Stubhub ending fan rewards- is Hamilton to blame?

[Hellob]

Posted: 6/17/16 at 12:30pm

 I got an email saying SH rewards end effective July 6 but earned codes are good until expiration date. I'm wondering if Hamilton is the reason since almost any 2 ticket purchase will bump you into 3% earnings. If you spend 4K on 2, that's $120 which can be a free concert/sports ticket. Maybe it's costing them more than they want.

[dramamama611]

Posted: 6/17/16 at 12:43pm

I have no idea, but the rewards are still just a percentage of what they are making.  If more folks are getting rewards, that means SH is MAKING more money.

 

You'd really have to know what percentage of their sales is due to Hamilton.

[Hellob]

Posted: 6/17/16 at 12:55pm

They did say that Hamilton is their biggest seller in an email someone posted on here regarding making sure your sold tickets are valid. I agree that they are making tons of money but maybe 3% rebates are adding up. Most people don't reach the 3% if they just buy a pair of tickets but they do if it's Hamilton. 

I'm thinking the new program will be a point per ticket instead of basing it on the sale amount. I've been a member for awhile and don't remember if the program has changed since joining. It's just interesting that the change was announced once the ticket prices REALLY shot up. 

[ChiTheaterFan]

Posted: 6/17/16 at 12:58pm

Stubhub sells tickets to nearly every major sporting event, concert, etc. In the grand scheme of things, I doubt Hamilton is a huge revenue source for them when you think about the fact that there are 30+ teams for each major sport and about a zillion college teams.  

[Hellob]

Posted: 6/17/16 at 1:28pm

^^^ I think the profit per transaction is way higher than almost anything other than a championship game/series and those are only a one shot or 7 game deal. Iirc, many of the professional sports teams are contracted with SH as the authorized resellers which means that the money isn't all SH's, right? When I got Mets/Cubs, it was similar to the TM platform with a new code and my name on the ticket. I'm sure hot concert tours bring money but a 50 city tour isn't going to get the money an 8 shows a week will. I'm just speculating anyway. Lol :)

Updated On: 6/17/16 at 01:28 PM

[ChiTheaterFan]

Posted: 6/17/16 at 1:37pm

Oh I'm sure you're right that the profit per transaction is generally higher. But we're talking about one event (or 2 or 3 when the other cities open) versus thousands of events across the country. Stubhub probably sells thousands of tickets a day and there just is a much more limited number of Hamilton tickets. 

[Hellob]

Posted: 6/17/16 at 2:14pm

That's a great point. I tried looking into it after getting the email but I'm either bad at googling or no one is talking about it. Maybe I'll see if their fb/twitter says anything other than "we have something exciting in store!" If it does end up being a per ticket vs per spend program, I'm going to be inclined towards Hamilton being involved. I get why they don't release their financials but I'm so curious to know how much the fakes have cost them. Technically, they are supposed to get you similar tickets at the expense of the original seller if the price is higher  but if that person is a fake and the buyer refused a refund... An acquaintance of mine got fakes and I told him not to accept the refund and insist on replacing bc he couldn't get similar tickets now for the price paid then. They did it and it was about $1500 more. 

[dramamama611]

Posted: 6/17/16 at 2:43pm

Can I ask why its so important to be able to point a finger at Hamilton (or not) for being the cause?  Lots of places change the rewards programs they offer.  I don't think you will find any proof one way or another.

[Hellob]

Posted: 6/17/16 at 2:55pm

dramamama611 said: "Can I ask why its so important to be able to point a finger at Hamilton (or not) for being the cause?  Lots of places change the rewards programs they offer.  I don't think you will find any proof one way or another.

 

"

It's not like that... I'm only curious about the timing of the change coming a couple weeks after the email about it being the biggest seller and the "accidentally" fake tickets sold. It's not a good or bad thing. I was just wondering if anyone else felt like it was the impetus for the changes but like you and chitheaterfan said, it could be other reasons. If it is due to Hamilton fraud and/or excessive rewards, I'm definitely not blaming Hamilton in a sinister way. 

Tl, dr I'm naturally nosy! :)

[dramamama611]

Posted: 6/17/16 at 3:00pm

Oh, I didn't take it to be sinister, at all.    

I'm guessing the SELLER is responsible selling fake tickets, so SH isn't really losing anything, as there actually wasn't any ticket to sell.

[Hellob]

Posted: 6/17/16 at 3:15pm

dramamama611 said: "Oh, I didn't take it to be sinister, at all.    

I'm guessing the SELLER is responsible selling fake tickets, so SH isn't really losing anything, as there actually wasn't any ticket to sell.

 

"

But if the seller isn't real and left no trace after getting paid, SH has to refund OOP and if a buyer is smart they can demand replacements since that's the technical policy. I sold tickets for a baseball game but then I could go, I asked SH and the policy is a 20% penalty and any excess cost of the buyer's replacement tickets. I stayed home! 

I guess they have some success tracking down ghosts but who knows the %? That's a whole other can of worms. 

[dramamama611]

Posted: 6/18/16 at 12:12am

I would expect they don't get paid immediately....so they could hold the payment, but I really have no idea.

[ChiTheaterFan]

Posted: 6/18/16 at 12:26am

At least the way it works with baseball tickets is you get paid immediately when the buyer purchases the tickets. But as hellob says, if the tickets are invalid you have to pay whatever stubhub has to pay to make things right with the buyer plus a 20% fee. They do this by requiring sellers to have a valid credit card on file. But I imagine the fraudulent sellers have ways of tricking the system somehow. 

 

It may work differently for Hamilton tickets if the markup is higher but I've always heard of stubhub paying the seller when the tickets are delivered. 

[haterobics]

Posted: 6/18/16 at 4:18am

Hellob said: " I got an email saying SH rewards end effective July 6 but earned codes are good until expiration date. I'm wondering if Hamilton is the reason since almost any 2 ticket purchase will bump you into 3% earnings. If you spend 4K on 2, that's $120 which can be a free concert/sports ticket. Maybe it's costing them more than they want."

Yes, the show consistently netting them bigger fees than every other show on Broadway (since their fee is a percentage of the cost) is the reason they don't want to give a pittance of it away?!?

Not to mention, you can only spend it on their site, where they increase their profit, since they wouldn't owe themselves the extra fees, only paying off the seller. Seem unconnected...

[Hellob]

Posted: 6/18/16 at 5:29am

^^^^ But that's exactly my point, let's say a SH sale is $500. That's $10 in immediate rewards which you spend on their site but still have to supplement the difference. However, if you spend 3k-5k for 2 Hamilton tickets, it's $90-150 in rewards which can be a free ticket for something. So they are making nothing on that sale. People are also more likely to let a $10-20 code expire than a $100 one. I guess I'll just wait and see what happens in July. I'm not an economics whiz but I think 3% rebate of gross sales and a higher than average redemption rate costs more than they want. 

 Eta I understand that they are making a lot in fees but they are also likely getting hit regularly by fraud. Even one 3k pair from a ghost seller negates profit of 5+ pairs.

 

Updated On: 6/18/16 at 05:29 AM

[Melissa25]

Posted: 6/18/16 at 9:34am

I think the removal of the loyalty rewards program has to do with Stubhub tightening it's belt to re-focus on it's global expansion.  I am sure Hamilton helped Stubhub revenues but it is a mere drop in the bucket when compared to sports arena and MSG-like venue cash cows.  

https://techcrunch.com/2016/05/24/ebay-buys-ticketbis-to-expand-its-stubhub-business-into-europe-latin-america/

[Hellob]

Posted: 6/18/16 at 9:56am

Melissa25 said: "I think the removal of the loyalty rewards program has to do with Stubhub tightening it's belt to re-focus on it's global expansion.  I am sure Hamilton helped Stubhub revenues but it is a mere drop in the bucket when compared to sports arena and MSG-like venue cash cows.  

https://techcrunch.com/2016/05/24/ebay-buys-ticketbis-to-expand-its-stubhub-business-into-europe-latin-america/

 

"

Thanks so much for the link. I was trying to find information about what's happening with SH. This makes sense. 3% does make a difference if you're trying to expand. Thanks again! :)