"This is America? This is an outrage."- Page 7

[ZONEACE]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 5:57pm

What's wrong with the term Rufugee??? That is exactly what they are, they are. I mean, the definition of refugee is someone who flees in search of refuge. That is what these people doing. I think it's an appropriate word.

[ConvinceMe2]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:05pm

Now we have the politically correct word police. Refugee is the proper word. Anway, Bush is speaking, right now. As someone who has had lots of experience working with persons with both physical and mental disabilities, I believe that he is, at least, mildly retarded.

[Plum]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:07pm

Because "refugee" is a term used to refer to a specific kind of immigrant, which these people aren't. They're not foreign nationals asking for asylum in the U.S. due to political persecution. They're American citizens and victims of a natural disaster. Semantics, I know, but the immigrant (and descendant of refugees) in me is just uncomfortable with that terminology.

CM2, I'm not policing anything. Look in the damn mirror for the definition of "overly defensive."
Updated On: 9/2/05 at 06:07 PM

[ZONEACE]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:08pm

jsut because they aren't refugees of politics or religion or what ever, they are still refugees, refugees of nature.

[ConvinceMe2]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:10pm

Huh?

[Plum]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:12pm

Obviously I haven't made my point clear. Words never have just one meaning; they have implications and associated images. I don't think it's helpful to associate the people displaced by the hurricane with the images invoked by the word "refugee." But hey, that's just me. Like I said, it's mostly a matter of semantics, but it does make me uncomfortable, and I sincerely doubt your arguments are going to change that because it's a personal issue for me.

[robbiej]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:12pm

Although semantically it may not be right, I think the word carries a certain emotional weight that is completely appropriate to this tragedy.

[Plum]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:14pm

My problem, robbie, is that people associate "refugee" not just with sad situations but with hopeless ones in foreign countries they can't find on a map. In other words, with situations that have nothing to do with them. Combine that with the obvious race issues here, and you're starting to see why I don't particularly like the use of that word.

[ZONEACE]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:14pm

my point is, that the reason it should make you uncomfortable is if you are a racist ****who associates the word refugee with some foreign person that is somehow less than you. Otherwise, that is exactly what these people are, THEY ARE REFUGEES. there is no other word that can accurately describe what they are.

[Plum]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:16pm

Oh, lovely, now I'm a racist.

KINDLY READ WHAT I SAY BEFORE YOU MAKE DUMBF*CK ACCUSATIONS. THANK YOU.

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:18pm

And can we stop calling them refugees! They are Americans who have lost everything.

[robbiej]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:19pm

Actually, plum, I think the exact meaning of the word is what makes it such a devastating word to use right now. We ARE used to thinking of refugees as 'others'...but now to apply that word to our own people (rightly or wrongly) actually makes me understand the horror is a different way. And, oddly, understand the horror others around the globe feel in times like this in a way I never have before.

For some reason, it makes it far more real to me.

And I can't believe you just typed DUMBF*CK!

[Plum]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:21pm

You're more optimistic than I am today, robbie, but thank you for that perspective. I've been editing highly technical documents all day and I'm a bit frazzled, to put it mildly.

[ZONEACE]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:22pm

THEY ARE F*CKING REFUGEES. THAT IS WHAT THEY ARE THEY HAVE BEEN DISPLACED AND ARE SEEKING REFUGE. SEE THE KEY WORD THERE, REFUGE, A PERSON SEEKING REFUGE IS A REFUGEE.


now that we all understand what the word means, maybe we can all realize that it is the correct word for this situation. Refugee does not equal poor foreign trash. It means someone who for some reason or another is leaving where they are from and going somewhere else for shelter and/or preotection AKA refuge.

[Plum]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:24pm

*deep breaths*

*deep breaths*

Be back in two minutes. I'm going to kick something.

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:25pm

Refugee:

alien, boat person, castaway, defector, derelict, deserter, displaced person, DP, emigrant, escapee, evacuee, exile, expatriate, expellee, foreigner, foundling, fugitive, homeless person, leper, maroon, outcast, outlaw, pariah, prodigal, renegade, runaway, stateless person, émigré

[robbiej]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:26pm

Actually, Plum is very right in understanding the definition.

There is also an element of choice in the term refugee...though not much. It's one who flees from some sort of persecution.

But, for me personally, the word is so loaded with emotion and history that I feel it appropriate to use. For me. Personally. It actually makes it more real to me.

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:37pm

Why wouldn't they be refugees? Aren't they seeking refuge?

[ConvinceMe2]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:37pm

Just received a call from a friend in Washington, D.C. They are bringing in hundreds of "refugees" (the word he used), to the DC Armory. They, apparently, are looking for people to take these refugees in. Everyone who can, should look into this. He doesn't have all the details; but he will be working on this. I'll post if I get any more info. I'm hoping they'll let me bring some people home! What a great way to help.

[robbiej]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 6:38pm

The definition actually refers to people fleeing a place due to religious or political persecution.

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 7:00pm

opening up this thread and seeing plum scream dumbf*ck has made my week.

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 7:01pm

lol--plum has HAD IT.

[KelRel]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 7:15pm

I know that I am probably all alone on in Kentucky, but on the odd chance there is anyone on here from KY Immanuel Baptist Church in Lexington, KY is suposed to get about 40 people from NOLA tonight. I have already taken a bunch of sheets and some clothes and such and I will be going down there to help when the people get here. If you are near by and can help it would be greatly appreciated.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 7:32pm

All right, screw it KelRel. Divorce your husband, buy a strap on and let's get married!

Okay, I propose the following nomenclature, loaded as it may be, for the American citizens who lost everything: "wretched refuse."

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 9/2/05 at 7:41pm

Anyone watching Jesse Jackson on Anderson Cooper's 360? Apparently, the reason the government took so long to provide relief was not merely incompetence, but also because the people who are stranded are almost entirely African-American. It's now a racial thing.

PS - When did "refugee" become a derogatory term? I was not aware it was on the un-PC list of terms. Does anyone have Politically Correct Verbage v3.01.016? My subscription for automatic updates has lapsed.

Updated On: 9/2/05 at 07:41 PM