Rudy: A President for All.

[HDThoreau2]

Posted: 2/18/07 at 11:52pm

From Time Magazine: 2001 Person of the Year

Sixteen hours had passed since the Twin Towers crumbled and fell, and people kept telling Rudy Giuliani to get some rest. The indomitable mayor of New York City had spent the day and night holding his town together. He arrived at the World Trade Center just after the second plane hit, watched human beings drop from the sky and--when the south tower imploded--nearly got trapped inside his makeshift command center near the site. Then he led a battered platoon of city officials, reporters and civilians north through the blizzard of ash and smoke, and a detective jimmied open the door to a firehouse so the mayor could revive his government there. Giuliani took to the airwaves to calm and reassure his people, made a few hundred rapid-fire decisions about the security and rescue operations, toured hospitals to comfort the families of the missing and made four more visits to the apocalyptic attack scene.

Now, around 2:30 a.m., Giuliani walked into the Upper East Side apartment of Howard Koeppel and his longtime partner, Mark Hsiao. Koeppel, a friend and supporter of Giuliani's, had been lending the mayor a bedroom suite since June, when Giuliani separated from his second wife, Donna Hanover, and moved out of Gracie Mansion. His suit still covered with ash, Giuliani hugged Koeppel, dropped into a chair and turned on the television--actually watching the full, ghastly spectacle for the first time. He left the TV on through the night in case the terrorists struck again, and he parked his muddy boots next to the bed in case he needed to head out fast. But he was not going to be doing any sleeping. Lying in bed, with the skyscrapers exploding over and over again on his TV screen, he pulled out a book--Churchill, the new biography by Roy Jenkins--turned straight to the chapters on World War II and drank in the Prime Minister's words: I have nothing to offer but blood, toil, tears and sweat.
Rudy: A President for All

[Yawper]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 12:18am

um, not here - something major would have to give before a Republican presidential candidate wins 2008 in my state

[HDThoreau2]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 12:22am

I know, look at all the other posts that say only a liberal (Hillary) can win.

[deadparrot]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 12:23am

The Religious Wrong? Nominate the pro-gay rights, pro-choice adulterer from New York?

Bwah!

[HDThoreau2]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 12:25am

We are not all part of the Religious right.

Rudy '08.

[pab]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 12:31am

"As much as they want to keep the White House in Republican hands, Christian conservatives would have to swallow hard to rally around Giuliani. That's because in winning election twice as mayor of New York, a heavily Democratic city, Giuliani took positions on social issues that were closer to Jesse Jackson than Ronald Reagan.

Giuliani told New York voters he supports abortion rights and gay rights - positions he recently has tried to temper but not recant. During an appearance on CNN's Larry King Live Wednesday night, Giuliani said he personally opposes abortion and would appoint abortion opponents to the federal bench. He also said while he supports gay rights, he opposes same-sex marriage.

It's not clear if that waffling will be enough to satisfy right-wing conservatives. Opposition to abortion has long been part of the road map for Republicans who win their party's presidential nomination. And in 2004, the Republican Party platform rejected not only gay marriage but benefits for same-sex couples, the centerpiece of the push for gay rights.

Christian conservatives might steel themselves to accept Giuliani's position on these issues, but many will find it more difficult to overlook his history of marital woes."
Clinton vs. Giuliani presidential race would give conservatives fits

[deadparrot]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 12:31am

The extremes of the party control the primary season. If they didn't, McCain would have gotten the Republican nomination in 2000.

Candidates run to the right (or left) during the primaries, and to the center for the general.

Mainstream Republicans may like Rudy in early polling, but they're not going to show up en masse on Primary Day. Not in the numbers that fundamentalist Christians will, at least.

And since social conservatives are feeling more and more screwed by Bush with each passing moment (Roe v. Wade is still legal, there's been no anti-gay marriage constitutional amendment), they're going to be damn sure to fight like hell for an ultra-conservative nominee next year.
Updated On: 2/19/07 at 12:31 AM

[HDThoreau2]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 12:35am

I love all these liberals saying how the conservatives will vote.

Talk about narrow mindedness...

[Yawper]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 12:37am

"I love all these liberals saying how the conservatives will vote."

doesn't matter in my state - Feds are screwing the conservatives here, too

[StickToPriest]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 12:39am

"Candidates run to the right (or left) during the primaries, and to the center for the general."

There lies on the of the primary problems with the Primaries.

[JustAGuy]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 12:40am

"I love all these liberals saying how the conservatives will vote.

Talk about narrow mindedness..."

Not unlike you accusing anyone who doesn't support the administration's current policy in Iraq of being a traitor or supporting Al Qaeda or Hezbollah?

[deadparrot]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 12:42am

I'm a political scientist. I look at what the data tells me.Sometimes something strange happens, and you get a Giuliani. But most of the time...not.

The fiscal conservatism/libertarianism of Goldwater is essentially dead on a national level. Both right and left want to spend goodly amounts of money, and both want the government controlling some aspect of society. They just differ in terms of WHAT they want to spend money on, and WHAT they want the government to monitor. The influence of fundamentalist Christian elements within the Republican party has been steadily increasing since the 1980s, arguably peaking in 2004. Though 2006 was a downturn, it would still be strange for the Republican Party to swing so far to the social left as to nominate someone like Giuliani.

Anything's possible. However, some things are more probable than others.
Updated On: 2/19/07 at 12:42 AM

[HDThoreau2]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 9:58am

Thanks deadparrot, I agree with most of what you have stated.

It's getting a little hot with some board posters who discover for the first time that they share their views with Al Qaeda.

[pemberlee]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 11:46am

Hmmm, I cannot see much of the conservative base, especially the religious right in the South, supporting Giuliani. I have relatives in Mississippi, Alabama, and Texas and they all think divorce is a big no-no. They are more likely to support McCain.

[PalJoey]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 12:12pm

Chanti--I no more share views with Al Qaeda than you do with the Nazis and the Ku Klux Klan.

Hmmm...maybe I should rethink that.

[Elphaba]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 12:20pm

there's that smell again....

Posted: 2/19/07 at 1:39pm

Rudy Guiliani is a Flip flopper. He flip flops on issues. He's a flip flopper. A flip flopper. He flips back and forth on issues. Has he ever been conistant? He's a flip flopper.*

Repeat that for the next 21 months. Because, you know, he's a flip flopper.

[Sing a Song With Me]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 1:45pm

Joe, so's the other two "major" Republican candidates: "ol' Lefty" Romney and John "Never Met A Position I Couldn't Recant Later" McCain.

[ljay889]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 1:47pm

Rudy Guiliani is a Flip flopper. He flip flops on issues. He's a flip flopper. A flip flopper. He flips back and forth on issues. Has he ever been conistant? He's a flip flopper.*

- Then what is Hillary?

Posted: 2/19/07 at 4:09pm

Rudy Guiliani is a Flip flopper. He flip flops on issues. He's a flip flopper. A flip flopper. He flips back and forth on issues. Has he ever been conistant? He's a flip flopper.*

- Then what is Hillary?

The issue WAS Rudy, now it's Hilary!? That's a Flip flop! He can't even keep to the subject at hand he's such a flip flopper! Flip flip flip flip!

See, I've studied the Republican handbook!

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 5:49pm

i'm sorry joe, four flips in a row with no flops? tsk, tsk. back to school, m'boy, back to school.

Posted: 2/19/07 at 6:17pm

Damn that Karl Rove! It IS harder than it looks!

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 6:27pm

He really isn't. Another name for flip flopper is politician. They say it they have listened to other points of view & was swayed byt the arguments of the opposition. Truth be told 99 % of politicians of both parties will say whatever is necessary to get elected. They will do the same to stay in power.

Many of Rudy's views will be anathema to various segments of the population. I must admit though the Thrilla In Manilla that was put off once by Rudy's medical problems (Rudy vs Hillary) may actually come about in 2008

It will be a real barnburner & fun to watch.

Mitt Romney - BORING

[folkyboy]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 7:13pm

does anyone remember all those policemen who shot down that black man on his stoop a couple of years ago FOR NO REASON and how they didn't even get prosecuted. the man was unarmed and everything...

that's the type of ish i think about when i think of Giuliani running for president. no one ever thought he was "so great" until 9/11
Updated On: 2/19/07 at 07:13 PM

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 2/19/07 at 7:16pm

How you can blame Guilani for Diallo escapes me?

Do you blame Bloomberg for Shawn Green? The city was a hellhole before he (Rudy) took office. The city is much better off now. I disagree with him on many positions but I shudder to think what would have happened if he had not been Mayor

Bloomberg is an idiot albeit one with money