Tenor or Baritone? What is really my range? I'm confused about this and more... help!

Well didn't know where to post this, but seems these boards in general have lots of information around em and did do the search looking for stuff on baritones and tenors, but all the info never agreed, plus still confused. So now comes this post...

Well not an experienced singer or actor, but this spring did the musical for my senior year and had lots of fun. I just loved the singing and getting to act my part and the whole thing. I played Enjolras and well, it was just great. Yet, we had a short time and it was just hit the damn notes and that's it(went up to G). Not much about voice types and ranges, I did it and that was that. Then onto this summer and Seussical and Wickersham Brother 1. It's high... I have to sing up to the high C and also Bb. And well after goin through this I decided to figure out everything about singing and see what I needed to know.

So first I figured out my lowest note - A over an octave under middle C. Anything under can't come out and even that A is more of a low talking voice. So I got that down... now my high end. I can hit an A in my chest voice, it is belted and I guess a bit strained to get there, but I can hit it and my voice doesn't really hurt or anything. I do have to be loud to go up to the G and A though. However, when I sing I'm usually a bit louder just because I'm kind of a loud guy in general...
so I can't help it

But now I'm stuck around belting and going froma belting A to a high C in falsetto, horrible change (Monkey Around - goes F - A - high C). So I try to figure out what to do to strengthen falsetto and find out guys have a head voice.

I asked the music lady for Seussical and she said I've probably done it without noticing and that guys do have 3 voices (head/chest/falsetto). She said I'm a belter though (I guess meaning that I am belting my notes rather than going into a head voice)... now I'm wondering if this is bad and if these notes I'm belting are even in my range and what my range is (upper parts).

So in general I'm confused (do know my lower limits and that I need a voice teacher tho!).

What is my range? My lowest note I can even make a sound with is an A below the C below middle C. When I sing a soft song the lower notes around the D to B below middle C are easier to sing softly, going up to D or E if I'm singing soft I can't be in chest without getting a bit loud. If it's uptempo I can get loud and the notes seem pretty low under A below middle C, but the notes B-F are pretty good than G and A I gotta really belt.

Then there is head voice, which I'm still clueless about?!?! I always thought it was the same as falsetto, guess I was wrong.

Oh and my timbre... well since I've heard this matters, I'll attempt at least explain my talking voice. I'm 18 and it hasn't matured... but isn't incredibly deep and rich. It's not girl or feminine either though, but I'd say it's a bit more on the higher side. It's not crystal clear like a kid or anything either, nor is it really raspy though... singing it probably gets a clearer sound I think and well, yea out of all the guys in Les Miserables and Seussical I have the loudest/strongest voices, I was louder when I wasn't mic'ed at times lol. That's best I can do with timbre tho, sorry.

But anyway, I'm confused... I'm starting to really enjoy this whole acting, singing and theatre stuff. I just don't know so much and want to learn and become a better singer.

So help please, I'd appreciate it.

First thing I wanna know is the notes in my range and if the belted ones are even there. What voice type I am and what I should be singing... and just whatever else you can answer or even think I should know. I just need help in general, since I am a bit clueless it seems.

Only thing I do know is I need a voice teacher (which I'll get soon).

Anywayz, please help and thanks in advance to anyone who helps.

Updated On: 7/20/05 at 01:56 AM

ok thanks... I guess I am probably around there. My thoughts were a baritone/tenor and I think from what I remember reading a lyric baritone is a higher sounding (more based on timbre maybe) baritone. I definetly think a voice teacher will help me the most.

And well found another messageboard that had stuff on SLS, speech level singing, and well one sentence there helped me a lot. I think I just was able to do head voice (altho softly since parents are sleeping).

Took my keyboard and played high C and hit the note in falsetto, purposely what I knew was falsetto and went down and of course it got hard lower and was a huge difference when I had to switch to chest... dramatic change.

Went to the same high C and hit a bit differently, still not from my chest though and went down and it was smooth!!!

I think it was my head voice I hit although I was sorta whispering the notes and well it made it harder, but I THINK I did it and it helped a lot that the post I read said to try that from high to low.

Since from low to high... I either switch to falsetto or strain my chest, but high to low it was much easier. Now I just don't think I can put this to song tho and still am unsure about it but it REALLY helped a lot.

And a teacher will help even more so that is the next step.

Thanks for the post and anyone else with advice would be helpful.

And oh, I've been told and noticed it usually never goes up to high C, and usually A or B will be the very highest for male parts. Which I guess is really mainly high baritones or so anyway, maybe tenors, but won't need to get really high ever in musical theatre. Either way, can't exactly change my range or timbre so what I am is what I am, just gotta figure that out so I know what to sing and all that.

I think I'd like my voice a bit more deep though. I'm 18 and I think my voice has developed pretty fully, but who knows maybe it'll get a deeper/richer/powerful sound to it in the future or with training could it change for the better? Who knows... I'll just try to improve my voice the best I can and gotta get ymself a teacher.

Anyway, thanks again and any other help would be appreciated.

You'll find that as you continue singing (and doing so properly) your voice may change a bit more--either higher or lower.

Age is also a factor. When I started singing in my church choir, I was considered a "second tenor". However in church choral music there rarely are parts for second tenors. Therefore I usually sing the bass line. After 25 years of choral singing, I can honestly say that I am a solid baritone. I have decent range, especially in my lower notes. Still, I've covered a tenor part when our sole tenor was ill. I was dizzy as heck because I was using my head voice and I wasn't used to it.

---

You're probably a high baritone.

However, take voice lessons, and wait a few years. Then you'll know for sure :)

Sorry, but unless you can hit and sustain a high C you are not considered a Tenor.By Broadway or Opera standards.
The philosophy that not every tenor can hit a high c is all warm and fuzzy but terribly misleading. If a casting director puts in a breakdown- Male Tenor. They want someone who can sing to a high C. Period. The role may not require a high C, but they expect you to have that. You will surely piss A LOT of people off if you claim to be a Tenor and are not. At least in the world of Professional theatre. Timbre is one thing voice classification is another.
And yes I do agree there are Baritones and Basses that can sing high c's, they are still not in their optimal range. There are also Tenors who can not hit high C's and top out at A5. But it is usually due to lack of training.
However the high C is what is expected.Unless otherwise stated for the role.

There is a lot of competition out there and I can guarantee you that anyone working in Broadway who claims to be a Tenor.... can hit a high C and sustain it.

Well ok here goes my two cents which is not worth more than anyone elses but I do a have a degree in voice and if there's one thing I can tell you with a great deal of certainty is DON't look for advice on how to sing on here. Not that some of what I've read hasn't been good or even great advice, but the best advice is to find a teacher with an excellent reputation that you feel comfortable with and that you trust and listen at least in the beginning, only to them.

Singing is like everything else in life everyone has an opinion
but not everyone that has an opinion knows what they're talking about.

And that's my opinion.

mpaosong, you are 100% wrong. range has absolutely NOTHING, 0% to do with voice classification. it all has to do with the qulaity of the voice... voice classifications were developed for choral singing, not solo performance. and a conductor would rather have a group of men with similar "hero" voices (bright) and a group of men with similar "villain" voices (dark) so they blend together as a group. the same goes for women. it does not matter whether these people are singing in head or chest voice, or falsetto for men. there have been many tenors who can sing lower than some basses, altos who can sing ridiculously high, etc. it has NOTHING to do with range. a developed singer will have a large range no matter what voice part they claim to be. so stop parading around like you know what you are talking about when you clearly have no idea.

I thought my apology would put this to rest but I guess not for you.
First of all I have never “paraded” as anything. That was never my intention.
I was only trying to be helpful. I would never intentionally give anyone singing advice. And I stand by the fact that I did not. I recommended a voice teacher.
I was stating something that I thought would be helpful. Period. Nothing else. No hostility, and again I apologize if it came out wrong. It was a knee jerk reaction to something that I don’t agree with, and more than anything I hate for people to go to auditions with unrealistic expectations. I‘ll except that there are MANY opinions on this range issue. And, I will leave it at that.

I am very new to BWW.com and only heard about it from an actor I know who wanted me to see a funny post about him. When I got to the site I was so incredibly impressed with the amount of people that really care about Broadway. I respect Broadway performers and couldn’t be happier that they are finally getting some of the attention they deserve. I would never intentionally hurt or mislead anyone who participates in the Message Boards. I sincerely thought it might be helpful information.
I guess it is just better to keep those opinions to myself. This probably isn’t the right forum for it. Again my apologies and I only wish everyone the best with their auditioning etc…

mpaosong--don't worry! You're fine. We know you were just trying to be helpful. There was no need to apologize but your apology is definitely accepted.

apdarcey--chill out, dude. Oh, and by the way, although every professional singer should have a large range, range most definitely is part of voice classification.

I kidna know your problem Jay. I can belt up to an A or sometimes a B-flat, but I also have a headvoice/fasletto. I really think it's falsetto, but my choir direct seems to believe it's a head voice. Anyways, that can kick in anywhere from E below middle C above. And it can take me to the E above the C above middle C. God, I'm confusing myself.

So technically I am a tenor, as I can reach and sustain a C (and then some), but it's not belted. Is that a problem?

Whoa this post went crazy! Thank you everyone for any advice you gave... main one I got being, get a teacher! lol.

And another (one reason I made this post) don't tell anyone you are a tenor or baritone when you are actually the other. Since that is one reason I'd like to know the difference.

And sustain high C, in chest voice? Or in falsetto? Or head?

I really (as I have said in this post) don't have a head voice and can sustain high C in falsetto (have to do it twice in this play). Head voice, well... maybe I can at some point, but no idea, my chest only goes up to a high A and that's belting. And yes, I know, belting is bad (although I think sometimes it can't kill you, since I personally am not belting so til it hurts, plus sometimes it gives the song more power and emotion... plus well I can't frikin help it, i'm a loud person!)

I definetly gotta get a teacher tho, and well, that will be sometime in the next week or so... I have my dress rehearsal tomorrow and than 3 shows the following 2 days, so those 4 performances with the few belted G's and A's here and there are just gonna have to happen. I'll rest my voice up after that and get a teacher.

My goal is to get a head and mix voice (good or bad, just learn to do it and notice it and sing it etc) so I can not belt the higher notes for the most part. Unless once and a while for a certain song I need it... since sometimes I do think a powerful belt can be needed, as long as you are still acting and putting emotion out there and not just yelling for the heck of it.

Well... that's all I got to say now. Still clueless on my range although I think I'm most likely a highish baritone of some sort I guess and will hopefully develop my head and mix voice with lessons and get singing better in the future.

Thanks again for any help and any more help is appreciated as well.

If I can at some point get a recording of myself singing... than maybe people can tell me what voice I am, although I'll probably have a voice teacher by that time anyway. Either way, I'll post it anyway at some point since I'll get some other opinions.

And curious, does where your voice is best mean anything for what voice you are?

Example: Les Miserables - Do you hear the people sing... it starts on a, peaks at middle C, goes down to my lowest note (low A) and ends on F for the Enjolras part. That sounded pretty low in my voice when on stage. Once I get to B or middle C and up my voice gets a bit more comfortable for me to sing... like up to D and E. Under that it's just low, unless it's a soft song than the lower notes than sound better since for whatever reason slower and soft songs are easier sang in a lower key.

I dunno, maybe where my voice is strong has nothin to do with it, but it's stronger in my middle or upper part of it though, and easier to sing.

Anyway, as I said in my above reply, when you say sustain a high C, what do you mean?!?! in chest, mix, head? Since I can hit high A in chest... and if I need to hit high C in chest and sustain it, hell no, I'm no damn tenor. I can hit and sustain it in falsetto and well, can't exactly do head or mix voice so no idea there... but oh well.

Anyway, I gotta get goin to sleep... need to rest. Night!

oh ok, well either way, I don't think I will ever hit high C. It just seems unattainable in pure chest voice (for me). Plus dunno if you can expand chest voice range or just have to use mix and head to expand range (if anyone can answer that, it'd be awesome... since it'd be cool if I could expand my chest voice so I could say hit G and A easier in chest voice as well as learn head/mix and hit it there too).

Either way, I'm gonna believe you since I have been told that I will almost never have to hit high C as a guy in any musical theatre, tenor or not(seussical being an exception I guess lol, but I go falsetto so it makes it easy, plus only way I can do it as of now).

Either way, I'll just find a teacher and train my ass off and see where it leads me. And whatever voice I am, whether it be baritone or tenor... that's that and I'll find out at some point.

Now back to sleep (woke up cuz I'm hungry... maybe should get a quick somethin to eat, but I just wanna sleep a bit longer).