phantom — Page 2

And of course, there's the film.

I had to laugh when I saw that sentence. I was just about to comment on how such a simple little thread had suddenly started dusting off all these never-ending arguments over Phantom...and then it just struck me as funny that you tacked a mention of the movie onto the end of your post. My God, the can of worms that could open up...

---

Kquill, you want my answer to why the show has been playing for 19 years if it sucks? Well here you go. And by the way if this coms a cross as an angry rant then good that's what I want. The reason why this show has run for as long as it has is adverdisment. It has been able to get people to wanna buy a ticket. Just cus it's gotten people interested enough to buy a ticket doesn't mean that the people who saw the show like it. The term longest running show on broadway is not as much an honor as it is a sales pitch. it has the producers (or producer in this case) say " Come see our show. desite the fact that we aren't telling you if its good enough. We have genereated enough interest via advertising to get people to wanna come inside and spend their money on our show." That's whats being said with the title of longest running show. It makes tourists who by the way are so goddamn stupid think it must be good. Making money and being good are two totally different things.

---

Guy,

I think you're 1) oversimplifying and thereby insulting the tourist theatergoer and 2)just being stubborn.

Like I said, the truth lies somewhere in between.

Yes, the show isn't good enough to have earned the title longest running show on bway and all the connotations that title carries with it.

HOWEVER,

The show DOES have an appeal, one of the biggest is the following:

People like opera, but can't understand it for the language barrier and a lot of English Opera is either very old (Purcell) or very new (Britten) and therefore not accessible.

Webber gave them the granduer, the pomp, the circumstance, the huge sets, the huge voices, and gave it an mysterious setting. What could be more crowd pleasing?

But he also gave them good melodies, pleasing music, a love story, betrayal, chases, masks, costumes, falling scenery, fire, trap doors, skull masks, men in tailsuits and women in gowns and monsters in capes.

I'm sorry, it's fun, it's clever in places, it drags in others, it's pitifully pandering to an audience (The title song) but also takes the time to have TWO scenes with almost exactly the same music with heavy dramatic effect (The Notes scenes), heavuly operatic stuff, or at least operettaratic (if that's a word) and it's well written (kinda), not GREAT, but certainly better than Ishtar and certainly better than a lot of other shows that I've seen.


and ultimately, he breathed life into something that was dying for want of attention. He's a smart businessman, but also an artist (of whatever caliber you want to call him).

I live LOTS of music. Lots of music touches my soul, from Nirvana to Coltrane with lots in Between (Britten is one of my favorite composers), Phantom does not touch me in that way, but I certainly appreciate it.

There's no way that your assertion that it's a total waste and a complete piece of crap hold real weight in any argument, but its an argument that can't be proven, and it's not an argument worth having, because its just an opinion.

---

your right on a few counts. One, I know I am stuborn at times. Second of all, I worked at a couple of theatre ticket desks in a couple of hotels in the city. My friends I have made working there felt it was like the movie clerks. In that it would be a great job if we didn't have to deal wit the annoying people who asked us some of the dumbes theatre qustions ever. It's sorta like how someone doesn't like how one would ask a question on the board and not even take the time to search and see if somone asked it before they started a new thread.

And before you guys jump down my throat for telling me that what I am about to say is controdicting sp? what I prevously said. I know it is so save your breath.

Before I go spend money no matter how much it is to see a musical I listen to the cast album first. There are shows I don't like but I can see why people would like them and there are shows I love. Phantom is the only show I listend to and I actually said to myself how could people like this. I personally have always thought of ALWs writing as blan and plane. After listening to the album ( which I borrowed from a friend) I actually didn't understand why there were so many people who liked it. And I thought it was god aweful. Prior to listening to it I looked at the story online and I figured that there are lots of musicals wthat have a bad story but good music to help the fact they have a week overall story. Phantom didn't. The whole overly romantic stuff between Raoul and Christine and Christine and the phantom I thought was really dumb and stupid. And I hated the music as well.

However, ( And this is where the contridictory sp? part comes in) if you like it then ok. Do I personally think it is the worst show to ever grace the world of Boradway? Yes i do. Am I looking foward to it closing? You bet your ass. However, I have the same general feeling I do about Phantom as I do for a show like Tarzan ( I know they are in two totally seperate leagues). The general feeling I have about these shows is that I personally think that they suck and should not be on broadway. However, I am glad that there is someone taking in live Broadway theatre.

---

Howver Kqull I want to say this. If you want me to say that phantom MUST be soooo sooo good just because it's played for 19 years (19 years way to long)then that dog won't hunt. You gotta understand how a business works. The producer has done a great job in generating interst in the show. That leads into people getting tickets ect ect. Howver, there is NO F*CKing way I will say that. Espically if you can't see that in a business espically in a show. Let me give you a theory as to why disney shows run for so long. Being that Camron has the moneyI would not be suprised to hear he is doing this to. One theory as to why Disney shows run so long is that Disney takes soime of the money that they have and puts it back into the show to keep it playing and to generate more interst about the show ect. I would not be suprised to hear Camron did the same thing. And don't give me this SH*T about how the producers say " people are comming cus they love the show." Its all about getting more money back into the show to keep it to run. If your a producer like Camron or Disney, then you have a SH*T load of cash at your disposel and you can use it to keep your show running.

think bout that.

---

If you had listened to one word I said, you'd know that I am not asking you to say that it's "soo soo good". I am asking you to admit that there is something more besides just "good producing." Of course the hype of the show is a big part of it, but I believe that the show delivers to people once they get in.

Your argument that it is one of the worst shows ever, but its success is because it happens to be produced well is absolutly ridiculous.

I'll ask you again - tell me how long it took after opening night for the prodicers to establish this hype?

That may answer why the show has run so long, but not why songs from it are so popular...and have been recorded over and over.

---

Why do people think ALW's music is "unsophisticated"? Have you people been educated in music theory and composition enough to really know that? I have not been, but I have heard people who have, analyze his music and were puzzled when i mentioned that people don't like him. I know he doesn't have the same kinds of skills Sondheim has, and I know he's isn't as likeable...but that doesn't make him bad. The man id incrediblt successful, and that's really why people hate him so much.