Ethical question - taking one picture with a cell phone/camera at a production.- Page 6

[philcrosby]

Posted: 3/29/07 at 1:21pm

Taking unauthorized photographs (like unauthorized recordings) is basically theft of intellectual property. Pure and simple.

Now I don't know anyone (including myself) who doesn't own a bootleg or two, so we are all complicit.

I personally can't think of a single reason a cell phone needs to be in operation at any time during a performance, but I am an old fashioned luddite.
Updated On: 3/29/07 at 01:21 PM

[ShbrtAlley44]

Posted: 3/29/07 at 1:25pm

Furthermore, if you're referring to me as self-righteous because I'm enforcing certain rules that are in no way unfair or prohibitive of your enjoyment, I'd suggest that you have a problem yourself. It is illegal, it is not tyrannical, and because we cannot regulate where these pictures are used, we ban them altogether. As I said, if you find that difficult to deal with, write to those in charge of the rules. Hash it out with them. I'm frankly tired of talking about it, and tired of people who feel like the theatre is their living room.

ETA: If someone's kicking your seat, either tell them to stop or get an usher and we will tell them to stop. Updated On: 3/29/07 at 01:25 PM

[D2]

Posted: 3/29/07 at 1:29pm

Something tells me this thread is going to end in murder and then there'll be multi-part, multi-franchise LAW AND ORDER episodes chronicling the whole thing. Maybe they'll even bring back Dianne Wiest for a few guest appearances - her character's specialty was ethics if I remember correctly.

[Edited for a missing word]

Updated On: 3/29/07 at 01:29 PM

[MLE]

Posted: 3/29/07 at 1:46pm

I'm not sure if you meant me in your last post or not.
But, I have to say, that I said I don't think we, as the audience, have the right to do whatever we want. That's stupid and I already stated that. I also understand that the author/creators' rights should be protected. What I have a problem with is the sheer idiocy of some of it all. I keep coming back to the houselights example. Why does every single thing, no matter how tiny or insignificant have to be 'owned' and 'protected'? I just don't think that's right. In fact, it makes me want to run all over the country, taking pictures of houselights in every theatre just to post them online. I won't, obviously, but the concept amuses me. Why? Because the world's not going to end, in the long run no one would care, but yet I'd still be in actual legal trouble if I were reported. Self-righteous? Maybe a bit. But, I love the theatre. And I know that the fact that it’s live is what makes it special and that is why many in the theatre community are opposed to unauthorized recordings or pictures. But, as an avid and informed theatre-goer as well as an actor, it doesn’t bother me. I’m not saying you have to feel that way. But, I would never do anything to intentionally hinder or compromise the enjoyment of a performance for anyone around me. That is rude. And that’s really why I think taking pictures in a performance might be wrong, not because our culture’s “copyright” obsession.

And I have no problem with you or any usher, unless they are an unbelievable p***k about it. Only once, have I encountered someone like this - I suspect she would have been patrolling the aisles with an AK-47 if she could. We were seated, it was about 15 minutes before curtain and the woman next to be opened her phone (which she already silenced) to check the time. This woman ran, and practically hurtled over people to get to there and actually berate her and told her she was not to have that on in the theatre. Which, I know for a fact is not true. That crazy woman aside, I know that they're just doing their jobs. It's the laws I have problems with. And you're right, I should take it up with the companies, but they don't care and nothing would be changed. But, the one thing I AM entitled to is to think that they are wrong. And that's all I'm saying. Updated On: 3/29/07 at 01:46 PM

[ShbrtAlley44]

Posted: 3/29/07 at 1:49pm

I absolutely agree with you. However, the reason you're not allowed to take pictures of "house lights" is because we cannot regulate who is photographing what. Therefore it's all banned. And THAT'S the last thing I'm going to say :)

[D2]

Posted: 3/29/07 at 1:49pm

Lighten up, MLE. I didn't mean anybody in particular. It was a joke.

[MLE]

Posted: 3/29/07 at 1:52pm

Sorry, D2. I didn't mean you. I was referring to Shbrt's post above yours. I actually laughed at the L&O reference. I got a mental image: cut to them searching the BWW boards after one of those bom bom's.

Updated On: 3/29/07 at 01:52 PM

[Fenchurch]

Posted: 3/29/07 at 1:53pm

MLE is way less of a hothead than I am. I agree with hom 100%. I have never taken a picture in a theater, either. But the idea that everyone in the world treats a picture as if it were Hiroshima smacks of self righteous sheep-like behaviour.

[D2]

Posted: 3/29/07 at 1:55pm

MLE:

[ShbrtAlley44]

Posted: 3/29/07 at 2:12pm

Fenchurch, it's not the picture. It's the act of willfully ignoring the request not to take photographs that gets me riled.

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 3/29/07 at 2:31pm

Because, MLE, anyone can SAY they're taking a picture of the houselights, but oops, the camera moved! It has to be all-encompassing.

[elmore3003]

Posted: 3/29/07 at 2:45pm

You're being rude, not following the regulations, and you should be stopped. I have been distracted by rude morons in the theatre with ringing cell phones, text messaging and other nonsense. I don't appreciate rudeness in any form from a nearby audience member, and I try not to disturb anyone else.

[Fenchurch]

Posted: 3/29/07 at 2:49pm

Sheep: Don't do anything anyone says not to, it's baaaaaad.

Sondheim: Everybody says don't-
It isn't right,
Don't-it isn't nice!
Everybody says don't
Everybody says no,
Everybody says stop.
Everybody says mustn't rock the boat,
Mustn't touch a thing!
Everybody says don't,
Everybody says wait,
Everybody says can't fight city hall,
Can't upset the cart,
Can't laugh at the king!

etc etc...

[ShbrtAlley44]

Posted: 3/29/07 at 2:58pm

Go right ahead and fight it. No one's telling you not to try. But take it up with those in charge instead of just doing it in the theatre and risking getting yourself fined or arrested.

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 3/29/07 at 3:00pm

I'm pretty sure Sondheim wouldn't want you unlawfully taking pics in theaters mounting his productions.

[ShbrtAlley44]

Posted: 3/29/07 at 3:02pm

Yeah.

[LizzieCurry]

Posted: 7/20/08 at 12:28am

http://twitter.com/taylorishere/statuses/862931560

[millie_dillmount]

Posted: 7/20/08 at 10:59am

I love how this was bumped up a year and a half later.

[frontrowcentre2]

Posted: 7/20/08 at 11:25am

I dont think it's so horrible if you take one picture during the show (without flash of course) for YOUR personal use...

Because few people actually keep them for personal use. They post them here on Broadway World, and e-mail them to friends.

This gives others the idea that it's OK to take a picture or two, or twelve. Then some idiot forgets to turn the flash off and it distracts the performers and others in the audience.

Then there are the idiots who think it's all right to audio or video record the performance. (I never hesitate to report these people to the house manager.)

Look... you paid to see the show live, as did everyone else. Put the cameras and recorders away. JUST enjoy this once-in-a-lifetime experience. Buy the CD or the souvenir book if you want pictures or audio of the show, or save your playbill and ticket stub. You don't need the (poor quality) photos or audio/video recordings you made yourself.

[Weez]

Posted: 7/20/08 at 11:31am

To the people saying "I can't BELIEVE you'd just say 'rules are rules' and blindly follow them!": are you genuinely saying that taking a photo in a theatre is akin to standing up and saying "no. Jews are people too" even though that could get you killed? Sense of perspective goes both ways, cupcakes.

And to the person who said "I spent $100 for my ticket, damn STRAIGHT I'm going to take a photo if I want to!": are you also going to make phone calls, chat with your neighbour, eat a three course take-out dinner, and listen to a sports game on the radio as you sit in your seat? Gotta love that sense of entitlement!

That's all I really have to say here.

[jazzicat]

Posted: 7/20/08 at 2:03pm

I used to feel differently, but now that video technology is so accessible and easy to use i really have no issue with people videotaping performances if they are discreet. Not everyone can afford to see these shows and since there are LEGAL videotapes that are made and oft never shared... I have no problem with videos. i don't even think it's distracting. We live in a world where video is a part of our daily lives. If someone can get away with it, more for the world to enjoy. Oh and one picture is just as bad as several. I say just go for it.

[Patash]

Posted: 7/20/08 at 2:09pm

jazzicat, I'm simply speechless at your post! Please tell me you weren't really serious!

[LizzieCurry]

Posted: 7/20/08 at 2:10pm

Not everyone can afford to see these shows

And not everyone is entitled to, either.

Updated On: 7/20/08 at 02:10 PM

[jazzicat]

Posted: 7/20/08 at 2:58pm

The sick part is that I was 100% serious. I enjoy technology. a lot. I relish the fact that I don't really have to feel bad about missing out on anything these days. It makes my work week a lot more bearable. I'm not saying it should be obvious or that there should be performances with cameras high in the air, but if I see someone sneaking a video -- it doesn't bother me. In fact, I admire the rebellious spirit. And I embrace it. These rogue video clips have filled me with joy on many occasions. And if someone else risks it-- fantastic. And contrary to popular belief-- I feel that these video clips make people who would see a show anyways even more anxious to see it.

Come on, I bet 99.9% of people on this board have been glad that something they missed for valid personal reasons was captured by someone else. It doesn't mean I'm unethical or that I don't respect the rights to copyright ownership-- I just am both resigned to the fact and somewhat thankful that I live in a time when we don't have to miss out. I enjoy it more than I find it annoying..so why not go with it.

Look at my avatar. I am a huge fan of bands like Dave Matthews and Phish who have encouraged tapers for years. They understand that there are nuances in every performance.. and they might as well encourage the die-hard fans to enjoy these small gifts. These core fans make the music grow and live on-- I mean why would you alienate the people who share the same songs over and over again simply to hear a new chord or note. They keep it going.

I firmly believe that Broadway should come around and start to realize that the die hards who watch these videos are the same obsessed fans who are going to see shows over and over again and keep the shows going and alive. The ushers shouldn't get their underpants in such a bunch... if a show is really that good it will live on, video clips or not.

Oh and as for the elitist attitude-- if that is how you get your joy in life, more power to you.

[uncageg]

Posted: 7/20/08 at 3:54pm

"It doesn't mean I'm unethical or that I don't respect the rights to copyright ownership.."

Yes, it does mean that. it amazes me that people have no respect for rules or laws these days. Yeah, some performer encourage picture taking and even recording (Like String Cheese Incident). But in a theater you are told that you cannot do it. And if I see someone taking pictures I will report it. All of this technology does not give us the right to illegally film or record shows.