Is Falling in Love with a Show Before YOU See it...- Page 2

[BobbyBubby]

Posted: 1/14/09 at 8:00pm

Your overly defensive response speaks for itself, Craig.

[blaxx]

Posted: 1/14/09 at 8:05pm

Oh ok, just take it outside , you two.

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 1/14/09 at 8:34pm

overly defensive?

seriously? after your repeated personal attacks?

yer just pissed off that he refuted you point by point in a coherent manner without resorting in kind to personal attacks.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 1/14/09 at 8:34pm

I never got the whole Antagonize the Moderators Game.

[PalJoey]

Posted: 1/14/09 at 9:03pm

Bobby--you're out of line here.

I know you have a hard life, but you know what? So does everyone else. And lashing out does no good--not to you, not to BroadwayWorld, not to the universe.

So cut it out. NOW. Grow up and stop inflicting your anger on those around you. It isn't cute. It isn't clever. As a matter of fact, it's repellent.

If you're brimming over with anger because of your diagnosis, get help. Lots of people here have SH*Tty diagnoses to deal with--some worse, actually.

If you're brimming over with anger because your parents treated you bad, get help. Lots of people here have SH*Tty parents to deal with--some worse, I'm sure.

And if you're brimming over with anger just because it feels good to lash out, get help. Because sooner or later, you're going to find yourself not only deeply unhappy but deeply lonely.

Understand? This jag you've been on? It just ended. Tomorrow morning, you're doing something positive about these "mean reds" you've been acting out on.

Don't respond. Come back when you're ready to turn over a new leaf.

I love you, I wish you the best and good luck. I hope you get the help you need.

Updated On: 1/14/09 at 09:03 PM

[best12bars]

Posted: 1/14/09 at 9:44pm

BobbyBubby---here's the deal. Your thread started with a legitimate question and subject for discussion: You don't understand why advance positive feedback for Broadway shows is acceptable but advance negative comments are not.

A very good question, actually!

Craig's response was wondering why you chose the word "criminal?" The absolute WORST he is saying is that your choice of words was a bit melodramatic. But...

I'm guessing you felt personally attacked by his post. Because you launched into a completely inappropriate personal attack on Craig and BWW.

Craig has handled the situation eloquently and allowed this thread to "stay" and fester. Perhaps you'll refer to it when you feel like another disproportionate lashing. You can see the "stink" rising from this one on the west coast already!

Am I defending Craig? Yes. But I've never met him face to face. I'm not a "close personal friend." And ... I'm not out to get YOU. There's no "clique" involved here. I'm posting my gut reaction.

You have a passion for Broadway. And you raise great questions and make interesting comments and observations. But they seem to be tainted more and more lately with this exaggerated paranoia. Unjustified, to put it mildly.

Let me show you how I would have handled the situation. If I had started this thread, and Craig had commented, exactly as written, my response to his post would have been:

"Okay, so maybe it won't land me in JAIL, and it's not a criminal offense, but there seems to be an acceptance of love for shows that haven't opened, and a burning at the stake for those who choose to raise doubts or negative comments about a future show."

Something to that effect.

I wouldn't have posted the acidic responses you did. And I have to ask you ... why do you think your retaliation is remotely acceptable?

Did Craig's comment hurt your feelings? Were you embarrassed because he works for BWW and questioned your use of "criminal?" I really don't get it.

I'm thinking it stems from deep insecurities on your part. You feel that anyone who challenges your thoughts is out to get you. No. They just might not see things the way you do. That's all.

Here's how BWW (and all message boards work): They're hosted. Meaning somebody is creating a virtual venue and paying the bills for you to be able to express your opinions. Do they owe you anything? NO! If you sign up and agree to their terms, you can come and "play in their yard." Why? Because they're the hosts and you're the guest.

Same as if you invited someone into your home. You are the host and they are the guest. Got it?

So, stop insulting the host and start acting like an invited guest! Seriously, wake up. See things for what they are. Play in their yard, or pick up your marbles and go home.

(I sound like I'm talking to a five-year-old.)

Okay, I'm done.

[husk_charmer]

Posted: 1/14/09 at 9:55pm

Slight statement since it was brought up...BWW could use an editor/proofreader...some of the errors are glaring.

[Shannon Bo Dannon]

Posted: 1/14/09 at 9:55pm

Besty, you're amazing.

[B3TA07]

Posted: 1/14/09 at 10:00pm

I've never understood why rumors couldn't be discussed on the message board. I think it's over assumed that people will end up on the message board, instead of the home page, and read posts about rumors and assume they're articles based on fact. I mean, who is that stupid?

[laura is broadway]

Posted: 1/14/09 at 11:15pm

Why bother posting on a board you dislike so? I don't get it.

[MrSweetNAwful]

Posted: 1/14/09 at 11:43pm

...there's a real bad "mommy and daddy are fighting at the dinner table" vibe going on in this thread

[LizzieCurry]

Posted: 1/14/09 at 11:46pm

That's because Mommy and Daddy ARE fighting.

[BobbyBubby]

Posted: 1/15/09 at 1:51am

I wasn't going to respond but I feel I must.

First, my personal attacks, and yes I'm admitting, they were personal, have nothing to do with any deep seeded issues that I need to address regarding my health or my mental capacity.

I don't like Craig. I don't like what he posts. I don't like what has happened to this site (which I see now isn't fully in his hands). Does that have anything to do with my demons? No. Sometimes people rub you the wrong was and there's no deep psychological issue to be solved. You just don't like the person. He and RentBoy are the only two posters that get under my skin in ways I can't explain.

My attach on Craig was personal. I think any poster could have figured out what I meant by criminal. One of the reasons I dislike Craig is a know-it-all attitude.

But I was wrong in my attacks. Though I'm entitled to dislike who I choose, I should've just ingored it and let the thread progress. I still feel his comment was snide, but I could have easily just risen above the situation.

I don't think it has anything to do with me being overly defensive. I still feel he could have asked his question differently. He's done similar things. Still, if I felt he was in the wrong, I could have just ignored it.

I literally don't spend all day thinking about this message board. I come on to relax.

My big problem when I come onto this site to relax is the overflowing of ignorance. People are entitled to their opinions but seeing the same questions asked daily, the same 5 shows discussed, etc, I tend to lose patience.

I've also never been on a message board that included original editorial content. I find this an inherent problem with BWW. Because they accept advertising and write about Broadway, there seems to be a different way of policing the message boards. I also think, as a poster, and I'm paraphrasing here, "a guest of the hosts here", why aren't the hosts more careful about the poeple they invite to the party. All That Chat is more picky about who they invite to the party, and, from what I've read there over the years, while there are strong personalities, which all message boards have, there tends to be more coherence in the threads there.

Throughout my years here I've seen so many of my favorite posters either leave completely or stick to the off-topic board.

And another poster is right. If I hate it so much here, I should leave, and maybe I will. But it just saddens me that these "hosts" can't give their long term members the best experience possible. Have moderators 24/7. Screen users before you let them join. Set some clearer rules so you don't lose valuable members because they're sick of reading Wicked and Rent threads. Create sticky topics or folders, so that the popular shows, like Rent can have their threads in one space. Of course users are entitled to discuss these shows, but there are ways of organizing this site to allow those uninterested in these topics to easily ignore them.

This board contains a large amount of knowledge on it from its posters. It's a shame that most of them are on the off-topic board, having great conversations about interesting things, on a Broadway themed site.

Of course what I said was uncalled for. I get it. Does my outburst have hidden meanings. Nope. Just bursted out at someone who makes it easy for me.

I'm an impatient person. It's part of who I am. Do I channel it into destructive behavior. Yeah, of course I do. I have a need for perfection. To see this site that I used to crave coming to be it's best possible self.

Throughout the years here I've come onto this site and had a nearly naked woman in an ad pop up at work, I've seen ads for the Mormon church and Prop 8 thrown in my face, I've seen homophobic and racists posts, and I've witnessed the decay of a potentially great website.

It just doesn't seem to me like BroadwayWorld is trying anymore. It just seems like they make money off the ads. The video content is great, but the articles, reviews, etc are 3rd rate journalism. People have repeatedly pointed out how they can improve and it just seems like it gets worse.

I don't know everything about running a website. I know growth is a process and I hope BroadwayWorld can grow and improve.

Yeah, I said the wrong thing. I attacked someone and nobody deserves to be attack. It came from a frustration with many things on here, that I feel many users feel but aren't loud enough about, just not being as quality driven as they could and should be. Is that Craig's fault? Yes or No, I should have just kept my feelings to my self and let life go on knowing I can't control these things. I supposed I'd have a happier life on here if I just laughed at what irritates me instead of jumping on my feelings so quickly.

[PalJoey]

Posted: 1/15/09 at 7:58am

Yes, you would.

[Craig]

Posted: 1/15/09 at 8:31am

BobbyBubby

There are a few things I'd like to address in your post - but first I wanted to thank you for your thoughtful reply and candor.

The first is - and none of this is intended as condescending - when you already don't care for someone - ANYTHING they do will grate on your last nerve. Anything and everything. Not just on message boards, but in real life. And that festers and grows unless you (or anyone) is able to let it go and move on to more productive things. My initial post wasn't snide. It was one where I was asking for clarification. But since you view me as a "know it all" I can understand how your gut went to that place. It might also be because quite often many posters, yourself included go to that place first too. The snarky or sarcastic comment. Tone is hard to convey on message boards - nothing new if you've ever spent time on one...

As for the latter half of your reply - I want to address it but this is for everyone, not BobbyBubby.

The best way to provide feedback about the site, content, advertising, messages, etc is to use the contact for or send an email - NOT posting threads on the message board or constantly making sarcastic or caustic comments here and there in random threads. See a typo? Rather than post a comment or start a thread - use the contact form to let us know so we can fix it. On here and in life, you can ask yourself - is it more productive to be snarky and get frustrated at these things as they come up or be proactive and assist by letting us know so we can correct the issue?

As I've also posted a few times, while the message boards get a lot of use and traffic, the majority of people visiting are spending time reading articles, news, watching videos and using other site features. I think people forget that and believe they have some sort of "ownership" of the site because they are posters. I would NEVER begrudge the fact that we love having forums for people to contribute and continue to visit over and over.

As for advertising. For part of the revenue of the site, we use placement services. Which means, unfortunately, we don't always have control over incoming ads. We DO have control, once we know about something to "kill" it. One might suggest we don't use a particular service if they are providing inappropriate ads. The fact is - they ALL work the same way. So, as I've stated before - if something objectionable pops up, please contact management. Posting threads about it and then harping on it even after the ads have been removed services no one. The very second we were able to remove offensive ads in the past we did so and responded accordingly. And I speak SOLELY for myself here, not anyone else, when I say that frankly, I don't feel I need to respond on every thread (nor do I have the time) about the current status of site progress in removing ads, threads, posters, etc. I'm sorry if that either offends someone now to read or that doesn't seem "good enough." With thousands of messages posted a day, there just isn't time.

Finally (phew....) There are people I don't care to read messages from and topics I care nothing about. I have found it's best to just ignore them and the topics than get frustrated about them. This site services ALL its members, not just any one group. We've entertained ideas of re-organizing the message board, but frankly - I think our system works best from what I've seen out there. People don't like to see tons of "sticky" messages because then they HAVE to see the same thread topics day in and day out. Plus, we only use sticky messages for key site messages we need to relay to those that only view the message board.

Without getting into a long(er) discussion on the topic - people that have been here awhile either forget or don't allow themselves to remember that new people come here all the time and if new, might not know histories, topics that have been discussed before, how to USE the search function of the site, etc. I can see how people who have been here a long time can get frustrated about that. But in short - get over it. Everyone was new once. And slamming new people just comes off as obnoxious and elitist. Rather than make snarky comments about search functions or saying the topic's been discussed, etc., why not try educating them a bit? And if you don't want to or don't care - then move on. Click out of the post. Read another topic.

The old joke of the patient going into the doctor and hitting his arm while saying "it hurts when I do this" and the doctor saying "then don't do that" is appropriate. Don't engage in behavior that you know is going to frustrate you. At least WHEN you have control over it. What's the point?

Anyway - I've rambled on long enough. And again - most (almost all the above) is NOT directed at BobbyBubby, but clarification for anyone reading...

[hmpeterson]

Posted: 1/15/09 at 8:58am

I feel like the Brady Bunch theme music should be playing now that Jan and Marcia have come to a resolution.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 1/15/09 at 10:26am

"This site services ALL its members ..."

Me too!

I'm not a big fan of those message boards with stickies and topic groups. This set up just works better for me and the way my brain functions, I guess. As for ATC, well, I've been a member forever, posted approximately twice and I often go a year and a half without even remembering to go to that site. But if somebody likes that experience better, then that should be their environment.

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 1/15/09 at 11:10am

i for one wonder what craig's ulterior motives are for keeping this thread around. since anyone who's been here more than a year has to know that craig is a type of concentrated evil a hunded and thirty-eight times more toxic that cobalt thorium g. personally i figure he's got it laced with subliminal hypnotic suggestions and worry that i'll burst into you're a builder upper in the middle of my 11:30 publications meeting. damn your evil-osity, craig!

Updated On: 1/15/09 at 11:10 AM

[skb2010]

Posted: 1/15/09 at 12:54pm

What if you made a new board Craig? I don't mind all of the posts, but what about a "RENT and Wicked" board, or something along those lines?

[PiraguaGuy2]

Posted: 1/15/09 at 1:31pm

Right, because making a "student" board for audition song threads worked so well.

They'll just come here.

[skb2010]

Posted: 1/15/09 at 1:38pm

It was just an idea.

[Craig]

Posted: 1/15/09 at 1:40pm

Personally (and this is just my take on things) I don't see what the big deal is. I skim subject headings. If there's something I want to read I click in and if not, I don't. I don't sit there and "worry" about how many topics about x, y or z there are unless someone is spamming the message board.

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 1/15/09 at 1:43pm

oh sure, that's why you couldn't just ignore my "post your artist's conception of your favorite broadway star's genitalia" thread, but had to delete it deprive the broadwayworld world of such brilliant art. evil, pure and simple, from the 8th dimiension!

[skb2010]

Posted: 1/15/09 at 1:49pm

As I said, I don't mind, but I know people do.

I also don't see what the big deal about posting a thread with the same topic as a thread from three years ago instead of bumping up the old thread is, but that's just me.

[ifuweregay93]

Posted: 1/15/09 at 2:30pm

"I feel like the Brady Bunch theme music should be playing now that Jan and Marcia have come to a resolution."

Or the cheesy Full House music after someone hugs it out.