CBS & The Amazing Race issue apology to Vietnam veterans- Page 2

[John Adams]

Posted: 4/1/13 at 4:31pm

Comments like:

>>Or just showing a country that we couldn't strong arm into democracy still standing, I guess.

and

>>So...... THE AMAZING RACE dared to show what another country's idea of a memorial was and they need to apologize? I actually find THAT kind of offensive.

and

>>And we killed how many Vietnamese people? Seriously, anyone who isn't smart enough to realize that the country we fought a war against woul probably not think too highly of us and have monuments of their own the same as we have here should maybe stick to Sesame Street or something that doesn't require much brain power.

show a lack of understanding in regards to why the US was involved in the Vietnam conflict.

At the time of the conflict, Vietnam was a divided region. They were defined on maps as two, separate regions: North Vietnam and South Vietnam. North Vietnam (Communist) and South Vietnam (anti-Communist) were at odds long before the US got involved.

The US did not try to "strong arm" the country of Vietnam into the concept of Democracy. The US allied with South Vietnam (as did other countries) when North Vietnam tried to "strong arm" the Republic of South Vietnam into becoming a Communist state.

Initially, the US' involvement (under the Eisenhower administration) was in an advisory capacity only. Eisenhower sent military advisers to train the South Vietnamese Army. Under the Kennedy administration, US troops were sent to bolster the South Vietnamese Army, and involvement of US troops escalated under subsequent Presidents.

NO - the US was not being completely altruistic in allying with South Vietnam's anti-Communist war with North Vietnam. Kennedy/Cuban Missile Crisis - remember that? But it's incorrect to believe that the US was "strong arming" the country of Vietnam to accept Democracy. There *was no* Vietnam at that time. The initial intent was to assist the Republic of South Vietnam in retaining their anti-Communist state. ...and YES, that would have benefited the US, also.

Regarding the comment, "THE AMAZING RACE dared to show what another country's idea of a memorial was and they need to apologize?":
The B-52 memorial is an "accidental" memorial of sorts. The American plane was shot down by the North Vietnamese Army in 1972, during Operation Linebacker II. Its wreckage landed in Hun Tiep Lake and has never been removed.

But it's not that "THE AMAZING RACE dared to show what another country's idea of a memorial was" that irks so many people. It's the (IMO) thoughtless juxtaposition of the downed American plane (and all the history and emotions that represents) with the *requirement* that Americans memorize and repeatedly perform a song that praises Communism (per the lyrics printed on the screen) in order to complete their task.

Regarding the comment, "anyone who isn't smart enough to realize that the country we fought a war against woul probably not think too highly of us and have monuments of their own":

We did not fight a war against Vietnam. Vietnam did not exist at that time. We allied with SOUTH VIETNAM, and eventually withdrew our financial and military support. Congress began restricting support (including troops) to Vietnam in mid-1974. South Vietnam lost both financial and military support from the US. Additionally, there was an oil shortage which rendered much of South Vietnam's military equipment unusable.

North Vietnam, however continued to receive financial support from Communist bloc countries. The US began our withdrawal of troops and financial support in mid 1974. Saigon (the capital of South Vietnam) fell in April of 1975 and the war was over.

With much respect to SeanMartin (and a *very* heartfelt and respectful, "Thank You for your service"), the US did not lose the war; South Vietnam lost the war. It was never "our" war - which was such a HUGE factor regarding the dissatisfaction many felt about our involvement in the conflict during those times.

SeanMartin, your comments touch me very deeply. I don't completely agree with *all* of your specific words, but I empathize and share in the emotions behind them.

"PTSD is a big problem. Know what your country is doing about it, for all the thousands returning home with it?

Not a ****ing thing."

You and all our Vets deserve better. I happen to be one who emails my state representatives about this specific issue. I would love it if others did the same.
Updated On: 4/3/13 at 04:31 PM

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

Posted: 4/1/13 at 4:32pm

Sit down, John.

[Jordan Catalano]

Posted: 4/1/13 at 5:56pm

LOLOLOLOL

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 4/1/13 at 5:59pm

The turkey is a truly noble bird.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 4/3/13 at 11:19pm

SeanMartin, I realized when I first read your long post I came away with the impression that you had fought in Vietnam, but I just re-read this thread and I realized it doesn't say that. I do come away with the impression that you experienced combat first hand. Is that a correct assumption?

[SeanMartin]

Posted: 4/3/13 at 11:23pm

Yes. And yes, it was Vietnam, the last two years we were there. I was a naval medic, ostensibly serving on the Constitution but actually attached to a Marine unit on land. I got to see it all fall apart. It wasnt pretty.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 4/3/13 at 11:33pm

It's weird, I had never noticed the link to your comic work that you have in your sig file before but I went and poked around and then looked you up on Wikipedia. Your page says you were born in 1960. But the page with links to two other Seans Martin and you says you were born in 1950 which obviously makes more sense. Then you click on your link and poof, they make you ten years younger. Lucky dog.

PS When did Xenia become John Adams?

Updated On: 4/3/13 at 11:33 PM

[SeanMartin]

Posted: 4/3/13 at 11:35pm

Really? I didnt set up the Wiki page, so I kinda ignored it. Okay, thanks for letting me know about it; I'll get that squared away.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 4/3/13 at 11:47pm

Then I landed on "Raider in Canada." The part I watched was kinda neat.

[SeanMartin]

Posted: 4/3/13 at 11:58pm

Glad you enjoyed it! Randy did such an excellent job on that. He's got another documentary on archive.org: Goat Boy and the Music Machine — about this guy in Kentucky who restores antique musical instruments. Fascinating stuff. I've been trying to encourage him to get back into the documentary game and finish the one on Rae Bourbon, but no luck.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 4/4/13 at 12:16am

I think it would be a gas if he did a documentary on Randy Rainbow.

[Yero my Hero]

Posted: 4/4/13 at 5:36pm

It's the (IMO) thoughtless juxtaposition of the downed American plane (and all the history and emotions that represents) with the *requirement* that Americans memorize and repeatedly perform a song that praises Communism (per the lyrics printed on the screen) in order to complete their task.

Okay, really quickly, that is not at all what the task was. They had to sit through the performance (which, in my opinion, was shown as nothing but goofy) and then memorize a series of characters (remember, the contestants had no idea what they meant at the time) that were displayed on prop umbrellas at the end.

No performing a song about socialism. Not even being forced to memorize and recite a phrase glorifying socialism (I believe the translation was "glory to our youth," or something like that).

If you are going to go on about how offensive something is, shouldn't you see it first? You're as bad as the protestors outside THE SCOTTSBORO BOYS or THE TESTAMENT OF MARY.

Okay, carry on.

Sean, I know some of those "professional vets" too. I never served, but many of my friends from my hometown did, and frankly, their Facebook posts sicken me. It's not PTSD, it's a desire to relive and hold onto the last time they felt powerful.

Updated On: 4/4/13 at 05:36 PM