Sweeney - The First Coming- Page 3

[popular_elphie]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 12:02am

You can't listen to Wicked because there are teenyboppers on the board that love it?

Turn off the computer and listen.

[jasonf]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 12:03am

Moxie - you flipped it - <3 is a heart if you tip your head to the side...

[mrs felciano]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 12:03am

You know what Jason.. actually.. I agree with you. I saw the OBC of Wicked and fell in love, and now I dont even take out the cast recording.

I just wanted to make it a point that if you're a fan of the revival and not the obc.. it doesn't mean you're not a real Sweeney fan or whatever.. you know? Because they're two completly different productions.

:puts away claws:

[jasonf]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 12:06am

Mrs. F -- thank you for the rational response! I never SAID anyone wasn't a "real" fan. I don't deny their love for the show! All I'm saying is how it affected ME and then everyone took it so personally.

[wickedrentq]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 12:06am

I guess better isn't the word I'm looking for. I more meant...everyone comes out of a show with a different experience, and with the way some people think, they can latch onto certain aspects of a show and truly contemplate it, and in their eyes, the show then becomes intelligent.

I don't know, I just feel that with all the Wicked bashing that goes on, people overlook the merit of the show. Fine it may not be as much of an "artistic achievement" as Sondheim shows, but there really are universal themes that can move people, and certain material that I know I posted before that makes me analyze for hours. I just don't think it's fair to accuse Wicked fans of just jumping on--I think they can like it, and take it to the extreme with jumping on, but there is a lot for people to like about that show. That's all.

[aspiringactress]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 12:07am

I believe Sweeney originally opened before ANYONE was ever considering having me, if my parents had even met yet.

In my opinion, if a revival can bring audiences that didn't have the option of seeing the original for whatever reason, then that is a beautiful thing. So is the idea that two different generations can appreciate the same show completely differently, or that one generation can appreciate two different incarnations of a show in different ways. Theatre is a fluid medium, and the types of reactions people have will constantly change.

Though I was familiar with the show beforehand, and have always loved Sondheim, I feel extremely lucky to have been able to see this production.

[orangeskittles]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 12:10am

No, we get threads like OMG, I <3 MaNoEl.

Please, use the search function and find the thread with this title. There's an official love thread, but there isn't a single person on there that types like MySpace junkie. Don't tell them there's no reason to be defensive if you're going to insult people that don't deserve it.

I've seen Sweeney, Company and Follies, heard Assassins, Into the Woods, Merrily We Roll Along, and Sunday in the Park With George, and haven't posted once in the Mano Love threads. Am I allowed to like Sweeney now?

[Patronus]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 12:12am

Am I allowed to like Sweeney now?

Your application has been received. Please allow 4-6 weeks for processing and one of our representives will notify you regarding Stage2 testing procedures pending approval.
Updated On: 8/2/06 at 12:12 AM

[luvtheEmcee]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 12:13am

And denied, due to unacceptable birth year.

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 12:14am

This is the same immature elitism that ends up with "My friend saw Kristin in a movie and im'ed me about it but SPELLED HER NAME WITH AN E!!!!!!! OMG!!!!!!!! CAN YOU BELIEVE HOW STUPID SHE IS??? Anyway, I liked Kristin all the way back when she was in that Charlie Brown show, so what does she even know?"

[MOXIEINTHECITY]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 12:15am

"I fail to see how a group of extremely passionate/aggressive fans could really impact your particular feelings on liking the music of a show or not."


Here's how. Whenever someone posts a dissenting comment about a show or actor that is beloved, they get piled on. Which totally kills any hope of a conversation. Not an adult conversation, just a conversation.

And if anyone dares to suggest that some people are crushing on an actor and that's why they like a show those same people find their way to that thread and swarm around said poster. There is no freedom to have a thought or an opinion without being accused of being ignorant, patronizing or a hypocrite.

And, I'm sorry, but it's been my experience that the posters who most often get riled up, defensive, angry, confrontational are the same ones who are fans of certain actors or actresses. Sweeney, Wedding Singer, Jersey Boys mostly.

I hated Laura Benanti in The Wedding Singer. Thought she was too old. There. I said it.

[Patronus]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 12:18am

Okay, I guess I don't fail to see it. I just can't comprehend why someone would allow it to happen.

If I like it, I like it. If you think less of me for liking it, then so be it.

::resumes listening to J.C. Chasez's "Blowin Me Up With Her Love"::

Updated On: 8/2/06 at 12:18 AM

[Johnnytoc]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 12:20am

Moxie, you attempted this point before by attacking the people on the Mano Love Thread. Remember, you Also failed to see the intelligent conversations and people there and just saw the giggly fangirls who type OMG I LOVE MANO, because there are so many...

[sweetestsiren]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 12:20am

I do understand feeling protective of something that you've loved, but I think that you're just letting the annoying fans (and yes, there are undeniably some of them, as there are with ANY show) get to you unnecessarily. They're still supporting the show you love. It's elitist to judge people by the way that they became interested in a show, particularly if as a result they put in the effort to find out about it and appreciate it as a whole. I just feel that, and this is possibly me interpreting some of what you said differently than intended, you're not leaving much room for the possibility that someone can end up a true fan of a show that they might have been initially interested in for reasons that you deem unworthy.

Edited to add: So anyway, although I disagree with jasonf's sentiments, I think that a modicum of self-awareness is helpful. There's no point in pretending otherwise if your primary motivation for seeing a show is a specific actor (which, honestly, I don't think happens that often in the case of Sweeney). Do I love Company? Yes. Would I have traveled to Cincinnati to see a regional productionn, even one Doyle-directed, if Raul Esparza hadn't been playing the lead? Well, no. I'm fine with admitting that. But I would never have made the trip if I didn't think he was a brilliant actor who'd do great things with that part; I would not have made such an effort for a shallow fangirl crush, which I think is kind of the default asssumption given my age group. People see shows for specific performers all the time, but apparently if you're a teenaged or twentysomething girl, it's not possible to truly admire an actor that you also find attractive. Still, there's no point in pretending that Raul wasn't a big part of the reason I saw it -- and that's where I think that some people get into trouble. Does all of that mean that there's no way that I can possibly have appreciated the show? I'd hate to think so. Updated On: 8/2/06 at 12:20 AM

[MOXIEINTHECITY]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 12:20am

OMG! JC? He's the worst. I mean, he so totally wants to be Justin but he never will. You're a dork. I'm taking you off my friends list on Myspace.

:)

[MOXIEINTHECITY]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 12:34am

I did? Or did I write a column about how I was inspired by the crushing, posted it here, and was effectively deemed a condescending witch?

What I've condemned over and over again is the obsessive and unhealthy behavior that some (some. SOME. Like, two) of the Mano fans have exhibited. Sorry...getting PM's calling me a whore because I wrote someone and told them how much I was irked by another poster? Disturbing. Having some of the Mano fans swarm my blog with their rants because they got bent that I posted a comment on Mano's blog? Crazy.

Getting an "anonymous" rant on my blog from someone posing as a friend of Mano's who was actually a poster here who barely knows him other than when she talks to him at the stage door? Disturbing.

Then getting 9 paragraph e-mails from that person who goes on to ramble about how if people here knew how close she was with Mano they'd think she's lying or would be jealous of her while saying over and over again that "she knew him first?"

Having posters then go on to write things about my sex life and my personal life on forum boards? Crazy.

Please. I have said so many times I think the crushing is great. It's the hostile, f----- up behavior that comes with it that I've complained about.
Updated On: 8/2/06 at 12:34 AM

[loudasthehelliwant]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 1:09am

I liked it very, very much before the revival.

I saw a college production of it last April (and loved the OBC), back when they were just reporting "Hey, there's going to be a Sweeney Todd revival!" And I heard the description, and was like, "Eh, that's going to suck." Then it got good reviews, I picked up the cast recording and loved that as well, and saw the current production and loved it.

I confess that I do love it more now. But I think having a professional productin and understanding the show a little better made that difference, not it's being popular.

[GodIHopeIGetIt]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 1:26am

I saw the original cast. Didn't love it, to tell the truth. Sweeney has never been my favorite Sondheim score, never will be. I didn't like it what so ever before the revival, but this new cast really made me love it (and yes, I've seen it six times).

Kids like Wicked, yep, and that's pop. Here's a big, beautiful, SONDHEIM (for god's sake) piece of musical theater that some kids love. You're complaining about this? My thirteen year old niece, as a matter of fact, who I took to see Sweeney, is becoming a Sondheim buff. I think that says something. 'Sweeneyboppers', as you call them (I have to say, nice word), are usually younger theatergoes with an eye for good music.

I don't like how cynical people are on this board (and you all say - "WELL THEN GO SOMEWHERE ELSE!!"), but let it go. Young people are getting into good theater. What a horrible, horrible thing!!!

[Unknown User]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 1:26am

This probably pertains more to the initial post than what we might be discussing now, but it seems that some people aren't considering that someone can appreciate a work in itself. Is it great when someone takes such an interest in a certain work that he or she tries to find out about previous productions? Sure. On the other hand, I think you can fully appreciate a current work even if you haven't, in this case, watched the original version with Lansbury. Simply seeing the original production doesn't necessarily mean you have a greater understanding of the current show. For example, I absolutely loved the revival of Cabaret, and it was my first real introduction to a more mature breed of shows. I know absolutely nothing about the original production, but it doesn't mean I'm any less entitled to have liked the revival.

[GodIHopeIGetIt]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 1:33am

Exactly siamese dream. And who says the originals are always the best? Lansbury was brilliant as Lovett (and I do like her better than Lupone on the cast recordings), but sometimes people can come in. You become slightly brainwashed by a love of one cast/person or another, but the original isn't always the best.

[C is for Company]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 1:35am

I've liked Sweeney for over 2 years. I got into the tour dvd and OBC and being a fan of Sondheim's previous works, delved right into it. Since the news of the revival I was exhilarated to see what I had treasured so much. Saw it 6 times and love it, not at all bothered by any new concepts or trying to take a show this great and flexible in a new direction.
To me, it clearly worked and only intensified my love for the material and the geniuses who tailored all aspects of it so well to withstand the kind of treatment it was given.

[BroadwayChica]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 1:36am

I agree, sd. We're VERY lucky that a filmed version of the original production of Sweeney Todd exists, but the same isn't true of other shows. If I wasn't alive to have seen the original "South Pacific", or "Company", does that mean I can't appreciate, understand or even love a revival? Even a conceptual revival as the one Doyle thought up? No. It's elitist to assume an attitude that anyone unfamiliar with the original is somehow less "worthy", or unable to fully understand a conceptual revival of a certain piece.

Yes, there are a number of obnoxious fans, and it's too bad that they have "ruined it" for others. That shouldn't detract from appreciating the work in itself, which is, I truly believe, a brilliant achievement in theater.

I never saw Company onstage, though I have listened to the OBC recording many times. That's not going to stop me from seeing Doyle's revival. And if I fall in love with it (as I suspect I shall) I don't see why I wouldn't be "entitled" to voice my thoughts on it.

If the cute cast brings younger people to theater (and that goes for any show), it's ultimately not a bad thing.

[Color and Light]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 2:13am

I don't see much reason to complain about the growing number of Sweeney Todd/Sondheim fans due to the revival. Back in high school, I was the only person in my drama department, save for the teacher, who even knew Sweeney Todd existed. I'm elated that the revival has managed to pull in new, younger fans - why are we complaining about another generation of people who appreciate Sondheim?

At any rate, I haven't met any fans of the revival who were quick to bust out the "OMFG I LOVE MANOOOO lolz Sondheim is teh fugz" routine. Certainly some of them have crushes, but that doesn't make them less of a fan, or mean that they don't "get" it. Can't a person have an appreciation for a production and fancy an actor at the same time without being labled as a drooling, randy teenage girl?

Updated On: 8/2/06 at 02:13 AM

[nobodyhome]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 4:51am

So what I'm getting from this thread is that one of the possible reasons people like this production is because the cast is hot? This cast? Oh, well. Chacun à son goût, I guess.

Just joking. Kind of.

Anyway, I want to say that anyone who didn't see the original production live at the Uris can't know what the production was like, or at least can't know from the DVD of the national tour. It does not accurately represent what the original production was like on Broadway. Ain't nothin' darker about the current production.

Also, there was an actress named Marjorie Rambeau who was in a lot of movies and also did some Broadway. She was very good. And there was a poet named Arthur Rimbaud. And there was a philosopher named Friedrich Nietzsche. The spelling of his name is particularly confusing.

[kgee30]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 9:16am

I'm confused by this thread: don't we get to like what we like just because we like it? Why would my credentials matter? As long as I'm not sitting in front of you in the theater waving my arms and screaming "OMG Mano please come home with me and father all my children!!!" why would my reasons for liking the show influence your reason for liking the show in any way?

I don't mean to be as catty as I know that sounds, I just don't understand.