The Myth of 'Gay Male Privilege'- Page 3

[givesmevoice]

Posted: 1/28/14 at 4:57pm

Women call each other "bitch" and even call themselves "bitch" as a greeting or a joke. I don't really cotton to it myself. I see it as lowering themselves to where "society" thinks they should be. Women are on a very slippery slope with more and more laws being passed or trying to be passed that regulate their own medical decisions. There seems to be a push to put women "back in their place" and by falling victim to using those terms in everyday conversion they're just allowing it to happen. I don't need to call my friends "bitch" or "c**t". I wouldn't even think of calling a friend either of those names. If you hear me say those terms there will always be anger behind it.

I know that there are women who think that by calling each other or themselves bitch, they're reclaiming the word and somehow working against its deep and negative history, but I don't agree with that sentiment. I agree with you that women using it themselves just makes it seem okay for men to call them a bitch.

[Kad]

Posted: 1/28/14 at 5:25pm

The Jezebel article is truly atrocious. It was ridiculously one-sided and bordered on totally selling out the gay community in order to gain click-bait on Jezebel.

[MrMidwest]

Posted: 1/28/14 at 5:37pm

Yes, you can't take your own experiences and try to say they speak to what's going on everywhere.

It's kind of the same thing that bothers me about some of givesmevoice's comments.

I hate misogyny, but like Phyllis said, I'm not here to take responsibility for everybody else.

[Borstalboy]

Posted: 1/28/14 at 6:21pm

I must admit, my heart sinks a little when I see women at Code night at the Eagle NYC and women just shouldn't be at the Cock, period.

However, a couple of young good-time girls showed up to the Seattle Eagle (By themselves!), had a grand ol' time with no shrillness and even entered the Best Package Contest, giving the winner a run for his money (Who, in one of my finer moments, I went home with--ah, youth!). That was fun.

[strummergirl]

Posted: 1/28/14 at 9:53pm

PRS was definitely the most well-thought response out of that piece and the Jezebel piece but frankly both HuffPo and Jezebel could both fall off the interwebs and I wouldn't feel bad at all. Just click-bait with 'social justice activist powered by Tumblr' writing.

I feel like internet writing co-opted a lot of women & gender and queer studies terminology and phrasing. Suddenly I see the term 'privilege' thrown around left and right but feel like its immediate negative connotations at whomever is the target immediately makes this no longer a two-way conversation. Who wants to be called out on 'privilege'? It's fine to be aware of somebody's societal status but constantly speaking about another person's status, as if you know their whole story, has always rubbed me the wrong way. It's judging appearance and I say that as somebody who gets annoyed when Macklemore becomes the face for gay allies and socially conscious rap. Yes, it helped his rep that he is white and straight but I think he can be critiqued beyond 'UGH CHECK UR PRIVILEGE MACKLEMORE!!!!' I'd love it if his actual skills as an artist were judged objectively again.

Anyway, some women do go to gay bars for attention and objectifying many of the gay male patrons. I've also known women who decided to use those bars to experiment, like a cheap trill, with the lesbian patrons at gay bars. But I also know some straight women just go for enjoyment, keep low-key as much as one can at any bar and don't treat it like some exotic, edgy kind of place. Come to think of it, the most annoying patron I've ever run into at a gay bar was a guy who only seemed to want to grind on women while dancing with an obvious erection. I have no idea what led him to this bar.

Basically I get the instant skepticism of straight people at gay bars. The outsider perspective seems to be 'cool' for some people and if they get the opposite reaction, they should not be surprised. A lot of those bars have long-time patrons who can smell something fishy in somebody's behavior. I think the best is to enter like any other establishment, buy a drink, be a nice tipper, and not act like you are the center of the universe.



Updated On: 1/28/14 at 09:53 PM

[Reginald Tresilian]

Posted: 1/28/14 at 10:03pm

Great post.

[EricMontreal22]

Posted: 1/28/14 at 11:36pm

Strummer, great post.

"Come to think of it, the most annoying patron I've ever run into at a gay bar was a guy who only seemed to want to grind on women while dancing with an obvious erection. I have no idea what led him to this bar. "

I have no idea, either, but I know that when I do go to gay bars with straight female friends, some random "straight" guy usually ends up harassing them. I've heard some straight guys who say they go specifically to find straight women (less competition?) while I've known others who are gay bar regulars who, solely in my experience, have turned out to be there just as a way to deal with their sexuality.

I agree that it's ridiculous how bloggers especially, have made terms like gender privilege such a part of the lexicon, when it barely seems to be used in any way but as some sort of key word simply used as lazy shorthand to get people talking. I admit what bothered me the most in the Jezebel piece just was how the author assumed his experience was universal, or else the gay guys were willfully blind -- when really he seemed just fed up with whatever gay scene he used to, to paraphrase him, regularly go out and drink till he was blackout in. And then to quote some professor who in some random university class apparently asked his gay students if they had inappropriately touched one of their female friends in the last week and they "all" lifted up their hands. I have no clue what school or class this was, but even in my gender or sexuality related classes I never had any idea which guys were gay or not...

[strummergirl]

Posted: 1/28/14 at 11:56pm

Thanks guys.

[Kad]

Posted: 1/29/14 at 7:51am

The Macklemore op-ed pieces and rants on Tumblr, et al., all basically boil down to "grr, a straight white man did a thing!" Maybe add in "cisgender"- another term that's been tossed around so much I now find it irksome, too.

And that's the issue with the social justice on social media movement- it's largely ill-formed, despite the use of academic phrases, and driven by a blinding passion. And in its quest to be inclusive, it just ends up striking the same target, one-sidedly, aggressively, and repeatedly.

Updated On: 1/29/14 at 07:51 AM

[strummergirl]

Posted: 1/29/14 at 10:04am

^^^^
Yup.

I can understand in certain cases where privilege is actually the case of something impacting, like that awful Grantland piece on the dead transgender golf putter designer by Caleb Hannan (and yeah, cisgender was often used to describe him on Tumblr pieces- but I at least understand why where there is a transwoman involved in his matter), but I think actions lose impact if they are constantly identified as the result of 'privilege'. There is a lot of passion in the rhetoric but I think people forget that much of the terminology was often used in the abstract and not so personalized for a reason. It does come off aggressive. It's true that something bad shouldn't happen to oppressed minorities for there to be 'teachable' moments for 'privileged' people but how do you expect those people to grow and learn if you constantly berate them? It becomes white noise if everything they do is the result of their 'privilege'. Like Macklemore beating Kendrick Lamar at the Grammys is not the result of white privilege; it is because the Grammys have been so, so dumb with hip hop but also in other music historically that to take them as an awards branch so seriously is a fool's errand. Like nobody would call Jethro Tull beating Metallica for a Heavy Metal Grammy years ago being because of 'privilege'- just tone-deafness and ignorance on what Metal is as a genre.

[Kad]

Posted: 1/29/14 at 10:33am

I have seen a lot of arguments about the Grammys that I find icky. Primarily, a number of people have been saying that because Macklemore, Justin Timberlake, Robin Thicke, et al are white artists performing in traditionally "black" genres like R&B, hip-hop, and rap, they're in the wrong. Which strikes me as... well, flat-out racist. It's implying that there are genres that only one race can rightfully perform. And then the artists are faulted for being SUCCESSFUL- I've seen the note that there wasn't a number-one black artist on Billboard this year. How can the artists be faulted for being successful?

And then there are arguments faulting Macklemore for ACCEPTING the award- not faulting the award body for GIVING it.

Ugh, this is off the topic and tangential. But it's indicative of the social media slacktivist culture.