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#26

Going Clear

Posted: 3/30/15 at 8:39pm

No, I don't blame anyone for anything. It's just that it was a two-hour movie that had a lot of ground to cover and every comments section I see about this is full of people asking why this or that or him or her weren't in it.
#27

Going Clear

Posted: 3/30/15 at 8:47pm

You're right. No way they could have fit in everything we wanted to know into two hours. Shoulda been a two-parter. I think that reaction, though, just demonstrates the amount of interest in the film and the subject matter. Speaking of hearing from others, it would have been interesting to hear from someone inside the IRS at the time of the tax exempt ruling.
#28

Going Clear

Posted: 3/30/15 at 8:56pm

They're probably too scared to talk.
#29

Going Clear

Posted: 3/30/15 at 9:01pm

Or too ashamed. Or too... entrenched. Yeah.
#30

Going Clear

Posted: 3/30/15 at 9:20pm

And back to the tax exempt status, I don't see how that could ever get revoked now without a wholesale reevaluation of tax-exemption for all religions, which will never happen. After being declared a religion, there's now way it's going to be undeclared one. It's actually kind of terrifying to think of all that untouchable money in the hands of Scientology.
#31

Going Clear

Posted: 3/30/15 at 9:22pm

Or, you know, the Catholic Church. Going Clear
#32

Going Clear

Posted: 3/30/15 at 9:26pm

Oh, I think they're awful, too, but at least some of that money gets put to good use.
#36

Going Clear

Posted: 3/30/15 at 11:59pm

I'm on your first link. I can't get over "false report report." Now I finally know how to pronounce Jason Beghe.

I kid, because I find this terrifying. And it's not like I didn't know about a lot before. But something about watching sweet and funny Spanky and charming, delightfully off-kilter Beghe and that nice lady who lived through what was essentially a Scientologic Sophie's Choice - I'm just left with empathy for the people whose lives get destroyed by it.

And also that when Scientologists think no one is watching they act like ****îng lunatics. Those videos! I just feel like it's something we're not seeing at those "award show" kind of spectacles are recreations of that devil porn **** and some poor virgin gets mutilated and eaten or something.

I had a momentary lapse of my own reality and forgot we couldn't swear on here. That's the effing word and the brown word up there where I was censored.





Updated On: 3/31/15 at 11:59 PM

#37

Going Clear

Posted: 3/31/15 at 12:15am

I used to feel uncomfortable walking past the Church of Scientology on 46th St.. The remarkable documentary gave me such creeps, however, that I may have to give a brave friend my tickets to Finding Neverland and, (please no) Hamilton.

The Times Square BID protects tourists with signs stating they need not tip the Elmos and Mickey Mouses. They should add a
sign near the Scientologists: "Flee this Hellhole."
#38

Going Clear

Posted: 3/31/15 at 12:17am

The documentary knocked the wind outta me, the second hour -- past the obligatory and at times giggle-inducing bio of Hubbard, which almost played like parody (that fact freaky enough) -- terrifying stuff. The woman finding fruit flies on her baby daughter's stuck-together eyes. Her turning point, and for me, the turning point in the film. Required viewing. And its timing on HBO couldn't be better.
"I'm a comedian, but in my spare time, things bother me." Garry Shandling
#39

Going Clear

Posted: 3/31/15 at 12:32am

Let's face it: this could've been a Jinx-esque miniseries with the amount of dirt on Scientology there is. I have a feeling that they were under a lot of pressure not to make themselves a bigger target of church lawyers, and many people would be reluctant to speak out for fear of reprisal.

One question I had was: what happens when Miscavige dies? Is there a line of succession? Is there even a second in command? Two of his top lieutenants defected and were in the documentary. Miscavige doesn't seem like someone who keeps people close to him very long.

"...everyone finally shut up, and the audience could enjoy the beginning of the Anatevka Pogram in peace."

Updated On: 3/31/15 at 12:32 AM

#40

Going Clear

Posted: 3/31/15 at 12:42am

He's relatively young so maybe it's not a concern? It's all so Shakespearean. Miscavige seized power when Elar'ach went to write books in sky or whatever. I guess the cycle will just continue.

Or maybe Suri was supposed to be Elar'ac reincarnated?

Updated On: 3/31/15 at 12:42 AM

#41

Going Clear

Posted: 3/31/15 at 5:57am

L. Ron Hubbard left no formal line of succession, other than a deathbed directive indirectly stating that he wanted Pat Broeker to succeed him, which is exactly why Miscavige was able to grab power.

Miscavige, like all Scientology executives, is a heavy smoker; because LRH chain-smoked, it's considered a tenet of their religion. So that could have an adverse effect on his health.

"You travel alone because other people are only there to remind you how much that hook hurts that we all bit down on. Wait for that one day we can bite free and get back out there in space where we belong, sail back over water, over skies, into space, the hook finally out of our mouths and we wander back out there in space spawning to other planets never to return hurrah to earth and we'll look back and can't even see these lives here anymore. Only the taste of blood to remind us we ever existed. The earth is small. We're gone. We're dead. We're safe." -John Guare, Landscape of the Body

Updated On: 3/31/15 at 05:57 AM

#42

Going Clear

Posted: 3/31/15 at 7:44am

Don't send Miscavige Nicoban.
#43

Going Clear

Posted: 3/31/15 at 8:19am

Wouldn't be the least bit surprised if TC took over the helm one day. Appears to me as though he's being groomed for it.

I had read the book and was familiar with much of the material that was presented in the film, but seeing it all compiled into a 2-hour movie was pretty damn compelling...and stomach turning. And the TC footage was one of the scarier things in it.



Updated On: 3/31/15 at 08:19 AM

#44

Going Clear

Posted: 3/31/15 at 8:25am

Thanks for linking those Tony Ortega blog posts, Namo. There's a ton of fascinating stuff on his blog.
#45

Going Clear

Posted: 3/31/15 at 10:53am

Oh sh*t...I'm gonna fall down that Tony Ortega rabbit hole today. Reading that profile on Spanky makes me want to get famous and hire her for PR.
#46

Going Clear

Posted: 3/31/15 at 11:06am

The documentary knocked the wind outta me, the second hour -- past the obligatory and at times giggle-inducing bio of Hubbard, which almost played like parody (that fact freaky enough) -- terrifying stuff. The woman finding fruit flies on her baby daughter's stuck-together eyes. Her turning point, and for me, the turning point in the film. Required viewing. And its timing on HBO couldn't be better.

I watched last night and felt the same way. Terrifying.

(And now going back to read through this thread, with all the links)
"Two drifters off to see the world. There's such a lot of world to see. . ."
#48

Going Clear

Posted: 3/31/15 at 1:13pm

Heber Jentzsch was briefly mentioned in Going Clear. He's been in the hole and missing. But his story has haunted me ever since I heard about it. It's so cruel and sick.

p.s. His son Alexander has since died of an overdose. Another story that's pretty awful. His own mom being blocked at the mortuary because she was "S.P"

https://leavingscientology.wordpress.com/2010/06/14/heber-jentzsch/
#49

Going Clear

Posted: 3/31/15 at 1:25pm

Miscavige does seem, like Hubbard, to be extremely paranoid and fearful of anyone who might usurp him. That seems to be the case not just with Jentzsch but with Rathbun and Mike Rinder as well. At least Rathburn and Rinder were able to get out; sadly, Jentzsch hasn't been so lucky.

Also worth noting that former spokesperson Tommy Davis (Anne Archer's son) and his wife, Jessica Feshbach (a second-generation church member from a very wealthy family) are no longer in the church, though neither has spoken publicly about their departure. Davis was, at one point, Tom Cruise's personal handler.
"You travel alone because other people are only there to remind you how much that hook hurts that we all bit down on. Wait for that one day we can bite free and get back out there in space where we belong, sail back over water, over skies, into space, the hook finally out of our mouths and we wander back out there in space spawning to other planets never to return hurrah to earth and we'll look back and can't even see these lives here anymore. Only the taste of blood to remind us we ever existed. The earth is small. We're gone. We're dead. We're safe." -John Guare, Landscape of the Body

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