Glenn Greenwald Criticizes Obama for Caving on Telecom Immunity- Page 4

[javero]

Posted: 6/27/08 at 12:22pm

Let me be brutally honest and give a nod to my bestest bud in the whole world, Pal Joey. The Democrats only choice of regaining the White House at the start of the race rested on the shoulders of Evan Byah, Barack Obama, Bill Richardson and Hillary Clinton.

Byah opted out unfortunately; Richardson didn't gain traction sadly and Obama's biggest rival poor thing miscued early in the primary race.

Edwards was class-war mongering damaged goods from the Kerry era; Kucinich too much a UFO-spotting peacenik during wartime; Biden too prone to stick his foot in his mouth with questionable health; Dodd too tied to the subprime lending debacle and Vilsack a total non-starter.

The Dems did not put up the best field this year.

Obama emerged the nominee and that's that. I do believe that his aim to be an agent for change at the start of his campaign was sincere. However, political reality is setting in on the Obama camp. 'Dat azz gotta stay left of McBush and slightly right of Hillary to have a snowball's chance in hell of being sworn in as POTUS come Jan 09.

There are boatloads of lifelong Dems that will not vote for him because he's got only half the right demographic profile and it’s not a small swath either. Obama cannot run the same kind of general election campaign that Hillary would have ran had she made the final cut. Despite the historical significance of both Obama and Hillary's aspirations, they have vastly different litmus tests when it comes to presidential politics.

I'll also share a secret thought of mine with you Marc and other Dems. If Obama doesn't make it over the wall in Nov, the front runner in 2012 will be Evan Byah and not Hillary.

Evan Byah is the most presidential looking Democrat on this planet right now with all due respect to Barack Obama. He's also very much in the hunt for an Obama veep nod despite his earlier "allegiance" to Hillary.

Politics makes strange bedfellows indeed, especially when campaign debt must be retired. The Democrats gotta use subterfuge, obfuscation, slight-of-hand and any-damned-contrivance imaginable if they expect to send one of their own to the White House.

It was never going to be a slam dunk for the Dems, even with McBush emerging as the opposition. Why? The party is obsessed with Northeast-DC-Hollywood elites. Recall that philandering country bumpkin Bill Clinton had a tough go at in his primary baptism before cleaning Paul Tsongas and Jerry Brown’s clock.

[PalJoey]

Posted: 6/27/08 at 12:36pm

That is NOT true, and you really don't support him.

Feh. I give the man money, I give the man time, I give him my vote.

That means I'm a Supporter.

It doesn't mean I believe everything he says or support everything he does.

It doesn't mean I have to shut up.

I give the man money, I give the man time, I give him my vote. What does he give me? Telecom immunity and a lie about prosecuting it LATER.

[South Fl Marc]

Posted: 6/27/08 at 12:37pm

"I'll also share a secret thought of mine with you Marc and other Dems. If Obama doesn't make it over the wall in Nov, the front runner in 2012 will be Evan Byah and not Hillary."

If Obama does not get elected (and I will vote for him - no matter what he does) Hillary is not my choice of candidates in 2012. Evan Byah seems like a good possibility.

In the mean time, I will continue to push for Obama to do the right thing and complain when he doesn't.

[javero]

Posted: 6/27/08 at 12:45pm

"In the mean time, I will continue to push for Obama to do the right thing and complain when he doesn't."

Oh as a Libertarian, I'm with you on that one bro. I'm supporting Obama this one time but if he tries to turn this nation into the United Socialist States of America (USSA), I'll withdraw my support 4 yrs out if he's so lucky. I've seen my share of graft, waste, and fraude from gov't contractors & employees as well as much abuse from recipients of the major entitlement programs.

I'm still pissed over the no-bid contracts that were directed to certain firms connected with Operation Iraqi Makeover.

Updated On: 6/27/08 at 12:45 PM

[mejusthavingfun]

Posted: 6/27/08 at 12:46pm

"It doesn't mean I believe everything he says or support everything he does. "

Neither do the people that voted for him. Most of them were "anyone but Clinton" anyway.

[mejusthavingfun]

Posted: 6/27/08 at 12:47pm

"Oh as a Libertarian,"

So as a libertarian are you against the minimum wage?

[mejusthavingfun]

Posted: 6/27/08 at 12:48pm

"I'm still pissed over the no-bid contracts that were directed to certain firms connected with Operation Iraqi Makeover. "

Did you see the Iraq no-bid oil contracts yesterday?

[javero]

Posted: 6/27/08 at 1:10pm

"So as a libertarian are you against the minimum wage?"

No, despite the fact that its tantamount to price-fixing and coercion when mandated by fiat. US labor history is replete with examples of worker exploitation. My preference would be that workers (or their agents) negotiate wages on a per-industry basis.

Obviously, I'm not opposed to organized labor either unlike a few Libertarian zealots that I consider friends. I just don't like workers being "coerced" into joining unions by union officials.

What drove me from the Democratic party was the constant pandering to the poor and downtrodden by the establishment candidates and the notion on their part that government can fix every socio-economic problem of the times...WRONG!!!

Did I forget to mention that I hate the Dems unwillingness to tackle the business of friggin' "farm subsidies" now with food prices steadily rising due to the "blood oil" and "ethanol" taxes passed onto consumer? In their defense, the gaul-awful primary debates dodged the topic altogether. The Farm Bill was one of the most contentious pieces of legislation sent up this year, right up there with telecom immunity/domestic spying.

Updated On: 6/27/08 at 01:10 PM

[madbrian]

Posted: 6/27/08 at 9:00pm

"But what idiot believed he was any different than the damn Democrat he has always been?...Lildogs and orangeskittles and Madbrian and Liverpool."

PJ - I take exception to your comments for a couple of reasons. First, I am an Independent who was leaning heavily toward McCain a few months ago, so my choice to support Obama was not made with a lot of consideration. Also, I disgree with him on several issues, and have stated so. I have also made mention of bonehead things he and his campaign have done. I've said nothing to support his decision on FISA. All I've said is that Dodd & Feingold's delay has given him a chance to live up to his word with respect to removing the retrospective immunity from the bill. In my opinion, this actually puts pressure on Obama to live up to that word.

[PalJoey]

Posted: 6/27/08 at 11:17pm

If you think the man is going to remove the retrospective immunity from the bill, you are delusional.

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

Posted: 6/27/08 at 11:36pm

I would like to introduce mejusthavingfun to the edit button.

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 7/2/08 at 3:20pm

bammy hears it from his supporters...
...and the ny times