Do you think replacements should be eligible for Tony Awards consideration? - Page 3

[binau]

Posted: 6/16/13 at 5:46pm

Whether or not all the Tony voters end up seeing all the nominated performances is an ongoing issue with the Tony Awards and not isolated to the replacement category (e.g. How many of the Tony voters ended up seeing Carolee? I bet not many). So I don't think this consideration is that important in deciding whether there should be a replacement category. And I personally don't think they should have special rules for the category re: this.

[jwsel]

Posted: 6/16/13 at 6:21pm

Whether or not all the Tony voters end up seeing all the nominated performances is an ongoing issue with the Tony Awards and not isolated to the replacement category (e.g. How many of the Tony voters ended up seeing Carolee? I bet not many). So I don't think this consideration is that important in deciding whether there should be a replacement category. And I personally don't think they should have special rules for the category re: this.

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The reason it would have to be different for replacement roles is that the broader voting membership knows there are a limited number of new shows and revivals to see each year that will be eligible. I agree it is an issue that voters don't see everything, but at lest they know what is eligible and can plan accordingly.

With established shows and replacement roles, unless you have a defined period for voters to see the nominated performances, nobody would know what to see. There are just too many potential performances that would be eligible for this to work.
How many times would voters have to see the same shows to ensure they caught the performances that might be nominated in April? That would be very expensive for producers also, because they would essentially have to open up a new block of tickets for voters with each cast change. If you have a viewing period that follows the nominations, then you limit the shows voters have to see to only a few and they would only have to see them once in that calendar year.

And, yes, it would create some strategic casting during the eligibility months, but is that necessarily a bad thing if it brings top-quality performers to Broadway? Granted, there might be some stunt casting using the possibility of a Tony nomination as bait for the actor, but if the performances are good and it sells tickets, I don't see that big a downside.

[Replacement Cast]

Posted: 6/16/13 at 10:14pm

No.

[broadwaydevil]

Posted: 6/16/13 at 11:12pm

The more people try to explain how this could potentially work, the more I think we're seeing why it doesn't make sense and why it isn't possible.

On the issue of how do you get the full voting membership to see replacement performers, they could make it a rule that to be eligible for the replacement Tony, the actor must be in the role from the time of the nominations through the close of voting so that voters have a chance to see the performances.

So Bernadette would be ineligible for ALNM (her show closed in January) as would Marin Mazzie (same problem!)

Also, Broadway doesn't need "strategic casting" around the leadup to Tony time when the new shows are getting buzz and hopefully trying to build up a base for the summer. Does this mean every spring time Chicago, The Phantom of the Opera, Wicked, Jersey Boys, Mamma Mia, etc. will trudge out some big high-profile replacement for a few months to pick up a nomination and hopefully an award and get some free press for the show? Seems like a waste of everyone's time and money without actually accomplishing anything.


Putting special rules on replacements only works if you make it a separate category. Rules for how to get nominated and eligibility requirements for replacement actors isn't fair if they're competing in the same category as others who don't have rules regarding how many people in their production can be "petitioned to be nominated" - a pretty bizarre idea counter to what the Tonys are about or eligibility requirements based on time with the production.

And I think we all have gone through many times why making a separate "catch all" replacement category doesn't work. It's not fair to new shows and is a logistical nightmare.

Putting all these things aside, again, the Tonys are for NEW productions. The Tonys doesn't have the ridiculous "favorite long-running show award" or "best touring production" like Broadway.com has because it's about the CURRENT Broadway season.

I have no doubt there are replacements all the time in many long-running shows that are phenomenal and are perhaps giving performances that some think are worthy of recognition, but the Tonys isn't the way to do it and in any of your plans, lower-profile replacements would be entirely overlooked. Be rewarded in knowing you got the chance to see a great replacement and that if they're really phenomenal hopefully one day they'll get to originate a role in a production and hopefully get recognized.

[binau]

Posted: 6/16/13 at 11:20pm

"How many times would voters have to see the same shows to ensure they caught the performances that might be nominated in April?"


They simply wouldn't. I still don't understand the extra detail RE: ensuring Tony voters see the replacement performances. It doesn't need to be treated any differently than how it is currently..if a show closes early tough luck - the voters will either not see you (e.g. Carolee in SCANDALOUS,) or forget about you by the time the Tony awards come by, or vote for a show that is currently running (e.g. PORGY & BESS revival). It makes the chances of winning for a replacement who isn't performing past April less, but this is nothing new..


Only the nominating committee will *need* to see every show eligible for nomination, but this is a small amount of people (40) and whether a show is eligible or not should also depend on whether a producer petitions for their replacement to be considered for nomination.....

Updated On: 6/16/13 at 11:20 PM

[MissOrphanJuly]

Posted: 6/16/13 at 11:24pm

There's pros and cons about it but I think they should have a Best Replacement category.

[broadwaydevil]

Posted: 6/16/13 at 11:27pm

They simply wouldn't. I still don't understand the extra detail RE: ensuring Tony voters see the replacement performances. It doesn't need to be treated any differently than how it is currently..if a show closes early tough luck - the voters will either not see you (e.g. Carolee in SCANDALOUS,) or forget about you by the time the Tony awards come by, or vote for a show that is currently running (e.g. PORGY & BESS revival).

So then, what's the point? Is it just to dole out more awards? The whole idea is because some posters feel some actors who gave great performances like Bernadette should get recognition but I've already pointed out how under most peoples' plans, she'd be ineligible. Again, the Tonys are for the CURRENT Broadway season. No need to delude the product and take away from newer shows that struggle to get a base. Is it really necessary for Mamma Mia to manipulate the system which would have to be put in place to get an award and milk some more free press to run a few extra years?

Shows would need to give out 1400 comp tickets if their replacement gets nominated and perhaps more if, say, a replacement comes in the summer and leaves before nominations come out but the producers are expecting they could get recognized. Voters and nominators see enough. They don't need three pairs of tickets to see someone in the Lion King.

[broadwaydevil]

Posted: 6/16/13 at 11:28pm

There's pros and cons about it but I think they should have a Best Replacement category.

Well reasoned, well said. Welcome.

[dramamama611]

Posted: 6/16/13 at 11:50pm

And as far as the nominating committee goes: this isn't their full time job -- now you asking 40 people to give up even MORE of their (what I'm assuming is) volunteered time.


The Tony Awards (as has been stated) is for NEW productions. If you are wonderful as a replacement, you are wonderful as a replacement. THAT'S kudos enough.

I would betcha most actors would think this conversation silly.

[binau]

Posted: 6/17/13 at 12:28am

"So then, what's the point? Is it just to dole out more awards? The whole idea is because some posters feel some actors who gave great performances like Bernadette should get recognition"

Yep exactly. Any imperfections about who will end up getting recognised because of show closings etc.. are to do with the current system of Tony voting and not isolated to this specific category (i.e. you could make the same argument of unfairness/impracticality of seeing performances/shows about any category, not just replacements. It happens all the time that voters don't get to see shows)

"but I've already pointed out how under most peoples' plans, she'd be ineligible"

Well under the plan that involves making it necessary for voters to see her performance then yes - but I don't understand why the replacement category should have any different rules. I think people are trying to fix the Tony Award voting process with these ideas, rather than discuss implementing a replacement category with the existing rules...which is great but I mean it's another level of argument..

"Again, the Tonys are for the CURRENT Broadway season. No need to delude the product and take away from newer shows that struggle to get a base. Is it really necessary for Mamma Mia to manipulate the system which would have to be put in place to get an award and milk some more free press to run a few extra years? "

Well I think it would be great that the Tonys could recognise what else it happening in the current Broadway season (i.e. replacements). The arguments about the Tonys being a marketing exercise for new shows is certainly important, but for the purposes of this award I am naively going to pretend that the Tony awards should be about recognising the best performances regardless of any potential financial benefit from it. So if the 150th replacement in Mamma Mia gave the best performance of the season then sure I think they should be recognised.

"Shows would need to give out 1400 comp tickets if their replacement gets nominated. Voters and nominators see enough"

I guess it just depends on whether you view a nomination to be as valuable as 1400 complimentary tickets and wasting the time of voters. I personally think it is - Bernadette's and Mazzie's performances were more outstanding to me than many other performances in 'new' roles in the same season. I personally think they should have the ability to be recognised.

There is already a precedent set with the Olivier Awards, suggesting someone can work it out.

I understand completely if you don't think it is worth 1. 40 people in the nominating committee to see every replacement that is petitioned for a Tony Award nomination, 2. 1400 complimentary tickets times 4 or 5 for nominated replacements. But I personally do, so I hope this is something that will appear in the future.

Updated On: 6/17/13 at 12:28 AM