UNITED 93 is the best film of the year so far and by far...- Page 7

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 5/3/06 at 9:44am

I completely understand and agree with the point you are trying to make. I just wanted to avoid Luscious' thinking that you were denying that ANY of the people on that plane were heroes as he was trying in some way to use your point to win the argument he's been having since the film was announced.

We do KNOW that there were passengers who fought back--the details are only as clear as the phone records allow. But, assuming the plane was not brought down by the military (where is the proof of that?), they did do SOMETHING that caused the plane to come down--by either halting the pilot or forcing the pilot to make a brash decision.

And I would really like to know why anyone would think the military did bring down the plane. Why would the government prefer to look completely useless?

Updated On: 5/3/06 at 09:44 AM

[Garland Grrrl]

Posted: 5/3/06 at 12:15pm

i'm so glad it's beautifully done. i went to the imdb page of the actor who plays the man i knew and i just sobbed at my desk so i'm not sure i could go.

[Unknown User]

Posted: 5/3/06 at 7:30pm

Thats terrible, Garland Grrrl. I'm sorry.

Today in my American History Class- we began a dicussion on terrorism, and we started with the Iranian Hostage Situtation, and we're leading up to 9/11 and in our packet there's a picture of Osama Bin Laden, I crossed out his face and wrote in big letters- BASTARD. HE SHOULD DIE.

I know that my post about how the whole WORLD changed cause of 9/11-- I know my world & people my age around me's lives changed. 9/11 was the 1st time, I ever realized just how vunerable our country was. You always imagen the US as some kind of Greek God- untouchable, and safe. (I was 13 and kinda foolish- but thats how I pictured it) and then 9/11 occured & watching the 24 hour news coverage in the following days lead to such a realization in my own world- that the world is so much bigger and more vunerable than that of a 13 year old kid in Logan Township, NJ. That opened up alot of deep down feelings of sadness, and I cried alot after 9/11 && had nightmares, it was just very scary. I'm not saying my little story is anything like those who lost someone, (they have more reason to be upset and feel sadness) but its sad that now children will have to fear for their country & the lives of their parents.

[Luscious]

Posted: 5/3/06 at 7:55pm

"Luscious, I may be putting words in iflit's mouth, but she didn't say the people on Flight 93 weren't heroes. If they really did fight back and prevent that plane from killing people on the ground, they are indeed heroes."

"And, I can't for the life of me see why that disgusts you. Fine if you believe the possible conspiracy theories may actually be the truth. But why on earth is the story on record so repulsive? Especially when it COULD be the truth."


Thank you, Jerby, for putting words in my mouth and missing my point. And thank you, iflit, for getting it. Since it keeps getting referred to here, I guess I should copy and paste what I originally posted about the film in a related thread. (See below) I never said that I didn't think that at least some of the passengers on Flight 93 were heroes. And I certainly NEVER said that I was DISGUSTED or found anything about them or their experience REPULSIVE. Even if they weren't ultimately responsible for bringing down the plane, that doesn't mean that there weren't heroes among them. As I've previously stated, iflit said it best. I'm in complete agreement with her entire statement.

Previously posted on UNITED 93: are we ready? thread:

As far as I'm concerned, it's propaganda. How does anyone really know what went on aboard that plane? I mean, other then the cell phone calls to loved ones and 911 operators, how does anyone REALLY know what took place.

No doubt there were at least a handful of passengers who, after hearing the Trade Center towers had been hit by planes, decided to take matters into their own hands by desperately attempting to overtake the highjackers. But beyond that, it's all speculation.

Personally, I don't believe that anyone on the plane was responsible for bringing it down. I've always believed that it was brought down by our military. But, we'll probably never know for sure.

I have no interest in experiencing someone's imagined version of these events. Frankly, and I know this is a controversial opinion to have; I'm tired of all of the hero worship associated with 9-11. It was a devastating and horrific tragedy that I watched unfold live on my living room T.V. in NYC. Innocent people, who were in the wrong place at the wrong time, lost their lives. Unfortunately, it happens every day to thousands of people all over the world.

Updated On: 5/3/06 at 07:55 PM

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 5/3/06 at 8:16pm

Ok. Fair enough.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 5/3/06 at 11:03pm

"but its sad that now children will have to fear for their country & the lives of their parents...."

In the 1950s, schoolchildren were told that atomic bombs could come reigning down on them at any moment and that if they were in school they should climb under their desks to protect them from the nuclear blast.

Throughout the Cold War, people lived with the thought that at any time, some insane Russian leader or the obviously senile Ronald Reagan might just push the button. It was an ever-present buzz in the back of people's minds.

So, no, 2001 was not the first year "Americans" felt vulnerable, nor was it the first time "children had to fear for their country & the lives of their parents."

[Luscious]

Posted: 5/5/06 at 10:24pm

So... okay, I saw the film tonight. What can I say? I guess my curiosity got the best of me.

I'm not exactly sure what to think or what to say about it. I didn't like it or dislike it. It just kind of was. I'm still left wondering, for what audience is this movie intended? I mean... it's not entertaining. And it isn't especially insightful or enlightening. It doesn't offer any new information or explore new territory. It almost doesn't have a point of view. It's just a dramatic reenactment of an event, as the majority of people believe it to have happened. So, beyond that, what's its purpose exactly? What am I supposed to take away from it? What have I gained from seeing it? When all is said and done, is the primary purpose of seeing it to be able to say you've seen it?

I suppose for some it could be a cathartic experience, although it wasn't for me. I actually found it somewhat voyeuristic in nature, appealing to our desire to want to know every minute detail of how something played out right down to the very last personal phone call. At times, I almost felt a little guilty watching it. Maybe that's one of the reasons I had reservations about seeing it in the first place.

The one thing I will take back is calling it propaganda. It's not. It doesn't have a strong enough point of view to be considered propaganda.

In the end, if you think you can get something out of seeing it, see it. I'm not sorry I did. But neither do I feel any the richer for it. And I can't imagine ever wanting to sit through it a second time.

Updated On: 5/7/06 at 10:24 PM

[Over_the_Moon]

Posted: 5/7/06 at 10:59pm

I hate to interrupt the irrelevant banter, but I must say how I really enjoy how un-Hollywood this movie is. They didn't spend time building characters to make it more of a tear-jerker, insert the love story of husband and wife before the flight, use big names, or anything.

The way that it ended was exactly how I thought it would (and should) be.

The whole experience was really numbing, and I must agree with Namo about how weird it is that people were sitting around me with their big gulps and jujubees getting ready to watch, well, this...

[Luscious]

Posted: 5/7/06 at 11:09pm

Wow. Like totally relevant, man.

Updated On: 5/7/06 at 11:09 PM

[Over_the_Moon]

Posted: 5/7/06 at 11:22pm

Actually, in that sentence, it would be "make." Singular. :)

[wickedrentq]

Posted: 5/31/06 at 4:18am

So I finally saw this movie tonight. I've wanted to see it for a while, but I promised my friend I'd wait for her to see it with me. We both saw it tonight. I was going to just post some thoughts, but reading through the thread made me think more about some points brought up. I thought a bit, and here's some responses I could think of:

I think it's really important to remember that everyone had a different...experience? with 9/11. Like, some people watched the news non-stop and read every story and thing about it years down the road, while others watched CNN for a week. These differences, I think, effect how...important? the film may seem to a viewer.

I myself acted very different than most. I didn't run away from it--I learned what happened and knew the basics. But I had no desire to constantly watch news and the sad stories and see images. I would discuss it with anyone who wanted, but if given the choice, I just...didn't want to. The night of September 11th I watched a Brady Bunch marathon on the Fox Family channel. Looking back, I can't really explain why I did this...but I did.

So a lot of this was a new experience for me. I went in and was shocked to see so much of the film taken up by the controllers. I didn't know all these different "theories" existed. While I assumed the film could be as true as it could be, I did realize as I walked out of the theatre that no one survived that plan, so there is no way to know that that exact event happened. I was glad to have realized it, though I do think it must have been somewhat similar.

The movie itself...just...wow. Other people have described this being an experience, and I'll agree with that. I actually felt nauseous the whole time. I've never reacted to a movie that way before. Also, the way my friend and I reacted covered both grounds--I bawled, and she didn't tear as she watched in shock.

I too also loved that the movie did not try to represent a point, or do too much to romanticize the events or even develop the characters.

Now, to touch on some other interesting points brought up in the thread. DG, I can see what you mean about us wanting to experience things in movie theatres, but I'm not sure that's quite the point. If you *really* think about it, just like the movie ends and the lights come on, you can turn off the news on your TV at any point and...well...put on the Brady Bunch. That's life. Maybe it's a little different of an experience now that it occurred in the past but I'm honestly going through another phase where I'm terrified to get on a plane. Thank goodness the earliest I will be is December.

I think it's just more that attending movies is a more..normal event for American society than...watching documentaries on National Geographic. That's why the movies are made and that's why we see them...even if they're about quite recent events. You call your friends to hang out and ask if there's any movies playing.

IFlit, I do understand your point about heroes. And while it can lose its meaning, is it really so terrible that we drop the word "hero" quite often? I just think it's another way of helping the grieving and healing process. It makes you happy to consider victims heroes, you know? Just like I smiled so wide when the passengers began attacking, and why I desperately want to believe that they did overtake the plane. Is it really hurting anyone to overuse the word if it does help people to grieve?

Also on the subject...I think at the time, 9/11 was considered to be of more importance than other tragedies, but I think it was because it was just so recent. These days, I don't think those who have lost loved ones in the tragedies consider they're losses any bigger or more important than anyone else who have lost loved ones--there just happen to be a great deal of people who share losses here, and that's what makes them bigger--the quantity. Not the quality. Otherwise, I'm not sure we're really that "obsessed" with 9/11.

I agree that the world hasn't changed much. And I mean, there's only so much it should change--some degree of normalcy should return. But other aspects are unfortunate--I truly miss the unity that was established in this country during that period. That's how humanity has always been though--we unite through tragedy, and fight with each other at all other times. Really it seems like the biggest change from 9/11 has been the singing of "God Bless America" at baseball games.

Meh, I know there were other points I wanted to address. Umm, I didn't view this film at all as pro-Bush. I don't think that's the intention here.

And I think part of the importance of the film is to remind people of the tragedy, so it becomes more than just another "where were you on this day" to "brag" about.

I guess that just leaves the thoughts circling my head--things that most people probably feel/felt during the movie, and tragedy itself. But it's 4:11AM and no one else is up to discuss it with so I'm just gonna post it here even if it's tedious :-P It's so sad that they were able to get the knives and bombs onto the planes. I guess we don't know for sure, but it's so terrible that they convinced the flight attendants to get them into the cockpit. It's easier to scream "no" while you're watching, and I can see where you desperately want to believe that no one will get hurt but still...

You want to scream at anyone who didn't believe the plane had actually been hijacked, but then I thought back to how much I was in disbelief when I first heard the news.

Finally, I too loved the ending. I just wanted to sit through the credits to...get ready to exit the theatre and be away from the tragedy, but my friend had to get up early so we left. The silence was so perfect--no heavily sad/romantic music, or total slow-motion. Just...what was believed to have happened.

I'm very glad I saw this movie, but it is not for everyone. There's two hard realities to it: feeling for the passengers you see who you know will die and the good-byes they say, but also the scaryness of the terrorists getting on, hijacking the plane, and doing some killing. Like, I talked to my mom tonight--I know she could handle the first part, but not the second part.

Definitely a movie to see one time and never again.

And thank you very much if you're still reading. My mind goes all haywire and gets extra rambly and random late at night.

[RobbO]

Posted: 9/5/06 at 10:29am

i haven't seen it yet but i just rented it from blockbuster a few minutes ago.

[RobbO]

Posted: 9/5/06 at 11:09pm

i don't know if i have overloaded on 9/11 documentaries the past few weeks or what (the history and discovery channels have had many), but i thought this film was just so-so.

i'm still processing the film right now, but if nothing else i do not think this film will be nominated for any awards (not that that should be the focus but it seems that it is the "theme" of this particular thread).

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 9/6/06 at 12:03am

I think the hype probably hurt ya, too.

As it stands, this film (and WTC) are on the Oscar Buzz lists. Whether or not they stay is another thing. It just depends on what comes out this year.

[RobbO]

Posted: 9/6/06 at 12:22am

i don't this so. i wish it were the case but i really doubt it. the film felt very detached, almost clinical, for some reason. the telling of the events on documentaries/docudramas i have seen has been much more emotional than united 93 was. it all felt very one-dimensional to me.

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 9/6/06 at 12:30am

I'm not basing that on my opinion as you know. Though I could easily see 93 getting a slot.

However, Dreamgirls and The Queen already have bigger Oscar buzz with many films on the horizon to enter the race. (Bobby (with festival buzz) and Hollywoodland (opening this week) are the next two that could enter the race)

The race (according to oscarwatch.com) currently stands at

The Queen
Dreamgirls
World Trade Center
United 93

But, remember that they don't put films on the list until they have been seen or have generated legitimate Oscar buzz by people who have seen them.

[RobbO]

Posted: 9/6/06 at 12:33am

i will see hollywoodland (that's saying something for a person who has not been to a movie theatre since march) but a mid-september opening does not bode well for the film.

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 9/6/06 at 12:36am

true. That is a rare month for a film to be released and get a Best Picture nom, let alone win.

[munkustrap178]

Posted: 9/6/06 at 12:49am

I thought UNITED 93 was a far better film than WORLD TRADE CENTER, and far better than FLIGHT 93, for that matter.

[Elphaba]

Posted: 9/6/06 at 2:25am

we watched United 93 tonight. Not sure if I liked it.

[RobbO]

Posted: 9/7/06 at 2:41pm

i think the directors choice to use real actors as the "professionals" in many of the FAA/military scenes to add "veracity" (as he said) ultimately did a disservice to the film. whenever these people came on the screen, their performance was so uncomfortable and awkward that i was pulled out of the telling of the story and reminded that i was, in fact, watching a film. that was the exact opposite effect the director was looking for.

i actually just watched the film again with the director's commentary and i still do not care for the film as a whole. as a retelling of an event it was fine, but as a movie, it just felt one-dimensional and stifled.

Updated On: 9/7/06 at 02:41 PM