Imagine No Religion- Page 13

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 12/12/07 at 3:50pm

"Just because people 200 years ago didn't know about bacteria didn't mean that they didn't die from infections."

Yes, but then they went to a better place and had a nice reunion with every dead person in their life except for the ones who stole candy or murdered somebody. Their party was held someplace really bad.

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 12/12/07 at 3:52pm

namo you seem to understand things perfectly. why are you so hostile to the truth?

[GuitarGirl]

Posted: 12/12/07 at 3:53pm

"Again, I can not place your argument GG, reading what you write seems to indicate that all the various views of God are somehow true at once-"

That was not my point. My point is not that all views are at once true. My point is that despite the fact that their are many different views of God, the general idea of something greater being out there is shared. And people have good reasons to place their faith in whatever it is they are placing their faith in (most of the time).

"But there have also been a great many atheists (or deists, looking at the founding fathers of our country) who also made great contributions in the world, and to say that their beliefs (or lack thereof) invalidate their contributions is just as false. "

I never said that their contributions didn't count. They do. But the general feeling on this thread has been that the contributions of the believers don't count. I have heard good reasons for people not believing in God, both scientific and non-scientific. Just because I do believe doesn't mean I invalidate them, I just feel that they are not enough to convince me to drop what I believe.

" Can you prove to me that religion is evolving and always offering new answers to new questions being raised in this ever changing world, or does religion merely offer one simple easy answer that it has always offered?"

Well, the Church evolved from it's very beginnings to what it is today (i.e. the priest not saying mass in Latin and more people participation). As for answers to questions posed, I think just as scientists are looking for knew answers to problems they come across, religious people are also doing the same. Look at C.S. Lewis: he tried, through his fiction, to answer some of the questions we have about God. Philosopher Peter Kreeft also has many books that try to answer questions or offer evidence to mysteries of faith. Which leads me to my next response...

"This is your problem. You're seeing the forest without seeing the trees. Even fifth century monks were searching for the trees. A skeptical view of religion has a lot more to tell you about why we are here than blind faith ever will. "

I do ask questions about my faith. I've challenged my faith at times. Anyone who knows me would agree. Some of my questions haven't been answered yet. I think that they could be. What I'm not convinced of is that they can be answered by science, or saying that God doesn't exist. I'm not saying it's out of the question. I just don't think that a belief in God should be written off as insignificant or something to be laughed at.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 12/12/07 at 3:57pm

All I asked was that people "Imagine No Religion." But man did some people get defensive and seem to take that as a direct personal attack.

Which is what such people always do.

[GuitarGirl]

Posted: 12/12/07 at 4:03pm

I never came into this feeling personally attacked. I just said that in my own life I couldn't imagine no religion. It was you who later said that those who believed had "irrational" and "laughable" ideas, which is insulting.

"Which is what such people always do"

There you go again. You must really love insulting and condescending people.

Would you rather have a world in which no one defended their beliefs?

Updated On: 12/12/07 at 04:03 PM

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 12/12/07 at 4:07pm

i feel personally violated.

[CJR]

Posted: 12/12/07 at 4:29pm

That's because, personally Papa, you want to be violated.

Updated On: 12/12/07 at 04:29 PM

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 12/12/07 at 4:35pm

no, i want to violate you, dear. now seriously, get that thong off and sit down here on santa's candy cane.

[Roninjoey]

Posted: 12/12/07 at 4:51pm

You guys are totally offending my belief system. Effin' gayssss.
That sybillant s is very serpentine.

"Well, the Church evolved from it's very beginnings to what it is today ... Look at C.S. Lewis: he tried, through his fiction, to answer some of the questions we have about God. Philosopher Peter Kreeft also has many books that try to answer questions or offer evidence to mysteries of faith..."

Aren't these merely the evolutions of fiction though? New variations and justifications updated to suit each new generation? Once they discovered the world was round, that was that. I mean facts of that nature, not new postulation. If we had anything like that there'd be a lot more basis for religion :P

[GuitarGirl]

Posted: 12/12/07 at 4:58pm

Peter Kreeft was not writing fiction. C.S. Lewis expressed his ideas through fiction, although he has written non-fiction books, one of which talks about why their is evil and pain in the world.(I haven't read it.) Some of the ideas have been widely accepted by Christians. Others are pretty new (Peter Kreeft's work, at least, is pretty recent).

[Q]

Posted: 11/12/08 at 2:32am

*bumped*

Because I DO imagine . . .

[LePetiteFromage]

Posted: 11/12/08 at 2:43am

Updated On: 2/21/09 at 02:43 AM

[Q]

Posted: 11/12/08 at 2:52am

"I believe religion has a purpose and enriches lives."

I believe that the yearning for truth and meaning has a purpose. I just don't think that buying into the constructs of these manmade control systems fits into that category.

Systems for socialization and mutual discovery and shared awareness? SURE - I'm all for it.

I have yet to see many religions that fit that description.

[LePetiteFromage]

Posted: 11/12/08 at 3:03am

Updated On: 2/21/09 at 03:03 AM

[Q]

Posted: 11/12/08 at 3:17am

But, at some point, TRUTH should play a part. I agree it's a personal journey - but when the path demonstrates less and less connection with discovered truth, it becomes inviable. At least to my eyes.

[LePetiteFromage]

Posted: 11/12/08 at 3:43am

Updated On: 2/21/09 at 03:43 AM