why are Little & Big Edie gay icons?

[merriwether]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 12:18am

i heard someone say that the women from "Grey Gardens" are gay icons and the documentary is a gay touchstone - really? what's the appeal?

[miss pennywise]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 12:20am

oh god.

my god.

[PalJoey]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 12:27am

How OLD are you, merriwether?

[Auggie27]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 8:09am

Kinda reminds me of questions I can't answer. Like, why does Seth Rogan get laid in every movie he makes.

[Roscoe]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 9:33am

Well, I think it is a valid question. Why are they gay icons? And is their icon status really as widespread as the reviews would have us believe? For years I was the only person I knew who was even aware the movie existed. When I was working at a job with a significant gay population, nobody had heard of the film, and those who had heard of it couldn't stand the film. This was during the 90s when a brand new restoration of the film was playing at Film Forum.

Their icon status also begs the question of what they are supposed to be icons of. I have to admit that I've never really been able to see the Beales as being much more than bat**** crazy. Don't get me wrong, I love the Maysles film like few others, but I see it as a fascinating and disturbing picture of a pair of women going round and round over the same past issues for ever, like NO EXIT written by Tennessee Williams.

[DMsquared2]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 9:41am

They're gay icons because they're women.
Updated On: 4/20/09 at 09:41 AM

[Unknown User]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 10:23am

I don't think they are Gay icons.

[WhizzerMarvin]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 10:32am

During one of the TV interviews Christine Ebersole did during the run of Grey Gardens she was asked about the show attracting a gay audience. She said that she thought this was because the show is about the disenfrachised, and that gays can relate to this message about being denied and secluded from the rest of the world. (If my memory serves me correctly.)

[Q]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 10:42am

I hadn't even heard of these women until the musical was developed.

[JustAGuy]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 10:46am

Gay Icons? Really? To me that sounds like something a Press Agent would say to stir up some interest in the Gay community. I'm guessing outside of NYC and maybe some other large metropolitan areas...that very few gays would even know who the Beale's are.

[Unknown User]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 10:56am

For me, it's little Edie who is the gay icon, and there is one reason...her incredible wardrobe. The scarves, the skirts, the drapery cords used as belts. Without her clothes the film wouldn't be half as interesting.

[PalJoey]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 11:32am

The question implies that a 60-year-old gay and a 20-year-old gay would have the same "icons"--or that a gay in a small town in Nebraska would have the same "icons" as a gay in San Francisco or Atlanta.

Or that they would have icons at all.

Or that all gays have icons.

Or that all gays are the same.

[JerseyGirl2]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 12:35pm

Because if there is enough alcohol at a party, at some point one of my friends just might emerge with a skirt on his head yelling about being a staunch woman!

[Reginald Tresilian]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 12:45pm

PalJoey, I don't think the question does imply the things you say it does. One could say that your answer implies that there's no such thing as a gay icon, which I don't think you believe is true.

The Beales aren't Judy Garland, but I'd say they're definitely gay (or camp, if those are different) icons. Not all such are universal. The fact that my top-three list doesn't include, say, Marilyn Monroe doesn't mean that she isn't an icon to a large number of gay men.

[Borstalboy]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 12:47pm

They are gay icons because fabulousness is fabulousness.

[doodlenyc]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 12:58pm

Noone's gayer than me and I never heard of GG until the musical.

[StockardFan]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 1:05pm

doodle you just made me laugh....

[PalJoey]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 1:28pm

I simply don't believe there are gay icons anymore.

[Reginald Tresilian]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 2:02pm

I'd say with a Broadway musical and a movie featuring Drew Barrymore, they're more of an icon now than ever before.
And Alan Cumming agrees with me.

[Roscoe]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 2:06pm

Sorry, but I just don't see anything fabulous about the Beales. Can someone explain their fabulousness to me?

[Reginald Tresilian]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 2:09pm

I can't. I don't think they're fabulous; I think they're pathetic.

As I said, they're not my icons. But I think it's silly to claim they aren't some sort of gay icon. I think once you "hit the list," you're on it for good. Just because most 20-year-old gay boys don't lipsynch to "Judy at Carnegie Hall" doesn't mean she's lost her gay icon status.
Updated On: 4/20/09 at 02:09 PM

[BobbyBubby]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 2:47pm

Gays have always been drawn to those who live tortured or fragmented lives. I think we can relate to the loneliness and loss that they felt.

[miss pennywise]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 2:51pm

The Beales lived their lives as the people they were, not the people others "expected" them to be. In their own way, they triumphed over society (and all that word implies). And that is what I respect about them.

They also represent a sense of sadness that is inherent in every human life, but theirs is unambiguous because it is so extreme. We live our lives denying and trying to ignore the sadness, which is a necessary survival mechanism. (I always say that if I focused solely on all the sorrow and misery in this world, I'd never get out of bed in the morning.) When we read or see something about the Beale women, it reminds us that we are all truly vulnerable in this life, no matter how much money, beauty, celebrity or strength we seemingly possess.

This doesn't really address the question about their being "gay" icons, but simply why they are so interesting to people in general.

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 3:11pm

if they're such gay icons how come none of the gays here use them in their icons? huh?

now big and little enos, they were icons. when they sent bandit after that coors? that's some cinematic magic right there, i tell you what.

[Q]

Posted: 4/20/09 at 3:18pm

MissP - that was very well stated. You know I have serious problems with this story - especially the monied connection part that I feel abandoned them to suffer because of their situation. But I understand your perspective, and can 'get' why some would respond to them in that way.