FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
#1FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 11:48am
In 1972, Sondheim and Prince proposed a film version of FOLLIES to MGM Studio Chief Daniel Melnick, "featuring dozens of faded stars from Hollywood’s Golden Age congregating on a studio backlot about to be torn down."
Prince's press agent John Springer envisioned his own perfect cast of still-alive movie stars from the Golden Age:
Buddy: GENE KELLY
Sally: DEBBIE REYNOLDS
Ben: RICHARD BURTON (also: FRED ASTAIRE)
Phyllis: ELIZABETH TAYLOR (also: GINGER ROGERS)
Carlotta: BETTE DAVIS
Hattie: JOAN CRAWFORD
Solange: LESLIE CARON
Heidi: GLORIA SWANSON
Stella: LENA HORNE
The only main character this wonderful article--from the Paris Review, of all places!--miscasts is Lena Horne as Stella, so I will offer up the 1972 ETHEL MERMAN, since hearing her sing those final notes of "Who's That Woman" would have made my life complete: "Lord, Lord, lord! That woman is ME! That woman is ME! That woman is ME!"
The Paris Review: Loveland
#2FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 12:19pm
It sounds like a bizarre, oddly captivating hybrid of "That's Entertainment," "Whatever Happened to Baby Jane," and "The Shining."
Follies has always sort of defied any genre pinnings- is it drama? Comedy? Does it have an element of ghost story, mystery, horror? No one is entirely sure.
#3FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 12:36pm
I still don't think any of the Sondheim musicals would make good movies (or at least good American movies), since they rely so heavily on theatricality. Bergman or Fellini might have done COMPANY, FOLLIES, NIGHT MUSIC (wouldn't it be weird if Bergman made that movie LOL?), or SUNDAY... justice on screen, but I fear that any American director (even the ones INFLUENCED by Fellini, Bergman and the like) would and will butcher them entirely. USA A-OK!
Updated On: 11/30/13 at 12:36 PM
#4FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 12:43pm
That cast is a mixture of brilliant and train wreck.
If Minnelli had directed, it might have worked. But Hal Prince ... no. God no.
And I would have loved someone like Ingmar Bergman directing, with Kelly and Donen doing the staging. Bergman knew how to walk the line between charm, humor, maudlin, and self-absorbed, and keep it from tipping too far in any one direction.
And Astaire and Rogers over Burton and Taylor, please. Oy!
And I've always seen Donald O'Connor as a perfect screen "Buddy."
EDIT: jv92--I was thinking Bergman, but Fellini would have been great, too.
blocked: logan2, Diamonds3, Hamilton22
#5FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 12:49pmToo artsy. It shoulda been Stanley Donen and Chuck Walters.
#6FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 12:52pm
Donald O'Connor would have be a great Buddy! Astaire and Rogers as the Stones would have been as bad as Liz Taylor as Desiree.
Hal Prince, for all his tremendous theatrical gifts, cannot direct a movie for his life. And I don't think Vincente Minnelli could have done it. I really think if any director could have pulled off FOLLIES it would have had to have been one of the European greats. Call me a snob.
But anyway, wasn't FOLLIES kind of a movie onstage the way it used lighting and cinema-type techniques? (Don't take my use of the term movie onstage too literally, BTW. Of course it was theatrical!)
#7FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 1:00pm
Bergman would have been brilliant. I love Fellini to death, but I could imagine his excesses taking over something like FOLLIES.
I've always felt he was essentially a technical filmmaker. Granted, “La Strada” was a great film. Great in its use of negative imagery more than anything else, but that simple, cohesive core…
Like all that “Juliet of the Spirits” or “Satyricon” -- I found it incredibly indulgent, you know? He really is. He's one of the most indulgent filmmakers. He really is. It's like Samuel Beckett. I admire the technique, but it doesn't hit me on a gut level. Weltanschauung is what it is. It's the influence of television. Now, Marshall McLuhan deals with it in terms of it being a high-intensity -- you understand? -- a hot medium.
#8FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 1:23pm
The way he handled 8 1/2 makes me think Fellini could have walked the same tightrope with Follies. I think just about any American director you could name would have tipped it way too far into self-absorbed pity. Donen and Kelly tried with their own "reunion" picture, a thinly disguised sequel to On the Town, called "It's Always Fair Weather." It was too heavy-handed and sluggish.
If I had to cast Follies from a list of available older stars in 1972, I would go with:
Buddy: Donald O'Connor
Sally: Doris Day
Ben: Frank Sinatra
Phyllis: Dolores Gray
Carlotta: Yvonne De Carlo (the one OBC member)
Hattie: Ruby Keeler
Solange: Leslie Caron
Heidi: Deanna Durbin (lured out of retirement)
Stella: Betty Garrett
blocked: logan2, Diamonds3, Hamilton22
#9FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 1:28pmYou can read these scripts at the Billy rose collection (NYPL). They are of course fascinating--
nmartin
Broadway Legend Joined: 6/3/05
#10FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 1:38pm
In Bette and Joan: The Divine Feud Shirley MacLaine and Henry Fonda were listed as Sally and Ben. June Allyson and Joan Blondell were also listed but no character names were given.
I love the thought of Frank Sinatra as Ben.
Phyllis Rogers Stone
Broadway Legend Joined: 9/16/07
#11FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 1:38pmThe part about Mickey Rooney talking to archival footage of Lewis Stone is kind of grotesquely beautiful.
#12FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 2:15pmI love that, but the Hiroshima-again ending in Hal's script notes is an indication of how badly a director--whether American or European--could have tipped the show into pretentiousness.
Gothampc
Broadway Legend Joined: 5/20/03
#13FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 2:31pm
I like best12bars casting.
I never understood wanting Bette Davis to play Carlotta. Were they going to dub her "I'm Still Here"? Plus I've always thought that Carlotta should have a bit of sexiness or mystique which Davis never really had. It would be like Katherine Hepburn playing Cleopatra, she could probably act the role but there would be a coldness there that shouldn't be there.
And Elizabeth Taylor was not a singer as was demonstrated in the movie version of A Little Night Music.
#14FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 3:31pm
Bette Davis singing "I'm Still Here" would have sounded something like this
BETTE DAVIS SINGS WHATEVER HAPPENED TO BABY JANE?
bwayboy22
Broadway Star Joined: 5/9/12
#15FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 5:22pmWho would be some good contemporary actors in this if they made it now?
#16FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 5:29pmPatti would be a great Carlotta.
#17FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 6:39pm
I've often wondered about a film version of Follies. Could it really work or would it feel too theatrical and episodic? After all, there really isn't a plot to speak of. A surreal European director might be the way to go.
Has anyone read the original scripts for the proposed film? I'd love to hear more info about them.
As for a modern cast...
I've always thought Michelle Pfeiffer would be a terrific Phyllis. Kathy Bates or Bette Midler would be great as Stella.
Updated On: 11/30/13 at 06:39 PM
#18FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 7:03pmIf you do a search, there are several informative threads over the past few years that have discussed contemporary casts for film versions of Follies, and several of the posters have made suggestions similar to yours.
#19FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 10:14pm
On one hand, I'm glad the 1972 film version didn't happen, that way, why would we be still mystified of the legendary Brodaway production today? But on the other, a film version with a surrelistic approach would be the way to go on a ghost story musical like this.
If a film version does happen today, I hope that the original set design by the legendary Boris Aronson could be a strong reference point for the new version of the sets for the film. Hey, a Follies fan like myself can dream can't he?
#20FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 10:31pm
Most people in movie-land would go, "Boris...who?" and Rob Marshall would think he knows how to recapture Aronson but would just f*ck it up.
Personally, I'm a little sick of movie musicals. Bring back when they were passe. I liked it better.
Unknown User
Joined: 12/31/69
#21FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 11/30/13 at 11:08pm
Oh my gosh, Ethel Merman singing "Who's That Woman" would be the perfection! It's like it was destined to be sung by her. However, although she did appear in several memorable films, she was much more of a stage personality than many of the others mentioned.
Also, I love the idea of Doris Day as Sally, her "Losing My Mind" and "Don't Look At Me" would be lovely.
henrikegerman
Broadway Legend Joined: 4/29/05
#22FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 12/1/13 at 12:35am
Follies (1972)
Directed by Ken Russell
Buddy: Dick Van Dyke
Sally: Betty White
Ben: John Raitt
Phyllis: Jean Simmons
Carlotta: Yvonne de Carlo
Stella: Eartha Kitt
Hattie: Dorothy Loudon
Heidi: irene Dunne
Solange; Melina Mercouri
The Whitmans; The Champions
#23FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 12/1/13 at 2:58am
I made a cast list for this sitting in class one day but I've lost it. I remember getting really excited about my list of potential directors but don't really recall who was on there. Fincher? Aronofsky? Ah well....
I really do hope the stars align for this someday. It could be the quintessential theater movie if given to the right people and handled the right way.
#24FOLLIES: The 1972 Film That Never Was
Posted: 12/1/13 at 3:10amI believe Fincher was top of mind because of his working relationship with Aaron Sorkin. I know Sorkin has been attached to a Follies screenplay as far back as 07. Does anyone know if he has completely abandoned the project or if it is a case of circumstances/timing not working out?
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