I'm with the conservatives! NO MORE SOCIALISM!- Page 2

[Unknown User]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 10:58am

Abba I'm assuming that was a joke. Happily, I don't think conservatives have instituted non-socialist fire & police protection.

[HDThoreau2]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 11:07am

Are you implying that capitalism is bad? Or, are you simply saying that police and fire protection, along with the military fall under the jurisdiction of our government?

Are you making the case for socialized health care? That is much different from having private insurance to access privately managed health care.

[Chevstriss]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 11:14am

no my story about the fire was not a joke. It was 1975 and we had just moved to TN and didn't know about the Fire dues.
They let things burn to prove their pt. The neighbors cared enough to get the dog outta the house (they were feeding while the people were on vacation.)

and we always just filled our pool w/ a hose. Took about a week. Usually a $300 water bill back then

[HDThoreau2]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 11:32am

I guess it wasn't supposed to be a real debate between socialism and American capitalism.

it was just a couple of liberals spewing propaganda.

[Calvin]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 11:34am

Wow -- Ron Paul mania really HAS swept the nation!

[Craig]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 11:45am

When people who don't agree with your view (henceforth labeled Liberals) they are spewing propoganda. But people who agree with you are spewing what then?

[JustAGuy]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 11:45am

"I guess it wasn't supposed to be a real debate between socialism and American capitalism."

You couldn't particpate in a real debate if you had to. In a real debate cutting and pasting isn't allowed

[HDThoreau2]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 11:50am

Are you cutting and pasting? I sure haven't in this thread.

It sounds like you grabbed a mantra (Bush bombed building #7), and you aren't letting go of it.

No need to cut and paste a question.

[JustAGuy]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 12:00pm

"It sounds like you grabbed a mantra (Bush bombed building #7), and you aren't letting go of it."

Bush bombed building #7? Wow, who'd have thought it?

[Unknown User]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 12:01pm

NO HD I'd dead serious-- I think government has a role in improving the lives of it's citizens. Fire departments, police departments, education-- AND medical care.

CONSERVATIVES, when faced with something they dont like, will conduct research. They realize that "National Health Care" polls well- most people say it's a good thing. So they re-name it "Socialism" and that polls poorly. So they scream "SOCIALZED MEDICINE!" and frighten people away from it. I was just making a point that government often engages in similar programs, but no one screams "SOCIALISM" about firemen.

It's kind of like how conservatives scream "DEATH TAX" even though no such tax exists. Sounds so scary, doesn't it?

[Craig]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 12:05pm

Joe..

But the Peacekeeper missile sounds pretty as if it were decorated with daisies and marigolds!

[HDThoreau2]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 12:09pm

Joe...

Yes, fire, police, education, roads, etc. I agree.

Nationalized, government run health-care, No!

If it polls so well, why didn't Bill and Hillary get it through in 1993-1994?

[Craig]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 12:10pm

Using HDT logic, Bush should no longer be President. Right? HDT - things that poll badly shouldn't exist. What's Bush's approval rating lately?

Just using more of that stellar HDT logic!

[Unknown User]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 12:13pm

HD you KNOW why it didn't get passed: Conservatives, funded by the major medical conglomerates, spent millions of dollars to fight it. You must remember Harry & Louise, HD. Plus, of course, the Mainstream Conservative Media went out of their way to tell people that it was BAD.

[HDThoreau2]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 12:17pm

Craig, surely you don't believe you were using my logic?

I only said it polled badly. I never said that the Clinton plan should not exist. It was great that is existed. It not only polled badly, congress defeated it with great ease.

If Bush were on the ballot today, he would be defeated even by John Kerry. That doesn't mean that GWB should not exist.

Logic, you say? I'm not sure where you are headed with that.

Amnesty was defeated by an outcry of phone calls from the American people. It was defeated by the greatest bi-partisan coalition in more than a decade. The point is, if the American people (the voters) don't want it, it won't happen.

[Unknown User]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 12:23pm

Yes HD-- which is why the conservatives MUST fight and fight hard to get their side out there. Average Americans KNOW that our helth care sysytem is a mess. Everyone has their horror story. In America, a major illness is the gateway to bankrupcy court for so many Americans.

So you have to TELL them that they are still better off with this broken system than any other solution. You have to get out there and tell them Michael Moore is WRONG before you even see the movie. You have to warn them that national healthcare is SOCIALISM.

[HDThoreau2]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 12:24pm

Fighting hard is the very foundation of America. We fought hard to earn our independence.

Only a hard core liberal would decry hard work.

[Unknown User]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 12:48pm

I wasn't decrying-- I was just pointing out the Orwellian overtones and refuting it.

Out of curiousity, do you have health insurance? Is it a good plan? How much do you pay?

[grnsmwhr]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 12:48pm

It didn't get passed because conservatives misled the public about what the proposal actually entailed. The plan as proposed was for the uninsured as a group to work with private insurance companies for an affordable rate much like large companies get group rates for their employees.

The public is extremely uneducated about issues and consequently easily swayed and manipulated. The Republicans are way ahead of the Democrats in knowing what words scare people and how to use the media to get their message across.

[Craig]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 12:51pm

Well now it seems like you're accusing the Republicans of using (what's that word HDT bandied about referring to liberals... ah yes...) Propaganda...

Clearly you are a NYC elitist liberal, grnsmwhr :)

[Unknown User]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 12:53pm

Yes, GRN, plus the conseratives have a might accomplice in the mainstream media which is overwhelmingly conservative and can relelntlessly beat the drum for their...uh...propaganda.

Thanks Craig that WAS the word I was looking for.

[YouWantitWhen????]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 12:54pm

And when are you going to enlist?

[HDThoreau2]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 6:33pm

I thought that Craig's logic meant we had to do away with the incessant use of the term "chickenhawk."

[Unknown User]

Posted: 7/2/07 at 9:47pm

HD could you explain that? It doesn't make any sense. Maybe you should stick to Cut n paste.

[HDThoreau2]

Posted: 7/3/07 at 12:18am

Just think about it Joey, you'll get.

Do we need an IEP for you?