, a scam that rivals the so-called "restoration" surcharges that some theaters charge and that have nothing to do with the frescoes in the lobby.)
Many fear that more non-union shows of major Broadway productions may be in the wings, especially with the high cost of producing shows.
The unions have tried to be flexible with some shows - such as the tour of the Broadway revival of "42nd Street" - and lowered its actors' minimums. (Union actors on tour get $1,354 a week, plus a $100 per diem for housing and food. The actors also get health and pension benefits.) But these producers had to clearly demonstrate to the union that the shows could not hit the road without concessions. The union's thinking was that some show is better than no show.
Now, other producers want concessions for their shows as well.
Actors' Equity, the actors' and stage managers' union, began negotiations for a new contract last week with the League of American Theaters and Producers, the group that produces shows for Broadway and the road. Both sides want to avoid a strike like the one that shut down Broadway last spring. That labor dispute with the musicians' union centered on the minimum size of orchestras for musicals. The musicians were supported by the actors' union, and after closing down Broadway for several days, a contract was agreed upon, with the size requirement reduced but not eliminated.
It is unclear what the depth of support would be if a strike is called for June, when the contract expires. There's much at stake. Road grosses exceed $640 million annually. (Broadway grosses amount to more than $720 million.)
But what's also at stake is the quality of shows that theatergoers at places like the Bushnell and Shubert have come to expect. If future shows are done on the cheap, that might be the reason for audiences to turn their backs and seek entertainment elsewhere. And would corporate sponsors for Broadway series want to be associated with hack productions?
A new message just might emerge: Let the producers beware.
E-mail: rizzo@courant.com
Broadway Star Joined: 6/11/03
boycotting non-equity tours.#96
Posted: 6/6/04 at 3:57am
>>>But what's also at stake is the quality of shows that theatergoers at places like the Bushnell and Shubert have come to expect. If future shows are done on the cheap, that might be the reason for audiences to turn their backs and seek entertainment elsewhere. <<<<
This is the situation I find myself in. I have been disappointed in the last 4 or 5 road tours I've seen, and at the prices being charged, I am leery of the good money after bad syndrome.(Discounted tickets on Broadway are cheaper, it's just that pesky air fare and hotel room that add up....)If the show was recently on Broadway I want to see the Broadway version. I don't know if the tours I saw were Equity or not, but they were flat and uninspiring and not even 3rd cousins twice removed to what I have seen on Broadway.
But I would really like to know if I am seeing an Equity show or not. First of all, I philosophically support the Union, knowing what kind of hell-hole it would be without someone to attempt to draw a line in the sand. Secondly, if a non-Equity tour is charging as much (or maybe all of $10 less) than an Equity tour, then I will be damned if I will hand that overpayment to a Producer skimping on wages. The fact is that with the high ticket prices I am paying the money to pay the cast and crew well, and the Producer is essentially cheating them. I won't support it.
Provide all that the ticket price implies, Equity or not, and I'll give the show a chance. Too many more substandard ones, and I'll save my money and go to NY every few years and see whatever is hot at the time. My theatrical experience will have gaping holes in it, but at least I won't be disheartened.
Broadway Legend Joined: 5/17/03
boycotting non-equity tours.#97
Posted: 6/6/04 at 2:57pm
Hey ...here's a new idea that just might catch on, Equity babies!
:)
Why not let the AUDIENCE decide if they want to pay the price they're charged for non Equity tours? Huh..don't ya think that might be a goo idea? If Joe Stupid Public gets ripped off by these horrific non Equity tours, why would he continue to support them with his money? And guess what happens if Joe Stuipd Public doesn't spend money to buy a ticket??
Oh, that's right. Joe Stupid Public thinks it's a Broadway tour cause it's on the Best of Broadway package. He's goes to one non Eqity show and doesn't like it. So instead of not spending his money on future non Equity shows, he keeps going to other non Equity shows...why? Because Joe Stupid Public is..you guess it..stupid!!!
Are you getting it or do you need a tutor? :)
But, as we can see in previous posts, Equity babies :) know first hand that Joe Stupid Public is stupid and can't make up his own mind as to what is GOOD or what is BAD theater. Only by the grace of Equity is Joe Stupid Public be able to figure this out for themselves.
How have we managed to survive for so long with out the superior, guiding hand of Equity? God knows we can't exist without them.
:) :)
boycotting non-equity tours.#98
Posted: 6/6/04 at 3:04pm
Oh my--WayWicked and Mr. Tuttle have the same signature:
:) :)
And the same hysterical argument.
Hmmmmmmmm?
Updated On: 6/6/04 at 03:04 PM
Swing Joined: 6/27/03
boycotting non-equity tours.#99
Posted: 6/6/04 at 5:18pm
Perhaps this was already addressed, but how does one find out if the show on tour is equity or not? Is there a database of touring shows that specifies this or is it determined from the respective show's website?
Thanks!
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