Grey Gardens- Page 3

[VeuveClicquot]

Posted: 9/1/06 at 12:13pm

"for the third time, I have heard the cast recording and have read the script. I can discuss the writing perfectly well. if we were debating the performances, design, or direction, you would have a point.

and if nullifying my opinions on the matters we have been debating (which I am fully qualified to discuss) makes you feel better or that you win the argument, you just go ahead a delight yourself with that notion.

Again, I am NOT nullifying your opinion. I have an opinion about "Grey Gardens." I sat through it.

Maybe I'm wrong. Perhaps "Grey Gardens" is the greatest musical ever. If you had actually seen it, you might be able to converse with me. BUT YOU HAVEN'T.

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 9/1/06 at 12:27pm

'Your opinion, therefore, is meaningless. '

oh. I guess I misunderstood you. you sure didn't nullify my opinion. at all.

listen, I understand that plays are meant to be seen in action to be fully realized. but, discussing the writing can be done based on the script and music. and since this debate has been about the writing, I feel perfectly capable of discussing what I have discussed--mainly the fact that you missed the point of act one.

and to repeat, that you can't critique the bway production of the show yet.

and to repeat, that I think there is an audience fo the show and the ability to market the show well off of the musical's connectuion to jackie o and joe kennedy, as well as the cult doc and great reviews from ob.

to conclude, there really is no point in discussing the writing any further until the bway production opens. and I bet ya money I see it before you get to.

until then, best to ya.

[VeuveClicquot]

Posted: 9/1/06 at 12:34pm

"listen, I understand that plays are meant to be seen in action to be fully realized. but, discussing the writing can be done based on the script and music. and since this debate has been about the writing, I feel perfectly capable of discussing what I have discussed--mainly the fact that you missed the point of act one.

and to repeat, that you can't critique the bway production of the show yet."

Are you kidding me?

You are allowed to judge a show based on the script and score, and although I've actually seen the show, according to you that is not sufficient

You're full of crap.

I'd love to discuss "Grey Gardens." It's a fascinating piece. Anyone?

[VeuveClicquot]

Posted: 9/1/06 at 12:34pm

"listen, I understand that plays are meant to be seen in action to be fully realized. but, discussing the writing can be done based on the script and music. and since this debate has been about the writing, I feel perfectly capable of discussing what I have discussed--mainly the fact that you missed the point of act one.

and to repeat, that you can't critique the bway production of the show yet."

Are you kidding me?

You are allowed to judge a show based on the script and score, and although I've actually seen the show, according to you that is not sufficient

You're full of crap.

I'd love to discuss "Grey Gardens." It's a fascinating piece. Anyone?

[MasterLcZ]

Posted: 9/1/06 at 12:46pm

Well, I think we all agree the show has flaws as well as strengths.

Jrb and I feel the flaws are fixable and VC thinks they are not. And that's OK.

(feeling atypically mellow after my shrink..)

Updated On: 9/1/06 at 12:46 PM

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 9/1/06 at 12:47pm

I never denied you your right to your opinion of the ob. I even said that earlier.

I simply think you missed the point of the first act. reread what I said about the first act. how could you miss those things?

for the last time, I think you should let the revisions take place before deciding whether or not this is a great musical. do you have any idea what state many great musicals were in pre bway? many required revisions. let that happen for this show. give it that fair chance.

[VeuveClicquot]

Posted: 9/1/06 at 12:57pm

"I simply think you missed the point of the first act. reread what I said about the first act. how could you miss those things?"

Well, what "things" exactly? You're entirely right. I missed the whole point of that first act. Please convince me wny it was good.

[notabb]

Posted: 9/1/06 at 12:58pm

JRB , I'm with you I saw this show 5 times at Playwrights (and , no , I had never seen the movie ) and loved it. As is. I think it will only be better with the work they're doing. I can't wait to hear the new opening and song replacing TOYLAND . A lot of my family , who only see one ,maybe ,two shows in nyc are planning to see GREY GARDENS . That was from hearing about Ebersoles performance. So , I'm very optimistic

[bjh2114]

Posted: 9/1/06 at 1:00pm

"I'd love to discuss "Grey Gardens." It's a fascinating piece. Anyone?"

VC: Honey, I think you just need to take a step back and go over jrb_actor's argument. He's not saying that he is more qualified to discuss the show than you are. He is saying that he is not talking about the PRODUCTION of Grey Gardens, but rather the WRITING OF THE SCRIPT and the PUBLICITY. You don't have to have seen the production to discuss these things, assuming you've read the script, which jrb_actor HAS! I understand your argument darling, but please understand that he's not saying that it isn't sufficient that you've seen the show. His argument is actually fairly strong. Try to go back and reread his postings from an unbiased standpoint (like mine).
-BJH
Updated On: 9/1/06 at 01:00 PM

[Unknown User]

Posted: 9/1/06 at 1:07pm

i adore the film, loved the show, am devoted to the cast recording, & cant wait to revist GREY GARDENS again & see whats changed.

it seems like someone has some kind of axe to grind on this thread, declaring it dead before its even opened to previews.

[VeuveClicquot]

Posted: 9/1/06 at 1:18pm

"Jrb and I feel the flaws are fixable and VC thinks they are not. And that's OK. "

Interesting point, and thank you. But i'm curious. How would you fix it?

[MasterLcZ]

Posted: 9/1/06 at 1:46pm

Great question. Well, there are a few things that need to be worked on INHO.
The great mystery of the Beales has always been, how these two very priviedged and smart women fell so drastically and wound up in the squalor they did. The musical doesn't really address that and it needs to. Big Edie is shown as a bubbly, naughty combo of Auntie Mame and Brenda Frazier. But I think the real Big Edie was, if equally magnetic, also grasping, wily, malignant and mentally unstable. I think the authors have to risk making her quite unlikeable. And how Little Edie has been damaged by her mother should be revealed gradually during Act 1.

Another thing - I never quite buy the reason that Little Edie's engagement is severely strained by Big Edie's revealing to Joe of her daughters' slutty history. In "High Society", Guys have always known who the 'easy' girls are, and there isn't a chance in hell that Edie's exploits (and the reason how she got her sobriquet of 'Body Beautiful Beale') would not have been well-known to Joe months before he even met her. Joe Kennedy Sr. would have done a background check on Edie before allowing Joe Jr. to even ask her out (unless all he wanted to do was shtup her). Though I do buy the fact that Phelan divorcing Big Edie would have caused quite a scandal, and would be a major incentive for Joe to call of the engagement.

I may have more thoughts later.

Updated On: 9/1/06 at 01:46 PM

[CurtainPullDowner]

Posted: 9/1/06 at 2:14pm

Who is Mr. Edgy Wedgy?