teachers unite- Page 3

[jasonf]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 3:51pm

Wendy, we're actually told that in middle school too about sarcasm (though I think a lot of the admin. who's said that had spent very little time with middle school - far more with elementary). I find the opposite is true: with probably 90% of the kids my sarcasm hits exactly where I want it to.

For the record, though, when I tell my kids I think it's rude it's without a HINT of sarcasm -- I say it dead seriously and they KNOW it means it's time to stop. That said, I'm not so sure it would work with elementary either...

[george95]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 3:53pm

Another good rule of thumb is to try not to make the discipline a power struggle, and to not ask rhetorical questions such as "Why is there talking going on?", when you know there is no possible answer that you'd accept.

Shifting gears for a minute, I just finished my lesson plans for the week, and this year, we have to load them into our online gradebooks. Whether or not we also have them in a planbook is optional, but they have to be in the online gradebook.

I'm not happy about this because for me, I need to use a traditional planbook. I need to be able to visualize the week, and I need to be able to turn a page and see if there are any shortened schedules or days off coming up before I begin a unit. The online lesson planner (we use gradequick) doesnt have a "turn the page" feature. So, the lesson plans online are pretty much useless. Posting the homework online, having the grades online, all that is great and saves lots of teacher time and enables easier links to parents, but the lesson plan being online, I dont see the point of it.

[SweetQintheLights]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 3:59pm

Yea, I wouldn't use Jason's response in the younger grades but possibly in the 4th or 5th grade, depending on the students.

George, maybe they think the lesson plans online make it more "official" since they are a legal document, at least here they are.

Thank you for all your ideas guys. Errr...ladies and gentlemen.

[jasonf]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 4:30pm

Georege,
This year for the first time they're checking our lesson plans. The problem for me is I find it impossible to do a day to day lesson plan with the crazy schedule our school follows (as do most teachers). As a result, I'll know the order of what I want to do, but don't have it formally written down. It's causing real headaches trying to make formal something that most teachers at this stage can do intuitively almost. Frankly, unless there's reason to question us, I find it a little ridiculous to picture my administrators combing through all our lesson plans..

[singingwendy]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 4:35pm

Jason, I completely agree with you ---I think kids--even elementary ones---can know and appreciate sarcasm. I use it quite often with my older ones (even though I'm not supposed to! )

I think the other issue is adminstrators who don't know the rapport you've developed with your classes and the context in which certain comments are said. I can give you example after example of times I've said something to students that could be construed in the wrong way.

George--Just curious how detailed your online plans have to be. I know that now in my 12 year of teaching, a lot of my plans are in "shorthand" because I know what I want to cover and I know the steps I need to get there. Also, do you have any "overly concerned" parents who want to hold you to exactly the plans as posted? ( I know we would in my school!) I agree with you that having schedules and homework online are nice (although, didn't having to write down your homework and bring home the right books teach responsibility?) but I don't see the point of posting your exact plans.

[violet72]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 5:00pm

I have to turn in my lesson plans every week(4 different grade levels, and 3 different schools and each school has a different template), a couple years ago they tried to do electronic ones and it did mot work out...it was too complicated and many teachers resisted...we do have an electronic gradebook

I use shorthand on my plans but at this one school some teachers write out their plans like they are still student teaching, they even write down everything, like a script almost

[jasonf]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 6:00pm

Violet,
You're right on the money -- experienced teachers needing to show their lesson plans to please the state (I'm in NJ also) is just another sign of how disrespected we are as a profession in general. If there's a question about us, then yes, check our plans. If not, and we're doing what we should, then it's just more work from us without any extra pay.

[george95]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 7:05pm

Wow its interesting to hear how anti-lesson plan some of you are. I guess I've always been kind of afraid to be so against it.

Planning out my week in a planbook is helpful; it helps me to remember how much I have to cover before a test, when a day off is coming up, what copies need to be made, what I planned on giving for homework, etc.

Now when I said we have to post our plans online, it is not accessible to parents or students. Only the teacher and admins can see it. And we post our homework on edline.net, where parents/students can check it each night.

I like the way I plan in summer school better though; I just get to school about an hour early, and I schedule all my classes. It works in summer school because there is no admin oversight, and its a block schedule. I like being able to say "ok from 9 to 9:20 we'll go over the homework, from 9:20 to 9:40 we'll go over the next reading" etc. It wouldn't work during the regular year because our classes are a measely 40 minutes long.

[SweetQintheLights]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 7:42pm

Alright you smart teachers...

I am teaching a lesson to 4th graders on volcanoes and earthquakes. I am planning on making the volcano with baking soda and vinegar. However, I am in need of a good logical explanation of how it relates to a real volcano. I don't want to get into acid and bases as that is a separate lesson.

I can't find anything on the internet of a good explanation of a real volcano compared to the creation of a volcano (with baking soda and vinegar).

[adamgreer]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 7:48pm

Not a single teacher I've ever worked with has ever had an accurate plan book. That's all for "legal purposes." There are always disruptions and events that you can't plan for that throw the week off. Additionally, lessons that I've thought would be simple and easy end up causing all kinds of problems for the students. The reverse is also true.

Lesson planning has become far too complex in recent years. Our school now requires us to write which of the NJCCCS's our objective meets. So, your plans now have to be numbered. I know teachers who just write any old number in, because there is no way the principal is going to sit with a copy of the CCCS's and cross-reference them to your plan book. I've not gotten that frustrated yet.

My first year mentor teacher once told me, "there's the plans in your plan book, and then there's the real plans."

[singingwendy]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 8:47pm

George--I am definitely not against lesson plans. They are invaluable part of being a good teacher. You have to know what you want to accomplish and how you plan on getting there. In fact, I was a complete pain in the a@@ to my student teacher last year with her plans, because at that level you need to plan as much as humanly possible. As a more seasoned teacher, I rarely write out the exact steps of what I"m doing that day, and that's to be expected.

However, that being said, things rarely go as exactly planned. Some classes need longer on a particular activity, others breeze right through it. Some of my classes--mostly Monday and Friday classes...are always about 2 classes behind everybody else. Plus, plans that are too exact don't allow for "artful teaching"..those times when the ideas start flowing and the class just takes an entirely different direction.

I think I would hate to do online plans. The process of actually writing in the book helps me remember what each class is doing that day. Plus, rather than write lessons "day by day" I use the columns for grade levels. So "Monday" becomes "Kindergarten", "Tuesday" becomes "First Grade", etc. Then, after each class, I make notes about how far we got in that lesson, or what we actually did that day.

Oh...and Sweet Q.....is there any way you could build only a cross section of the volcano instead and maybe do a lesson on magma vs lava? beneath the surface vs above the surface?

[SweetQintheLights]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 8:50pm

wendy, I have to do a lesson specifically on earths layers, then earthquakes and then volcanoes. I can't switch it because it is being taught during my practicum hours and this is what my cooperating teacher wants me to teach.

I really want to do the volcano experiment but I need to have a reason and explanation for it and how it relates to a real volcano.

[violet72]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 8:57pm

I am not anti lesson plans...I write down what I am going to do and plan every sunday what I am going to do for the week....but the NJCCS is a pain in the butt plus sometimes I can't take a student because they are out sick or there is a trip and so on...I have to save it for the next day, so when I turn in the the same lesson from last week I get questioned. So I label each day Day 1, Day 2...and so on and put the date at the top. I think it's funny that I have always had to turn my lesson plans in every week and my dad and brother don't have to turn them in at all

Another thing about the electronic lesson plans, our system crashed so many times so we had to type them out anyway, so it became double work, ticking off many. Now we use star base for grade book and it's fine, unless it crashes which it does time to time

[singingwendy]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 9:24pm

Sweet Q--What I was thinking was that the magma vs lava could be your connection to doing the volcano project. They can see the "stuff" on the inside and then see how it emerges and is called something different on the outside.

But, if you can't think of a way to connect it, maybe then you should choose a different project to do with the class. I know I've had to abandon interesting ideas because I they didn't fit into the curriculum I was teaching. It sucks, but we've all had to do it!

[SweetQintheLights]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 9:29pm

wendy, that's actually a good idea, the magma verses lava. I just want to also figure how to explain to them HOW and WHY it works without going into the acid/base thing.

I'm going to try to work on the magma/lava thing though. Thanks wendy!

[sally1112]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 9:46pm

Sweet Q, I have 10th graders and I call them Ladies and Gentlemen, and some time I say "Listen up folks." I try never to say "guys." I took a class this summer and the director alwyas called our group "guys" even though out of 27 people, there were only two males. I am male but it still drives me crazy, so I never do it with my students.

[adamgreer]

Posted: 9/14/08 at 9:56pm

We use Power School for our grade book and attendance. I LOVE the grade book feature because it's so easy and convenient. I do keep a "hard copy" of all my grades though, because if the system crashes you could lose everything. They also sometimes have server issues that screw things up. Last year, when I went to print out my grades, a set of high school calculus grades for a teacher in Nebraska came out!

However, the attendance is a royal pain in the neck. I hate having to log in to a website at the beginning of every period and placing a check in a column (present, absent, tardy) for each student. It's time consuming. Then, if a student comes in late, you have to go back and revise it.

I much preferred it when we had to fill out an attendance card and send it to the office. That was quick and easy, and you could use pencil to easily make changes.
Updated On: 9/14/08 at 09:56 PM

[jasonf]

Posted: 9/15/08 at 8:12am

We use Powergrade also -- it's not a bad system. I keep a hard copy of everything also just in case!

Let me be clear on the lesson plan thing - it's not that I don't plan, of course I do, but I've gotten to a point that I know my own style and as long as I have the idea in mind of what I want the kids to do, I find writing it down to be extra work more often than not. The exception is when I have a particularly complex plan, something a little more teacher-oriented (most of my classes are VERY student-oriented) where I need to be sure I'm doing things in the right order. I wonder, though -- is there a variation in amount of lesson planning depending on subject? I teach English - a lot of what I do is "here's the idea, here's the model, now you write, edit, etc...." -- that doesn't require a lot of planning per se....

[StockardFan]

Posted: 9/15/08 at 8:19am

I was going to say basically the same thing as adam. I never planned more than a week or two at a time, because assemblies, snow days, etc. would tend to mess things up.

We never had to do electronic LP's. That sounds like a real pain.

[violet72]

Posted: 9/15/08 at 4:32pm

I have back to school night on Tuesday and Wednesday this week...I am hoping we get alot of parents...last year in one of the schools we got 10 to come out, total disappointment

[george95]

Posted: 9/15/08 at 6:05pm

We have Back to School Night tonight! I will have a problem though I bet most of you won't have---the principal sometimes puts me on the spot and points at me in the back of the auditorium and says "why don't you come up here and start the meeting with a prayer!" I'm not good with group prayers on the spot...in the past I was like "Uhhhh lets uhhh thank God for the parents here tonight uhhhh ummmm"

So back to the lesson plans: I like to plan them one week at a time, and then each morning when I get to school, I can glance at the whole day, and figure out if I need to make copies, and then at the beginning of each period I can glance at it again because sometimes I just draw a blank about what I wanted to do with the class that day. And I have the page numbers written down too.
But to look at the electronic gradebook I would have to do so many points and clicks etc to get to what I want to see, and then the homework/objective/activity is all separate and require different clicks.......grrrrrr. I witnessed the science teacher spazzing at the principal today about it and he flat-out refused to put his plans online. The only reason any admin gave me for insisting on it was if a teacher was sick or was suddenly out for a few days (family death etc) then they could look up what the teacher had planned to do. The only catch with that is, what if the chemistry teacher is out...and I watch his class, I could look at his lesson book all day and I still wouldn't be able to teach the subject.....

[jasonf]

Posted: 9/15/08 at 8:11pm

Our problem is our schedule is so strange that trying to write lessons day by day is all but impossible. I basically make a list of what I want to do and in what order, and just pick up the next day where I left off the day before. The only times I EVER have a set day long plan are the days I'm out OR the day I have a formal observation. Otherwise, I just go with the flow, knowing where I want to be in any given sequence.

[george95]

Posted: 9/15/08 at 10:20pm

Yeah that's another reason I resent this online lesson plan thing: its for teachers being absent, but I have never been absent since day one--September 10, 2001.

[singingwendy]

Posted: 9/15/08 at 11:17pm

Hope everyone had good Back to School Nights. Ours was two weeks ago. I rarely get anyone who actually comes to see me, and if they do they just want the name of a piano teacher! But it's another night to do work in my room and chat with the other specialists, so it's not too bad.

We don't have to put our lesson plans online, but they have gone to a web-based substitute system. If you're going to be absent, you simply log on and report your absence and a need for a sub. Then the subs can log on and see what's available and choose their assignments for that day. What I like the most is that you can attach lesson plans to be downloaded, so if you really are so sick you can't leave the house, and don't have anyone to drop off plans, the sub or someone in the office can easily print out the plans for the day. There's also space online to leave comments about both the teacher and the sub. I really like the new system, and it doesn't make you feel like you have to cough on an administrator to convince them you're sick enough to stay home! (Although, it's usually so much more trouble to write plans for a sub, I'd rather go to school!)

[violet72]

Posted: 9/16/08 at 9:54am

I have some time to kill, my student is out sick

We have to keep emergency sub plans in the office, in case there is an emergency and we didn't leave plans or instructions, so the sub has something to do. When I was in college and was home for break I subbed and remembered hating when the teacher did not leave clear lesson plans. Also I love to see how kids , even in K5, behave when their normal teacher is out

Back to school night was good last night. None of my parents showed so I had to catch them this morning. One back to school night down 2 more to go (tonight and Wed night)