NYPD Cops Outta Control- Page 2

[Jane2]

Posted: 8/5/14 at 3:24pm

I lived on 20th and fifth also!

[ErikJ972]

Posted: 8/8/14 at 9:54am

"In my experience with police officers if you show them respect they will show you respect."
Tell that to the 17yo who had been thrown up against a wall and frisked for no reason countless time.

These Mothers Lost Their Sons To The NYPD, And They Vow 'This Has To Stop'

[Jane2]

Posted: 8/8/14 at 10:24am

I don't believe that this was "for no reason at all." Do you really think policemen want controversy and accusations, possible suspensions, etc. for "no reason at all?"

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

Posted: 8/8/14 at 10:33am

I don't think it's that they want it, I think it's that they're used to getting away with it.

[Jordan Catalano]

Posted: 8/8/14 at 10:35am

I believe some police officers are out to "prove something" and cross that line continuously in order to do that. But those are the cops who give all the other (and the majority of) hardworking good officers a bad name, which is a real shame because no matter what you think of them, we couldn't function as a society without them.

[themysteriousgrowl]

Posted: 8/8/14 at 10:42am

No, guys. Haven't you been reading the thread? It HAS to be one or the other.

[tazber]

Posted: 8/8/14 at 11:01am

Well if I can only choose one then I choose.......





.....still thinking........










Ok, I choose #69 - General Tsao's (vegetarian) chicken.

[ErikJ972]

Posted: 8/8/14 at 11:45am

"I don't believe that this was "for no reason at all."
Read this kids story. And listen to the audio.



How a 17-Year-Old Changed the Politics of 'Stop and Frisk' Updated On: 8/8/14 at 11:45 AM

[Jane2]

Posted: 8/8/14 at 1:28pm

thanks, now I feel even more sorry for cops.

[Islander_fan]

Posted: 8/8/14 at 3:37pm

First off, I just wanted to make one thing clear. Despite the impression that I made to the contrary, I actually do have respect for cops. To be totally honest, a lot of what I was talking about, I feel, came from a place of frustration because of a combo of negative interactions and startling bits of news I have read about them over time. I do agree with both Phyllis and Jordan that those cops who do feel like they are trying to "prove something" do so, knowing that the odds of them getting caught (or if they do, not really being in a situation where they have to account for their own actions.) So, I just wanted to say all that to make things clear.

In any event, I was pointed in the direction of something scary. New York is one of the few states left in the country that would put kids, ages 16-18, in Rikers, where they would be physically abused and tormented by the cops there. Other staff members who are legally mandated to report child abuse, are turning a blind eye. This I got from a multi part expose that was done in the NY Times. I am going to find at least one of the articles and link it here. It's really something that's eye opening.

[ErikJ972]

Posted: 8/8/14 at 4:25pm

"thanks, now I feel even more sorry for cops."
Why?

[Jane2]

Posted: 8/8/14 at 4:39pm

Because all they can go on is a hunch. Damned if they do, damned if they don't.

Because they are working in such a high crime city.

[FishermanBob]

Posted: 8/8/14 at 4:39pm

"In any event, I was pointed in the direction of something scary. New York is one of the few states left in the country that would put kids, ages 16-18, in Rikers, where they would be physically abused and tormented by the cops there."

Now, for your next trick, you're going to try to convince us that Riker's Island is the second coming of Abu Ghraib? You done with the NYPD, now time to start in on the Department of Correction? You do realize they are different organizations, right? I want to be there the day after you've had a 17 year old gang member hold a gun to your head as he mugged you to see if you still are referring to him as some poor little kid. Look, we get it. We know where you are coming from. No need to beat it to death.

[Borstalboy]

Posted: 8/8/14 at 10:39pm

I'm sorry to hear that happened to you, Fisherman Bob.

[Borstalboy]

Posted: 8/8/14 at 10:39pm

Double post.

Updated On: 8/8/14 at 10:39 PM

[FishermanBob]

Posted: 8/8/14 at 11:06pm

"I'm sorry to hear that happened to you, Fisherman Bob."

Though I was mugged when I was 14 or 15, fortunately no guns were involved. I wasn't implying the use of a gun happened to me Borstalboy but there are plenty of cases where teens 16-18 have participated in violent crimes, even murder. That's why in some cases they are tried as adults. To view a 17 year old as a kid or a child strictly because of his or her age, ignores the reality of what some people at that age or even younger are capable of doing.


Updated On: 8/8/14 at 11:06 PM

[Islander_fan]

Posted: 8/9/14 at 12:30am

@fisherman Bob

I don't get it, simply don't. Not only am I far from the only one saying that although the cops do good, it's important to not turn a blind eye toward some of the negative things that happen too. Not only did I make a statement and post links to show why I feel the way I do (fine, I didn't post one about the abuse at Rikers because I made that post on the app and it's easier for me to wait till I'm home and at my computer to do so.) But, I digress. It comes across as you having some sort of vendetta against me. I'm half convinced that even if I do post links to the articles in The Times, you'll intentionally ignore those like the one before it.

Answer me these two questions. First off, if the actions that were described in the article I mentioned got the ball rolling on a federal investigation. That's not something that is taken lightly for all parties involved. So my question is, is there the slightest possibility that the accounts which I described and were in the Times a whole lot worse than you're making it out to be? And secondly, why do you
Act as if I'm the only poster here saying that the cops aren't always perfect. There were other posters who were doing the same thing. Yet you insist on riding my ass as if I am the only one who's saying these things. And you're also acting as if
The links I use to backup my claims are non existent, and that I'm pulling these stories out of thin air. Why is that?

[ErikJ972]

Posted: 8/9/14 at 8:32am

Jane...the audio I posted showed cops physically harassing and hurling pretty horrible racial slurs at a 17 year old who did nothing wrong. How does that make you feel sorry for cops?
FishermanBob...yeah let's not pretend that Rikers is Abu Ghraib but let's also not pretend that the US doesn't have a higher incarceration rate than China.

[SNAFU]

Posted: 8/9/14 at 12:54pm

China, however doesn't count people in work camps or detained political dissidents as prisoners though, so that might not be completely true.

[FishermanBob]

Posted: 8/9/14 at 2:32pm

"Yet you insist on riding my ass as if I am the only one who's saying these things. And you're also acting as if The links I use to backup my claims are non existent, and that I'm pulling these stories out of thin air. Why is that?"

You're the only one Islander_fan who has felt compelled to start multiple additional threads about what is basically the same topic, excessive use of force by police and then repeat in one thread what you stated in the other threads as if repetition bolsters your case.

You're the only one Islander_fan who has posted links to articles and then completely misrepresented what they said. I asked you where exactly in the NYT article you linked to did it say cops give the officer a proverbial pat on the back for killing the guy in a choke hold as you stated it said and you have still never responded.

You're the only one Islander_fan who makes bold, overgeneralized and unsubstantiated comments like the NYPD is a "corrupt system". When I asked you to back up your allegation that the entire NYPD is corrupt, you sidestepped my request by saying, well there are instances of the use of excessive force which a) I and everyone else have already agreed have likely occurred and b) instances of excessive force is a helluva lot different than saying an entire organization is corrupt.

You make broad, unsubstantiated claims like the NYPD is racist. "There is a race problem when it comes to cops in NYC". Would it surprise you to know that of the more than 22,000 officers who are actually on street patrol in NYC, 53% are men and women of color? Do you think they are prejudiced as well?

While others have been very critical of the NYPD which I have no problem with, you're the only one Islander_fan that has felt the need to make comments about them like "I feel that cops are like dogs hanging round the dinner table." which I find offensive.

While others are making good and valid points about the case in question or related cases to it on both sides of the issue, you're the only one Islander_fan who seems to be going out of his way to google unrelated cases of excessive force and presenting comments by people in the article or allegations that are under investigation as already proven facts.

I have already stated I am sure there are and have been cases of excessive force by the police and when proven, they should be dealt with severely. I don't disagree with you or others on that point. I'm not naïve to believe no cops have gone over the line. I'm old enough to remember the Knapp Commission hearings and the corruption that was uncovered in the 70's. However, you clearly have an agenda, an axe to grind about cops in general which was very evident in you yourself admitting that the cop who approached you outside Bryant Park might have very well just been approaching someone he thought looked questionable but then you classified his feeling the need to approach you as "a tough guy throwing his weight around for no reason with a bug up his ass." So to all that, I say again... WE GET IT.

Hope that answers the question you asked.




Updated On: 8/9/14 at 02:32 PM

[Islander_fan]

Posted: 8/9/14 at 3:32pm

Actually Fisherman Bob, you're wrong yet again. I don't have an ax to grind with them or with anyone. The links that I have posted do backup my claim. If you're choosing to not read them or ignore them, that's you're propagative. But, to act as if I am not backing up my claim that the NYPD is a corrupt system is laughable, because I am, and I am not at all misinterpreting what the articles say, not by a long shot. Furthermore, I didn't start multiple threads as you erroneously claim. I responded to one thread (this one) and then read an interesting article in a newspaper, asking what folks thought about it, and if what was happening on Long Island work with a bigger police force, like the NYPD. Check your math, making one thread is not multiple.

And, here's a fun state for you, when it comes to the racial backgrounds of those in jail, African Americans take the lead at a whopping 60 per cent. Most of which, by the way, are for non violent offenses. But, since you clearly have your head in the sand, and can't understand the difference between someone noticing an issue that needs to be fixed and "having an ax to grind" as you so put it, I do feel sorry for you. There is no ax to grind here. The general idea of what I am trying to point out (which by the way, you miss the point, time and time again) is that, I can understand cops going after someone based upon how they look, if there is merit behind it. You know, things such as someone potentially matching a description of someone who committed a crime. But, I can't understand why (and this does happen) cops do things like target black people because they think that they are going to commit a crime simply because they are black. I am saying that there is corruption within the NYPD and how they do things. Listen to the piece I linked to the segment on This American LIfe, if you want a rude awakening on how things are within the NYPD. Do that, then we'll talk.

[Jane2]

Posted: 8/9/14 at 3:46pm

"Jane...the audio I posted showed cops physically harassing and hurling pretty horrible racial slurs at a 17 year old who did nothing wrong. How does that make you feel sorry for cops?"

I don't know if he did anything wrong or not. And as I said when I already answered this question, because the cops go on hunches. They are damned if they do, damned if they don't.

[FishermanBob]

Posted: 8/9/14 at 4:08pm

"I am not at all misinterpreting what the articles say, not by a long shot."

No, you're just lying about them. For the 3RD TIME, back up your claim that the NYT article said "how other cops gave the cop who killed the guy a proverbial pat on the back, as if he did a good thing" cause the article you linked to said no such thing. Find me ANY article from a legitimate source that makes that claim. You also really need to learn the definition of the word "corruption".

"Check your math, making one thread is not multiple."

You didn't start a second additional thread titled "Difficult Decisions Ahead in Responding to Police Chokehold Homicide" on 8/5/14 at 11:36 a.m. strictly about the NYT article even though you talked at length about the same article in one of the other threads? Is there another person who is using your exact screen name unbeknownst to you or are you the one who needs to "check your math"?

This is my last response Islander_fan. I think it is now abundantly clear at least to me, you have a specific agenda to push and will say anything truthful or not to support that agenda. You do however, have a true gift for changing the subject when put on the spot to specifically validate a comment you have made. Have a nice day.

Updated On: 8/9/14 at 04:08 PM

[Islander_fan]

Posted: 8/9/14 at 5:33pm

Ok, you're wrong yet again. I misread the article about how the Staten Island DA was trying to figure out how to go forward with the matter. Yet, I did backup my claim that there is corruption in the NYPD. listen to the NPR piece I linked to. Or better yet, google the name Adrian Schoolcraft. here is the blurb for the piece, copied and pasted from the This American Life website

For 17 months, New York police officer Adrian Schoolcraft recorded himself and his fellow officers on the job, including their supervisors ordering them to do all sorts of things that police aren't supposed to do. For example, downgrading real crimes into lesser ones, so they wouldn't show up in the crime statistics and make their precinct look bad. Adrian's story first appeared as a five part series in the Village Voice, written by Graham Rayman. And, below is the link to the piece. Listen to it, and if you honestly believe that there is nothing at all wrong with the NYPD then fine, I will "walk away." I'll think your a fool for not believing what's black and white, but I will still walk away.

Here's the direct link to the piece
This American Life segment with Adrian Schoolcraft

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

Posted: 8/10/14 at 1:52pm

Not New York, but in my neck of the woods the cops have murdered an unarmed teenager.

18-year-old Michael Brown was fatally shot by Ferguson police officers during an encounter near the Canfield Green Apartments. According to KMOV, witnesses say Brown was unarmed and had his hands in the air when he was shot multiple times by an officer.Police Fatally Shoot Unarmed Black Teenager