Ca Gov. denies clemency for Stanley "Tookie" Williams

[cheezedoodle]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 3:56pm

Announced at 12:41pm pacific time.
Clemency

[trpguyy]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 4:26pm

To anyone thinking "he should get to live, because he's a changed man"... rememeber this?

http://www.cnn.com/US/9802/02/tucker/index.html

[DG]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 4:27pm

I don't think I'll be going out anywhere tonight.

[NYadgal]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 4:30pm

Good.

It has been 25 years since the jury sentenced him to death.
It is time for the sentence to be carried out.

He never showed remorse for what he did. He never acknowledged his victims.

...and I am not necessarily a supporter of the death penalty, but in this case I believe the Governor made the right decision.

[Elphaba]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 4:34pm

I am in a quandry over this one. I do not support the death penalty, but I also do not want my tax dollars going to supporting him in prison.


If anything good comes of this, it will mobilize the black vote and get Arnold out of office......

California should really be a madhouse tonight.....

[Calvin]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 4:35pm

If anything, Karla Faye Tucker showed the hypocrisy of some of the more ardent death penalty supporters -- like Pat Robertson -- who suddenly changed their position when it was a born-again Christian white woman facing the chair.

[ErikJ972]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 4:39pm

" I do not support the death penalty, but I also do not want my tax dollars going to supporting him in prison."

It actually costs more to execute someone then to have them spend life in prison.

[melissa errico fan]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 4:42pm

Elphaba, the cost of housing a prisoner for the term of their natural life is between $500,000 and $1 million. The cost of housing a death row inmate is in the multi-millions.

I do not support the death penalty in ANY case. It's barbaric.

[kate2]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 5:00pm

I think it's more barbaric to get away with killing 4 people and starting a gang.

[ErikJ972]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 5:10pm

Well he's in prison...so he didn't really get away with it.

[melissa errico fan]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 5:12pm

Sorry, Kate, but killing to prove that killing is wrong makes no sense. Would you piss on your floor in an effort to stop your dog from pissing on the floor?

[Elphaba]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 5:13pm

Melissa and Erik, please site your sources used to verify your numbers. I'd be interested in seeing them

[brdlwyr]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 5:15pm

I am with MEF, I also believe that society has evolved to a point where under our current standards of decency, it is no longer constitutional and will be struck down by the Supreme Court in the next 30 years.

[ErikJ972]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 5:16pm

I'm still at work so I don't have much time to really look now but here's one website you can take a look at.
Death Penalty Costs

[cheezedoodle]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 5:20pm

"Would you piss on your floor in an effort to stop your dog from pissing on the floor?"

Are you REALLY equating the housebreaking of a pet to cold blooded murder?

[melissa errico fan]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 5:25pm

It might sound silly and shallow to you, but it is essentially the same situation. Why would you kill somebody to show that killing is wrong? It's been proven over and over again that the death penalty is NOT a deterrant. It's state-sanctioned murder. So, in some sense, there is similarities between capital punishment and pissing on the floor. In both cases, people think that doing one thing will deter others from doing the same thing. And it just doesn't work that way.

[kate2]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 5:27pm

i just see it as "an eye for an eye..."

[DG]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 5:29pm

kate - which, as we have been told, leads to a blind and toothless world.

[bwaysinger]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 5:29pm

MEFFY, to me, the real hypocrasy is that we just don't out and out admit that our prison/punishment system is not about rehabilitation. Obviously, it isn't. So we should just admit it's punishment for what you did, "equal" (as we say it should be) to the crime you committed, and stop trying to pretend we're rehabilitating people.
Only in that sense can people justify the death penalty.
I admit I don't know a lot of the specifics in this man's case. Specifically, if he has showed no remorse in the actions he committed, then I do not necessarily think clemency is deserving because he's changed...but I'm still not sure I support the death penalty in any but the harshest of instances.

[melissa errico fan]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 5:31pm

Beautifully put, Bway.

[jasonf]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 5:32pm

I think the death penalty is too easy for a lot of these criminals. Life in prison is a much scarier/harder sentence to share - especially if it is a maximum facility prison. Plus, I tend to think, like Abraham in the Bible, if even one innocent person is killed it's too much.

[bwaysinger]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 5:37pm

Thanks, Mef. But that's just the way of things in our country, full of hypocrasy from the top right on down the line.
Pro-life my ass.

[DBillyP]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 6:04pm

Echoing, bwaysinger, the following will be released tomorrow from Rev. Michael Piazza, Dean of the Cathedral of Hope and President of Hope for Peace & Justice:

No Redemption?

The state of California killed Stanley Tookie Williams today. It was an act of state-sanctioned revenge. Perhaps no execution in recent years has more conclusively proven that retribution, not restoration, is the purpose of the U.S. justice system. Once upon a time, in a land of distant memory, people dreamed of the possibility that a criminal might pay for his crime and be transformed into a productive citizen. Mr. William’s execution proved that this is no longer our desire, let alone our intent.

By now, we all know his story. A former gang leader, Tookie Williams spent the last several years of his life writing, speaking and working to persuade other young people to take a course different from the one he chose. He produced a considerable stockpile of evidence that he was a changed man who wanted to make restitution for his crimes. Still, the government killed him today, ensuring that he would make no further contribution to society.

Yes, Tookie Williams was a criminal convicted of murder. Although there was some question about the police techniques used to obtain that conviction, and even if you believe that he is guilty, this state-sponsored killing says more about us than it does about him. It speaks to the state of our soul as a nation.

Jesus once told a parable which is recorded in the 25th chapter of the Gospel of Matthew. It is a parable about the “day of judgment.” In it, Jesus makes clear that one factor on which we will be evaluated is our treatment of those who are in prison, concluding that, “Whatever you do to the least, you do to me.” Well, if we take Jesus’ words at all seriously then the United States is in grave peril.

Although we constitute only 5% of the world’s population we have more than 22% of the world’s prisoners. We have a higher percentage of our citizens in prison than any other nation on earth—higher than Russia, higher than China, higher than Cuba. A larger percentage of blacks are in prison in America than were ever imprisoned during the apartheid of South Africa.

Prison conditions in the United States are worse than in any western democracy. No attempt is made at restoration or rehabilitation, and, as a result, the rate of recidivism is unsurprisingly high. When you consider that a significant number of those in prison were guilty of self-destructive drug abuse crimes you realize that our justice system is actually designed to create criminals rather than redeem them.

Ironic, isn’t it, that the vindictiveness of our criminal justice system is driven largely by a faith system centered around redemption? Yet we continue to warehouse and execute people as if we had no hope that transformation is possible. Killing Tookie Williams is a clear statement that we either don’t believe he was redeemed or we simply don’t care. We just wanted him dead.

One last confession. I am overwhelmed with frustration. For years I have tried to call us to care about the rate of execution in Texas and the inhumane treatment of those in prison. So far it feels as though I have failed to make a single convert. Please tell me what I need to do to get someone, anyone, to care. No, this may not be a topic that affects you personally, but that may be the very reason why people of compassion and faith should care.

[JerseyGirl2]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 6:06pm

How can someone be pro-life and pro-death penalty? I will never get republicans.

I am not anti-death penalty. I lost a first cousin to a horrific, premeditated voilent act. It was gruesome and something none of us will ever forget. I would rip the man apart with my bare hands if I could. That makes it hard for me to see much of a problem with it. I do agree that it is not about rehabilitation. It makes me sick to think this guy is alive somewhere and my cousin isn't. That's why I wouldn't make a good judge, I suppose.

[cheezedoodle]

Posted: 12/12/05 at 6:09pm

"How can someone be pro-life and pro-death penalty? I will never get republicans."

How many Republicans do you think are on death row?