NY Mets Mess

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 7/5/08 at 1:38pm

I think Johan Santana is seriously thinking he made a big mistake signing with the Mets.

The sooner they realize they are not going to win with this team & start trading off pieces to rebuild, the better it will be for all.

The Mets should trade & get young players for

1. Santana - He would be ecstatic to get out of this mess.
2. Beltran
3. Wagner

Release

4. Delgado
5. Orlando Hernandez
6. Alou

Build your team around

1. Wright
2. Reyes
3. Church
4. Maine
5. Pelfrey

Bring up the few good minor leaguers left who are good & hungry

[frogs_fan85]

Posted: 7/5/08 at 1:42pm

I say keep Beltran. As much as he has seriously angered me in the past (SWING THE BAT!!!), he is still a solid player and I doubt nobody would take his contract. I think Delgado, El Duque and Alou are finished with this contracts after this season, so I'd just keep them for now. Not that Orlando and Moises might even play again this year. Pedro is probably going to go after this season too. Pelfrey has done so much better as of late.

AND it is not Santana's fault that the Mets aren't winning his game. Yesterday he pitched eight innings and gave up two runs. Manuel should have left him in for the ninth inning, just for the intimidation factor. Granted it is weird that Maine has more wins than he does, but I find it to be more off the odd coincidence that the Mets aren't giving him run support than his poor performance.

[adamgreer]

Posted: 7/5/08 at 1:49pm

They're not going to release Delgado, Alou, or Hernandez. All three of them have contracts that expire at the end of the year. You can bet they won't be back, but no sense releasing them when they'd have to pay them through the year anyway.

The one player they SHOULD release, and eat the contract for, is Louis Castillo, whose 4 year deal (coming off knee surgery!!) is the single biggest reason why Minaya should be fired.

Also, Santana isn't going anywhere. He's pitched pretty well. He's got seven wins, and off the top of my head, I can think of four games he left with a lead in that the bullpen blew. Add that to a few games where he pitched great, but the offense didn't score (like last night), and he really should be a 13 game winner right now. Don't even get me started on the completely idiotic decision to pull him last night. This business with pitch counts is getting completely out of hand.
Updated On: 7/5/08 at 01:49 PM

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 7/5/08 at 2:35pm

Re pitch count

If it were high during a perfect game( going 3 & 2 on most hitters) would the party still be pulled? Imagine Cy Young or Nolan Ryan on a pitch count. Sheer madness.

Minaya seems to go after mostly washed up hispanic players. Giving 4 years to castillo boggles the imagination but kind of proves my point,. Look at the roster & the minors & those called up & you will see what I mean.

If they performed who would care but now that Willie's gone Minaya has hard questions to ask

1.Nady for a erratic Perez & nearly washed up Roberto Hernandez
2.Castillo gets 4 years without having any knees left
3.Fernando Tatis
4.El Duque
5.Alou - gets injured tying his shoes
6.Trading a young Mike Jacobs for an aging Delgado
7.Angel Pagan
8.Endy Chavez - Marginal player

The Mets have been the most mismanged team, on the field & off, in sometime. The Mets make 1 boneheaded trade after another (Scott Kazmir anyone) & totally rape the farm system in the process & have nothing to show for it.The same story over & over. They do not learn from teams like the Marlins or the Rockies.

Updated On: 7/5/08 at 02:35 PM

[frogs_fan85]

Posted: 7/5/08 at 4:37pm

Angel Pagan was really good early on in the year before he got hurt. Endy Chavez batted .306 in '05 and has a great arm in the outfield. The Nady/Perez trade did not make any sense at the time, but Perez' pitching in the '06 NLCS seemed to make up for it. I agree with both of you though about Castillo. How do you give a guy a four year contract while he's recovering from double knee surgery?

Santana was only on 95 pitches last night when he was pulled. A guy like should be able to easily throw 110-120 pitches, if necessary!

I personally trace the Mets' problems back to the off-season before 2007, when Minaya allowed Darren Oliver, Chad Bradford and Roberto Hernandez to all sign with other times for relatively cheap prices. Say all you want about Sanchez, Heilman and Wagner and their good performances in 2006, but those three guys were all severely under-rated that year. Especially Darren Oliver, who could actually start and did a few times that year. That was particularly needed last season when El Duque and Pedro kept getting hurt.
Updated On: 7/5/08 at 04:37 PM

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 7/5/08 at 5:06pm

Another Met problem is that while pitch count is the be all & end all , the bullpen has been used to the point their arms are ready to fall off. Due to pitch count, among other things, many pitchers do not go deeper into the game so the bullpen must be used day in & day out.

Updated On: 7/5/08 at 05:06 PM

[frogs_fan85]

Posted: 7/5/08 at 5:15pm

Pitch counts should really only be used for a someone who is coming off of an injury. If a starter feels they can go another inning, then the manager should let them. The pitcher knows their body better than the pitching coach or manager ever could.

[adamgreer]

Posted: 7/5/08 at 5:25pm

Unfortunately, the pitch count issue is not unique to the Mets. Most major league teams are engaged in it now.

[frogs_fan85]

Posted: 7/5/08 at 6:26pm

Exactly right. It's nearly endemic at all levels of the game, including high school.

[StickToPriest]

Posted: 9/23/08 at 12:33am

A mess is right.

[The Ghost of Kringas]

Posted: 9/23/08 at 12:36am

It's a mess. It's a mess. Time to grow, time to go adolesce. Adolesce.

[LePetiteFromage]

Posted: 9/23/08 at 12:39am

Updated On: 1/22/09 at 12:39 AM

[Jane2]

Posted: 9/23/08 at 9:43am

"At least they're kinda cute."

Kinda.

I can't believe they're screwing up again. What is this, third season in a row coming this close?

[violet72]

Posted: 9/23/08 at 6:31pm

well I am a Phillies fans, but I have to say I do almost feel sorry for you Met fans, but at least the Brewers are choking as well so you might get in as the wild card...

Seriously something needs to be done in the off season, they need to get rid of some of the cancer on your team (like the Phillies did when they traded Wagner, believe me he is a cancer)

So I kinda feel bad for you Met fans, but not really cause my beloved Phillies are benifiting. I have been a Phillies fan since I was born and had to sit through many collapses, so I know how you all are feeling

[frogs_fan85]

Posted: 9/23/08 at 9:56pm

I love that two and a half months ago we wanted to get rid of Delgado and since then he's been the best player in the league.