#1
Posted: 9/7/05 at 1:16am
Ok, just to make clear, Jason O.D.'s on accident right? Or was he trying to kill himself?
Quick "Bare" Question (SPOILER!!!)
#2
Posted: 9/7/05 at 1:18am
I thought that he did it in a severe state of depression after the events that led up to his death. Then during Bare when he resolves his problems with Peter, he kind of regrets his decision, making his death even more depressing.
"Don't thank your parents, if you were raised in a nurturing environment you wouldnt be in show business"--Conan O'Brien at the 2006 Emmy Awards
#3
Posted: 9/7/05 at 1:20am
It's definitely not by accident.
"If you are going to do something, do it well. And leave something witchy."
-Charlie Manson
#4
Posted: 9/7/05 at 9:44am
It is not a definitive thing. It could be either...left to the imagination of the actor and the imagination of the audience.
"Fundamentalism means never having to say 'I'm wrong.'"
-- unknown
#5
Posted: 9/7/05 at 10:20am
I think it depends on how the director and actor want to show it. It doesn't say either way in the script.
Akiva
Akiva
#6
Posted: 9/7/05 at 12:37pm
i thought he intentionally did it, what the hell was that stuff he drank supposed to be?
#7
Posted: 9/7/05 at 12:42pm
He could have taken the drugs just to "get away", as so many people do...with no intention to kill himself.
"Fundamentalism means never having to say 'I'm wrong.'"
-- unknown
#8
Posted: 9/7/05 at 12:46pm
interesting! I never thought of it that way! Now i feel totally better about the character Jason!
#9
Posted: 9/7/05 at 4:09pm
broadwaybelter--the stuff that he drank is one of the drugs mentioned in Wonderland. Unless he wasnt thinking clearly he would have known the consequences as they are mentioned in Wonderland.
"Don't thank your parents, if you were raised in a nurturing environment you wouldnt be in show business"--Conan O'Brien at the 2006 Emmy Awards
#10
Posted: 9/7/05 at 4:18pm
I don't see how it could be seen as anything BUT intentional. Lucas clearly tells them not to take too much and then Jason goes ahead and drinks it ALL.
"Oh some like it hot, but I like it *really* hot." - Heat Miser
#11
Posted: 9/7/05 at 4:23pm
JASON / PETER
I've never been this bare / I've never been so scared
I've never felt such honesty / Don't stop we'll never leave
A moment of such peace / Each of us standing bare
Still you are here with me / Knowing who we have to be
Know as you hold my hand / I hoped and prayed
We're forever you and I / That you'd understand
Yeah, I always thought it was on purpose because they make it a point to explain what will happen if you take to much in Wonderland and Jason is there during that song.
I also dont really think that he regrets his desision in Bare, because even though he resolves issues with Peter he never comes to terms with the fact that he is gay, I think he wanted Peter to know that he loved him but the problems were in himself as he discribes in Cross..
Well I've tried to be strong, I've tried to belong
But I don't, or I won't, I can't, I can't
Such a simple, little word - never spoken, always heard
It's not something I can be, it's not ok, not for me
Do you know what I'm trying?
well there's my humble opinion but what I have always been confused about is if Peter knows in the song Bare what is happening, any guesses on that one?
I've never been this bare / I've never been so scared
I've never felt such honesty / Don't stop we'll never leave
A moment of such peace / Each of us standing bare
Still you are here with me / Knowing who we have to be
Know as you hold my hand / I hoped and prayed
We're forever you and I / That you'd understand
Yeah, I always thought it was on purpose because they make it a point to explain what will happen if you take to much in Wonderland and Jason is there during that song.
I also dont really think that he regrets his desision in Bare, because even though he resolves issues with Peter he never comes to terms with the fact that he is gay, I think he wanted Peter to know that he loved him but the problems were in himself as he discribes in Cross..
Well I've tried to be strong, I've tried to belong
But I don't, or I won't, I can't, I can't
Such a simple, little word - never spoken, always heard
It's not something I can be, it's not ok, not for me
Do you know what I'm trying?
well there's my humble opinion but what I have always been confused about is if Peter knows in the song Bare what is happening, any guesses on that one?
...and still you hold on, to every old song... - Adam Pascal
#12
Posted: 9/7/05 at 4:29pm
Nowhere do we hear words of "I want to die", or anything like that. in fact, Jason is energized by his love.
What I would say is that there are a number of ways to interpret the ending motive. Lucas isn't specific enough, Jason wasn't listening to him, Jason is in a confused state, Jason wants to get away from it all, and doesn't consider the reprecussions (as we all so often do)...it could also be that he intended to...the point is that it is up to the audience to decide what Jason did...and it is up to the actor to know what happened...and anything beyond that is speculation.
I speculate that either is possible.
What I would say is that there are a number of ways to interpret the ending motive. Lucas isn't specific enough, Jason wasn't listening to him, Jason is in a confused state, Jason wants to get away from it all, and doesn't consider the reprecussions (as we all so often do)...it could also be that he intended to...the point is that it is up to the audience to decide what Jason did...and it is up to the actor to know what happened...and anything beyond that is speculation.
I speculate that either is possible.
"Fundamentalism means never having to say 'I'm wrong.'"
-- unknown
#13
Posted: 9/7/05 at 4:36pm
Updated On: 10/27/05 at 04:36 PM
#14
Posted: 9/7/05 at 4:49pm
Oh, I think the show went over you, then. This show literally changed hundreds of conservatives opinions about being gay. Any show that can do that is not only good, but great...and worthy of good being spoken of it.
"Fundamentalism means never having to say 'I'm wrong.'"
-- unknown
#15
Posted: 9/7/05 at 5:00pm
TouchMe-- Hundreds?? Where did you read this?
I'm always very interested to see the cultural impact art has on society, so if you have articles about this, I'd like to see them.
Thanks.
I'm always very interested to see the cultural impact art has on society, so if you have articles about this, I'd like to see them.
Thanks.
"I hate musicals... People don't sing in real life."
"Well, maybe they should."
--Kiss of the Spider Woman (cut line)
"Well, maybe they should."
--Kiss of the Spider Woman (cut line)
#16
Posted: 9/7/05 at 5:11pm
I should qualify myself.
I based that "hundreds" comments on the number of people I know who saw the show who were opposed to pro-gay thought before. I know of about 10 such people...all who changed their minds after seeing the show. I'm sure more than those few changed their minds, too.
The show really made a reality out of those who struggle with their sexuality, and I don't know of a show like it. Commercial in its appeal, and universal enough to enact social change without offending or demeaning an opposition.
I based that "hundreds" comments on the number of people I know who saw the show who were opposed to pro-gay thought before. I know of about 10 such people...all who changed their minds after seeing the show. I'm sure more than those few changed their minds, too.
The show really made a reality out of those who struggle with their sexuality, and I don't know of a show like it. Commercial in its appeal, and universal enough to enact social change without offending or demeaning an opposition.
"Fundamentalism means never having to say 'I'm wrong.'"
-- unknown
#17
Posted: 9/7/05 at 5:47pm
Yeah, I love "Bare" and I have always wanted to somehow get everyone in my school to watch it and maybe change some of their viewpoints on homosexuality. I don't understand how someone could not be moved by it. Sorry, voiceanth. . . Plus, regardless of social value, they should see it because it is just an awesome musical. HaHa.
Well, I'm glad I'm not the only one who is confused. My two sides are that I don't think he did it on purpose because it never definitely says it and he never told anyone. I also think that would be extremely drastic because the problems with Ivy and being outed just happened. However, they are doing "Romeo and Juliet" which makes sense that the boy playing Romeo would do as Romeo did and "poison" himself.
I don't know. . .
Well, I'm glad I'm not the only one who is confused. My two sides are that I don't think he did it on purpose because it never definitely says it and he never told anyone. I also think that would be extremely drastic because the problems with Ivy and being outed just happened. However, they are doing "Romeo and Juliet" which makes sense that the boy playing Romeo would do as Romeo did and "poison" himself.
I don't know. . .
Updated On: 9/7/05 at 05:47 PM
#19
Posted: 9/7/05 at 7:18pm
I beg to differ. If for nothing else than "See Me" makes such a high percent of people cry. Any show with a song that powerful. . . You can't just dismiss it as a bad musical.
#20
Posted: 9/8/05 at 9:13am
voiceanth's post contains several points of gross inaccuracies, exaggerations and falsehoods which may be related to the fact that it would appear that after his BARE interview (if memory serves) he never wrote again for BWW. Perhaps there's more to this grudge than meets the eye?
here's the truth:
Theatermania: 7
Playbill: 22 articles
BroadwayWorld: 14 articles (and half of those were about the concerts bww produced and photo coverage of those concerts
three popular websites reviewed and apparently liked the show equally.
here's the truth:
Theatermania: 7
Playbill: 22 articles
BroadwayWorld: 14 articles (and half of those were about the concerts bww produced and photo coverage of those concerts
three popular websites reviewed and apparently liked the show equally.
Unfledge them of their...perriwigs, And they appear like bald-cootes, in the nest.
Beaumont, Knt. Malta, (1616).
Updated On: 9/8/05 at 09:13 AM
#21
Posted: 9/8/05 at 9:24am
voiceanth,
I guess I agree with a quote I heard from Tim Rice (whom I don't respect as a lyricist, but I like as a person):
"I don't care what the critics think. They are universally wrong."
Point being: appealing to the fact that critics didn't like a show doesn't prove it was a bad show, it just proves that it wasn't liked by critics. Many beautiful pieces of art were ripped apart by critics who didn't get it. I submit that "Bare" is one such piece.
I guess I agree with a quote I heard from Tim Rice (whom I don't respect as a lyricist, but I like as a person):
"I don't care what the critics think. They are universally wrong."
Point being: appealing to the fact that critics didn't like a show doesn't prove it was a bad show, it just proves that it wasn't liked by critics. Many beautiful pieces of art were ripped apart by critics who didn't get it. I submit that "Bare" is one such piece.
"Fundamentalism means never having to say 'I'm wrong.'"
-- unknown
#22
Posted: 9/8/05 at 9:25am
Well said Touchme!
Unfledge them of their...perriwigs, And they appear like bald-cootes, in the nest.
Beaumont, Knt. Malta, (1616).
#23
Posted: 9/8/05 at 12:12pm
yes well said, it certainlly WAS loved by the fans of the show and I will never understand why so many people are so bitter about the whole thing.
i agree with a quote from Mr. Dressup I believe;
"if you dont have anything nice to say, dont say anything at all"
especially when those opinions werent bieng asked for!
i agree with a quote from Mr. Dressup I believe;
"if you dont have anything nice to say, dont say anything at all"
especially when those opinions werent bieng asked for!
...and still you hold on, to every old song... - Adam Pascal
#24
Posted: 9/8/05 at 12:24pm
No, mesmerized. Opinions are always good to share in a forum like this...I just think that an appeal to critics is a cheater excuse to discount a show. I'd rather discuss what was wrong, rather than just saying, "it was bad" or "the show was a real clunker"...WHAT was bad, HOW could it be improved, etc.
"Fundamentalism means never having to say 'I'm wrong.'"
-- unknown
#25
Posted: 9/8/05 at 12:32pm
true, that is a good thing about these type of forums but I fel like it was very unnessesary to change the whole focus of someones thread by saying...By the time that thing ended, I wanted to kill myself by accident! So did every critic in town! that to me is uncalled for and unproductive on every leval. While opinions are good to share in this type of forum I feel like they would be better suited in a thread that calls for them.
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...and still you hold on, to every old song... - Adam Pascal
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