Which version of The Scarlet Pimpernel is your favourite!?

[philly03]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 12:01am

With all the garbage on this forum, minds well just add to the stupidicity. There couldn't be a better time to ask this question.

Personally, mine is SP4! It felt like they just got it right that time around. Too bad that one wasn't on Broadway!

[Gary Indiana]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 12:16am

I know this isn't supposed to be a serious thread, but I've always wondered about SP4. Where was it done and what were the changes compared to the other versions?

[philly03]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 12:22am

SP4 was the national tour. Primarily, some of the dialouge from SP1 was re-instated (as most was cut from SP2 & SP3 so it'd be more music/singing then play-ish). A slight change of cast size/tracks by I think two or three-ish people. The sets resembled more of what was seen with SP2 (which with the theatre changed for SP3 were all downsized). Also, Marguerite for the most part lost the French accent, so really only Chauvelin had the accent. Also, some more musical orchestrational parts were added (*spoiler*: such as when Marguerite + Armand were riding in the carriage to prison).

Not too much from SP3 - SP4. Douglas Sills came back too :)!

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 1:04am

3.0 was my favorite. It's also the version that's licenced if I'm not mistaken.

[SporkGoddess]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 1:54am

SP3 was my favorite, minus "You Are My Home," of which I preferred the original.

[Gary Indiana]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 2:05am

Thanks Philly. SP1 is my favorite musical. I hated SP2, but never saw 3 or 4, so it's nice to hear about the changes that were made.

[nealb1]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 2:13am

Only saw 1 version of the show - June of 1998, the day before the Tony Awards. Douglas Sills was very, very good, and clearly deserved his Best Actor Tony nomination. The rest of the show........eeeggghhhh. Didn't really like it. Not my thing.
Updated On: 8/31/08 at 02:13 AM

[best12bars]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 10:00am

I saw it in L.A. with Sills. Was that SP4?

I liked it much better than I thought I would. I enjoyed the show quite a bit, actually.

And my favorite version of the Scarlet Pimpernel is "The Court Jester" with Danny Kaye.

[stupidbeans]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 10:11am

man, was anyone there last night. EPIC

[philly03]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 2:24pm

Yupp SP4 was the tour that had a somewhat lengthy run in Los Angeles and Sills was still with it.

And SP3 is the licensed version to my knowledge. Unfortunately, people like to make their own versions and I've seen H.S./regional productions that have actually made a reprise to You Are My Home which is lengthy with Armand + Marguerite, or they add Lullaby again before I'll Forget You (which is practically always included). I don't actually know if they have the freedom to do that (more than likely not!), but I know they can't use "Only Love."

And SP1 was too boring (I still standby that was the shows downfall. No matter how great the actors were, it was still overall a boring show) with all the dialouge, which is why I like SP4 better. SP3 was just too downsized looking for me though! Somehow, Frank Wildhorn has never disappointed with a great cast (& replacements) for both Jekyll & HYDE and this. It's almost impossible to pick a favourite, other than Sills, which the role is certainly his!

[philly03]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 2:24pm

Yupp SP4 was the tour that had a somewhat lengthy run in Los Angeles and Sills was still with it.

And SP3 is the licensed version to my knowledge. Unfortunately, people like to make their own versions and I've seen H.S./regional productions that have actually made a reprise to You Are My Home which is lengthy with Armand + Marguerite, or they add Lullaby again before I'll Forget You (which is practically always included). I don't actually know if they have the freedom to do that (more than likely not!), but I know they can't use "Only Love."

And SP1 was too boring (I still standby that was the shows downfall. No matter how great the actors were, it was still overall a boring show) with all the dialouge, which is why I like SP4 better. SP3 was just too downsized looking for me though! Somehow, Frank Wildhorn has never disappointed with a great cast (& replacements) for both Jekyll & HYDE and this. It's almost impossible to pick a favourite, other than Sills, which the role is certainly his!

[SporkGoddess]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 8:37pm

I like "Only Love." It's one of the few songs that actually corresponds with a scene from the book.

[philly03]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 9:32pm

And Madame Guillotine from SP1 without Chauvelin's huge solo parts. The way it opened.

From SP1 to SP2, they really went from let's use the book as the main source (which Sills still will absolutely defend that's where he gets his source material from as well, despite the fact that he says the movie was what made him audition for it) to the 1982 movie mostly. Regardless, a lot of the ensemble costumes/ballgowns seemed to be based off of those outfits as well. With the big corporations taking over the producing necesities and decisions, most of the other producers stepped back and I'm sure they realized most people would recognize the film more than the book (although I can't agree!).

[Yankeefan007]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 9:35pm

Which one did I see?

Doug Sills, Rachel York, Rex Smith.

[LizzieCurry]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 9:36pm

Whichever one they did at Sacramento Music Circus.

[D2]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 9:40pm

What the hell is "dialouge?"

[SporkGoddess]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 9:45pm

Blegh, the 1982 movie was terrible, IMO.

I'm biased because I'm a huuuuge fan of the book series. I like the musical, but the book is better. For instance, Marguerite's supposed to be the cleverest woman in Europe in the books. In the musical, she's so dumb you want to shake her.

Also, I find the Chauvelin thing icky (you cannot find him sexy if you've read the books, haha,) and I'm upset that they didn't include Suzanne.

Updated On: 8/31/08 at 09:45 PM

[philly03]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 10:00pm

Yankeefan you saw SP2, the final production at the Minskoff. That's actually, of the three Broadway versions, the one that got the best reviews. I don't even recall if the critics were invited back for SP3, because of the whole Tony thing.

I kind of liked the 1982 movie!

And I completely agree about Marguerite. I felt atleast that Christine Andreas (LOL who SporkGoddess if I'm not mistaken, you're not a terribly big fan of) made her sort of independent, if that's even the word. Like she was always on her own type deal. The book/song changes didn't help the character either. I think "Only Love" actually helped prove that she was knew what was going on. Carolee Carmello did a pretty good job with it too, but Rachel York and especially Amy Bodnar from what I recall really missed the point of the character. Bodnar the most, but I feel like they needed to make it funny to sell the tour.

And Chauvelin in the original book (I only read the first/original) wasn't totally disgusting. Although I cannot recall him being "dreamy" or even that seductive, people looked up to him in a way, but he was much more chilling/frightening than anything.

I don't even remember who Suzanne is. I don't even remember the book too much I should re-read it!

My favourite thing was they decided to add Marie Tussauds to the story. She was so much more strong-willed than Marguerite, which made no sense, as Spork you've definately said.

[Schmerg_The_Impaler]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 10:19pm

Well, I'd have to say SP1 simply due to my rabid love of Terrence Mann's voice... my avatar is evidence enough of that! (I hear he didn't play the role well onstage, but ehhh, I'd still rather hear him sing "Where's The Girl" than anyone else).

Still, I obtained the script to... what I believe is SP3, and I think it's really funny and interesting, much as I didn't like some of the cuts they made.

[SporkGoddess]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 10:32pm

Haha, you are correct. I can't stand Christine Andreas's singing, but she's a good actress. Carolee is my favorite Marguerite by far. She also looked the part just wonderfully.

Well, Chauvelin's not disgusting, but he's definitely not sexy and I can't even imagine him having an affair with Marguerite. Also, if you read the entire series (specifically, Sir Percy Hits Back), you find out that Chauvelin has a daughter who's only seven years or so younger than Marguerite.

Another issue I have is with their portrayal of Percy. They made him look like he only pretended to be foppish and inane to throw off people, but in the books it really was his personality. He just wasn't everything that he seemed.

This is just me being nitpicky. Like I said, I'm a diehard fan of the series.


As for Suzanne: (Spoiler for the books ahead)



Suzanne was the daughter of the noblewoman Percy rescued and brought to England, who went to school with Marguerite. She ends up falling in love with and marrying Sir Andrew Ffoulkes.

Updated On: 8/31/08 at 10:32 PM

[philly03]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 10:57pm

Terrence Mann's portrayal was pretty much seen as "harsh." As in, he portrayed the character in two ways. Seductive & harsh. Also, SP1 was totally panned, despite the stellar cast of Sills, Mann, & Andreas. It didn't even sell well, and it's a miracle it ran from November through the Tony's, and then the decision was made to do the changes which took place in October. All with just closing about 10 days (3 days because Sills was feeling his voice was strained actually!).

Rex Smith is the only Chauvelin I dislike. I love Mann's singing, and William Michals was allaround just a complete what I was thinking of Chauvelin. Spooky, chilling, great deep dark singing. It's unfortunate that Kudisch was to use the French accent, but regardless his Chauvelin was awesome. I cannot even pick one, but Mann's will live on above those three because he's on a recording (although Michals recorded Where's the Girl for a solo album!).

As for Marguerite, I really loved Carolee, but her French accent I found annoying. (LOL I'm complaining about a French accent for a "french" show) All-in-all, as always with the Wildhorn musicals, picking your favourite LEADING lady is next-to-impossible. Carolee was probably mine, but I liked York's & especially Andreas' too!

[SporkGoddess]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 11:04pm

I hate how only Marguerite has a French accent! What gives?

Douglas Sills was so perfect for Percy in terms of acting and just appearance that I wish he'd been in a movie based on the book. We need a really good adaptation, but now when I do "dream casting" I can't think of anyone even remotely fit to play Percy.

[philly03]

Posted: 8/31/08 at 11:59pm

For SP3 they really went all out with the French accents and just made it annoying to watch! I suppose Marguerite should have one when she's in England, and then maybe have the English/Percy's pick up a lot of the British accent and get rid of the French accents when they're there? I have no idea, but you almost feel bad for the Marguerite...sing not one, but several beautiful songs and then you have to sing it with a fake French accent!

And I feel of all Wildhorn musicals, Pimpy is the most ready to be adapted. It almost feels like Nan wrote it like that. Of course it NOT being a success has a major thing with that, but it would be awesome if they could just random pick up RIGHT NOW and have Sills do it. As much as I love Jekyll & HYDE (I probably love it more than Pimpy!), I'd rather have a Pimpernel movie, just because it really does. Sometimes I watch thsoe stupid slideshows people make for YouTube with scenes from the 1982 movie and the songs overtop and it just seems to flow. Not only that, these are the songs that were slightly on the charts for Frank...You Are My Home got pretty high on the "Adult Contemperary" if I'm not mistaken (that's misspelled I know!).

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 9/1/08 at 1:04am

I wish they would go into a studio and record the score as it is in the licensed script. It's really annoying to listen to the original knowing all of the changes they made later on.

[oohshizz146]

Posted: 9/1/08 at 1:11am

I JUST got interested in this show, so I don't know much about it, but I'm not crazy about the voice of the girl who plays Marguerite on the OBC. I just saw the show at CLOC theatre on Cape Cod, however, and it was fantastic. Such a funny show.