#26
Posted: 3/9/04 at 2:41pm
Actually, Catholic (private) schools are exempt from corporal punishment laws. So, being backhanded by a nun isn't a problem. Finding a nun, on the other hand ...
This could only happen in my school — Page 2
#27
Posted: 3/9/04 at 2:41pm
i did a little time teaching in the nyc public schools (district 4, dp) and i don't think it's about teacher pay. i was content with what i was making and that was before the last round of raises went into effect. when i was in school teachers merely had to teach their subject. students had the option of learning or not leanring but those who chose not to learn and who disturbed the others were removed from the classroom so that learning could continue. in the school at which i taught, there was no mechanism by which an unruly student could be removed from class. unless there was a full fledged riot or if someone was bleeding profusely, teachers were expected to deal with the problem until such time as it could be arranged to have one of the 4 security officers for the school show up. which usually happened after one was well into the next class and the last period had turned into a free for all in which nothing was learned excpet that the teacher (me) was pretty good at dissing students when pushed.
what i'm trying to say is that i don't think that more money is the solution. i think that more teachers would help. i think that more experienced teachers in the worst schools would help. currently the worst school have the most inexperienced teachers because those with any seniority (other than you dp) have little or no desire to be there. heck, at my school, the average experience among teachers was 2 years. only 4 of us had actually passed the exams. for 6 of 15 teachers english was a second language which was difficult if not impossible to master. so more experienced teachers in the most difficult schools would be a start.
the biggest problem though is a total lack of respect for the teachers that comes not from schools or the administration or the city, but from the parents themselves. when we had a fight, it was a question as to whether to call the parents since usually the parents would arrive and continue their children's fight, which would mean the cops would have to be called. parents never wanted to hear that their child was doing badly, or causing problems. those things were usually the teacher's fault or some other kids. i had parents threaten me of assigning their kids homework over the holidays. it's a total lack of respect for education in general. and i have no idea what to do to turn it around short of mass executions and a school sponsored torture regime.
what i'm trying to say is that i don't think that more money is the solution. i think that more teachers would help. i think that more experienced teachers in the worst schools would help. currently the worst school have the most inexperienced teachers because those with any seniority (other than you dp) have little or no desire to be there. heck, at my school, the average experience among teachers was 2 years. only 4 of us had actually passed the exams. for 6 of 15 teachers english was a second language which was difficult if not impossible to master. so more experienced teachers in the most difficult schools would be a start.
the biggest problem though is a total lack of respect for the teachers that comes not from schools or the administration or the city, but from the parents themselves. when we had a fight, it was a question as to whether to call the parents since usually the parents would arrive and continue their children's fight, which would mean the cops would have to be called. parents never wanted to hear that their child was doing badly, or causing problems. those things were usually the teacher's fault or some other kids. i had parents threaten me of assigning their kids homework over the holidays. it's a total lack of respect for education in general. and i have no idea what to do to turn it around short of mass executions and a school sponsored torture regime.
r.i.p. marco, my guardian angel.
...global warming can manifest itself as heat, cool, precipitation, storms, drought, wind, or any other phenomenon, much like a shapeshifter. -- jim geraghty
pray to st. jude
i'm a sonic reducer
he was the gimmicky sort
fenchurch=mejusthavingfun=magwildwood=mmousefan=bkcollector=bradmajors=somethingtotalkabout: the fenchurch mpd collective
...global warming can manifest itself as heat, cool, precipitation, storms, drought, wind, or any other phenomenon, much like a shapeshifter. -- jim geraghty
pray to st. jude
i'm a sonic reducer
he was the gimmicky sort
fenchurch=mejusthavingfun=magwildwood=mmousefan=bkcollector=bradmajors=somethingtotalkabout: the fenchurch mpd collective
#28
Posted: 3/9/04 at 2:55pm
I think that is *the* funniest thing I've heard in days. Most of the kids I go to school with aren't too bright; I've definitely heard comments like that. Can't do anything but laugh I suppose. I wish I could think of some of them offhand. *sigh* I can't wait to graduate.... 109 days.
A work of art is an invitation to love.
#29
Posted: 3/9/04 at 2:59pm
Papa, I totally agree with you that it's all about parenting... my parents were always there to help all 5 of us with homework and such... and we all had our chores to do, nothing was handed to us, we had to EARN our allowance, and EARN the right to TV, and all that... if i had a tantrum in public, you can be sure i got a swat on my ass... and no one called the police because poor little joey was getting beaten...
#30
Posted: 3/9/04 at 3:01pm
But doesn't all of taht come down to money? When I say that teachers are underpaid and that is the problem, I'm thinking that because of low salaries, there are not enough people willing to go into taeching and thus, classrooms are overcrowded and teachers cannot properly do their jobs. Then you add the fact that many schools are under funded and can't get the equipment, books and technology that teachers need to do their jobs. It seems to me that money is the start of the solution to so many of these problems.
The one thing money can't help is the fact that so few parents are involved with their childrens schooling. School has become a place to dump the kids off for the day rather than a place where parents and teachers work together to ensure a proper education. I wasn't, of course, serious in saying taht parents who ddin't attend confrences were slapped around. However, when my parents didn't attend, the Mother Superior/Principal called and asked what would be a more convenient time for them to come in and take some responsibility for their childs education.
The one thing money can't help is the fact that so few parents are involved with their childrens schooling. School has become a place to dump the kids off for the day rather than a place where parents and teachers work together to ensure a proper education. I wasn't, of course, serious in saying taht parents who ddin't attend confrences were slapped around. However, when my parents didn't attend, the Mother Superior/Principal called and asked what would be a more convenient time for them to come in and take some responsibility for their childs education.
http://www.danperezgallery.com
#31
Posted: 3/9/04 at 4:39pm
hmmm theres a lot of things that happen in my skool
i have a science teacher who think aliens are out to get him and his best friend is "chester the maget"
I have an orchestra teacher that yells at you if you look at her.
my Social Studies teacher is cool....but looks like a pirate with his 3 piercings. (that he got at clairs boutique)
o yes...and my gym teacher is a horse..seriously! =D
i have a science teacher who think aliens are out to get him and his best friend is "chester the maget"
I have an orchestra teacher that yells at you if you look at her.
my Social Studies teacher is cool....but looks like a pirate with his 3 piercings. (that he got at clairs boutique)
o yes...and my gym teacher is a horse..seriously! =D
"Chicago is it's own incredible theater town right there smack down in the middle of the heartland. What a great city! I can see why Oprah likes to live there!" - Dee Hoty :-D
#32
Posted: 3/9/04 at 4:49pm
As far as teachers' salaries go, here's what I think-given that teaching is rated among the top three most stressful jobs along with firmen and air traffic controllers, the pay is not nearly enough to compensate. We are also not permitted the "20 and out" that firemen are. There is an early burnout for teachers.
So-if you think that a teacher's salary is plenty, and use the excuse that we have a short day and plenty of vacations (as many people do), well, I have to disagree. There's almost no amount of money to compensate the degree of stress involved with teaching. One reason I had to retire early is that due to stress, I was always getting sick, I was angry a good deal of the time, and I just wasn't happy. I saw myself going to an early grave if I didn't get out!
So-if you think that a teacher's salary is plenty, and use the excuse that we have a short day and plenty of vacations (as many people do), well, I have to disagree. There's almost no amount of money to compensate the degree of stress involved with teaching. One reason I had to retire early is that due to stress, I was always getting sick, I was angry a good deal of the time, and I just wasn't happy. I saw myself going to an early grave if I didn't get out!
<-----I'M TOTES ROLLING MY EYES
#33
Posted: 3/9/04 at 5:00pm
I was lucky enough to live in a fairly rich suburb of Indianapolis and I have to say overall it was a very good school. We always ranked high in the state in ISTEP (Indiana Standardized test) If you failed they gave you tutoring to help you pass it. We had our share of troublemakers, but we also had "alternative school" that the bad ones were sent to and that usually straightened them up. We had two 45 minute flex periods on Tuesday and Thursday which you could use for doing homework or just talking quietly even if you weren't disturbing someone trying to work or make up a test. When students would start failing because they weren't trying they would be forced to sit and do their work while a teacher watched them during these flex periods. (This was rule instituted my junior year and it cut the number of kids failing and dropping out of school by 90% I believe. We also had "Free cookie Day" from the principle whenever a club, music, or sports team did really well. Most of us respected our teachers too, if you caused trouble they'd just make you leave. I heard people in my class complaining about how horrible our school was and I just wanted to tell them to shut up. I knew we had it great compared to a lot of schools, but all they could focus on was themselves. I think a lot of it is attitude. Teachers need to find ways to capture the students imagination and I think that is becoming increasingly harder to do. I went to a Catholic school and they did not use physical punishment, but they had the stare of death that would strike fear into anyone. Catholic schools don't use it because they are afraid of lawsuits from parents claiming abuse. I swear if any of my teachers were mad they looked like they were ready to kill. AHHHH FLASHBACKS! The look and the talk in the hall way straightened EVERYONE up.(I did get in trouble by a nun earlier this year. I was riding a cart for bringing materials into a retreat center down a sloped sidewalk. 
She asked me what I was doing, and I knew better than to lie.) Haha. Some nuns still wear the whole habit but depending on the order it could be just a necklace or maybe a pin that signifies they are a nun.
She asked me what I was doing, and I knew better than to lie.) Haha. Some nuns still wear the whole habit but depending on the order it could be just a necklace or maybe a pin that signifies they are a nun.
My avatar is a reminder to myself. I need lots of reminders...
#34
Posted: 3/9/04 at 5:42pm
Well, yes, I agree that location is everything. I did my student teaching in Westport, CT. The school was more like a country club. Driving to it each morning, I passed farm after farm, with cows lazily grazing. The school looked like a house out of Architectual Digest. Many of the students were children of artists and celebrities, and were culturally advantaged. What a pleasure! Too bad the very next year I found myself teaching in the inner city, in schools which were in constant states of disrepair, over 40 kids in a class, classrooms being held in coat rooms, etc, you get the picture!
<-----I'M TOTES ROLLING MY EYES
#35
Posted: 3/9/04 at 8:29pm
I was working in the school's library this morning (actually I was reading messages on BWW, but don't tell anyone!) and the morning announcements were read over the PA system. One announcement read: "Any students of Italian/American descent should should report to the college office for important scholarship information". Our school is 80% black or Caribbean and 20% Hispanic. Didn't anyone in the college office figure out that there ARE NO Italian/Americans in the student population? Geeze! The libarian and I howled with laughter (You didn't expect any students to be in the library, did you?)
"Long live God!" (GODSPELL)
#36
Posted: 3/9/04 at 10:23pm
I am in my second year teaching middle school in an extremely overcrowded classroom, and get all transferring students for one particular class because the other teacher who does that class can't handle them. The area has extremely poor and upper middle class students. Yes, I've absolutely had rough times and pondered at the lack of intelligence and/or apathy of some of my students. Yes, I could get payed more. Yes, many times I've called parents to have them hang up on me, or not communicate because they don't know English, or be angered because their child can do no wrong. But it's worth it for those shining times when a student who has never succeeded elsewhere does so in my class, or when we have intelligent conversations where the students surprise me. There are benefits of teaching. I just had to change what I taught to ensure I was still able to teach the concepts in a way that the students would be interested in learning them.
#37
Posted: 3/10/04 at 7:52am
just as a slight tangent to the original message has anyone seen this site before? THis is a site from Berkeley CA
In Passing
In Passing
Updated On: 3/10/04 at 07:52 AM
#38
Posted: 3/10/04 at 10:23am
I agree with a lot of what has been said above...especially Papa's post (go figure). I also work in an innercity school (although not as a teacher) and while I agree there is often a lack of respect for teachers (from parents, administration, etc) what amazes me is the complete lack of respect many teachers have for their students. It's almost daily that I walk by a classroom and I hear a teacher cursing at their students. Just yesterday I heard a teacher tell a student to "get their black ass outta here." Last week a student told me that I was the only teacher (even though I'm not a teacher..us adults are lumped into one category) she had that doesn't curse. How can we expect better behavior from our kids if we don't provide a model for it in the school, because most of these kids certainly don't have good role models at home....
#39
Posted: 3/10/04 at 6:19pm
haha
#40
Posted: 3/10/04 at 7:51pm
Well I hate to say it but I worked for a school supply place and you would not BELIVE some of things the teachers did/asked. Unreadable handwritten orders, totals that I still don't know how they added what they had up to that amount and questions that were out of this world.
"I have a butterfly garden and we're going on Christmas Break. If I put the caterpillars IN THE FREEZER, will that stop them from turning into butterflies until we get back?”
“I don’t want to buy the colored sand to put in jars unless you can tell me how to get it back out WITHOUT mixing the colors.”
“How many bubbles will a bottle of the bubble soap make?”
And of course, the ever popular chalk. There are 144 sticks of chalk to a gross. That means there are 12 boxes of 12 sticks of chalk to a case. Chalk was only sold by the case.
We had more returns because they only ordered ONE box (12 sticks) of chalk and couldn’t understand why we shipped so many boxes over what they ordered but a CASE was only three or four dollars!
Sorry, DP but there is always another side to any story. I’m not saying that you’re in a good position. I don’t blame you wanting to retire. It sounds like an awful school.
D
"I have a butterfly garden and we're going on Christmas Break. If I put the caterpillars IN THE FREEZER, will that stop them from turning into butterflies until we get back?”
“I don’t want to buy the colored sand to put in jars unless you can tell me how to get it back out WITHOUT mixing the colors.”
“How many bubbles will a bottle of the bubble soap make?”
And of course, the ever popular chalk. There are 144 sticks of chalk to a gross. That means there are 12 boxes of 12 sticks of chalk to a case. Chalk was only sold by the case.
We had more returns because they only ordered ONE box (12 sticks) of chalk and couldn’t understand why we shipped so many boxes over what they ordered but a CASE was only three or four dollars!
Sorry, DP but there is always another side to any story. I’m not saying that you’re in a good position. I don’t blame you wanting to retire. It sounds like an awful school.
D
Updated On: 3/11/04 at 07:51 PM
#41
Posted: 3/11/04 at 8:26am
I'm not denying that there are teachers who are guilty of what's been posted, but I entered the field for my love of kids and of sharing my knowledge and expertise. I was able to remain undaunted for at least the first 15 years despite the uphill battle. What finally beat me down? The fact that no one seemed to care what I was doing in the classroom except me. I taught a specialty subject and was looked upon as a free period for the teacher. In all my years of teaching, not one teacher showed any interest in what I was doing with their class. Of course I had a percentage of students who were interested in my subject matter, and excelled, but not enough of them cared a bit about school period. The administration didn't care, the parents didn't care, the students didn't care. All who cared were my supervisor and myself. It only mattered if I showed up to work, so that the teachers had their free period. After a while, I didn't care.
Pardon me for blowing my own horn, but I was recognized and rewarded (not monitarily) for excellence in teaching, and
received all glowing reports. I had many students come back to see me, thanking me, etc. etc. Enough of that- it's amazing to
me how many fine teachers are able to perservere in such difficult conditions.
As I said before, yes there are bad teachers, but the majority of them are working their a**es off. Don't judge the profession by some stories you've heard about a few.
Rant over, thanks! (:^)
Pardon me for blowing my own horn, but I was recognized and rewarded (not monitarily) for excellence in teaching, and
received all glowing reports. I had many students come back to see me, thanking me, etc. etc. Enough of that- it's amazing to
me how many fine teachers are able to perservere in such difficult conditions.
As I said before, yes there are bad teachers, but the majority of them are working their a**es off. Don't judge the profession by some stories you've heard about a few.
Rant over, thanks! (:^)
<-----I'M TOTES ROLLING MY EYES
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