Biggest "Best Musical" Tony Upset of all time?!?!- Page 2

[Roninjoey]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 12:39am

I think it's just a question of material. Yes, Spamalot is very entertaining and all, but Light in the Piazza is art, and I believe it will endure when Spamalot is just a cultural footnote.

I do think the Monty Python movies, because of their out and out intentive silliness, will have major longevity, but the musical is too grounded in its lazy sense of humor and one joke.

[Wanna Be A Foster]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 12:44am

Piazza won 6 Tonys, not 7.

1. Vicki
2. Score
3. Costume Design
4. Lighting Design
5. Scenic Design
6. Orchestrations

Updated On: 2/27/06 at 12:44 AM

[jam_man]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 12:44am

I haven't seen Piazza, so I can't comment directly, but ingeneral, I agree. Good art lasts a lot longer than good forget-your-troubles-and-have-a-nice-time-please shows. Look at Show Boat vs. all of the semi-ploted shows of the '20s.

EDIT: Oh, sorry. Haven't checked IBDB in a while. My point is still valid, though.

Updated On: 2/27/06 at 12:44 AM

[gavrochegirl]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 12:44am

Spamalot over one of the nominees. They were all SO good...
The Lion King over Ragtime
ETA: Fosse over Parade

Updated On: 2/27/06 at 12:44 AM

[jam_man]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 12:46am

Everyone else has mentioned it, but I agree so I'll say it, too. The Lion King over Ragtime. Ditto the Piazza/Spamalot arguement.

[Composer9]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 1:17am

Agree Piazza should have taken it...

Also wholeheartedly agree about Music Man over West Side Story. That one makes my soul hurt a little bit. WSS is superior in my opinion.

[iliketheater]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 1:21am

SPAMALOT.

Posted: 2/27/06 at 1:26am

foster, I think you meant scenic design not sound design?

Posted: 2/27/06 at 1:28am

Wicked over Avenue Q- I love both shows, but Wicked was such a favorite to win, it was clear to most it would but when it lost to Avenue Q it was very shocking to me.

Spamalot over Piazza- I mean having had Avenue Q win over Wicked and Caroline or Change the year before- you'd think something as sophiscated and elegant as Piazza could over take crazy and loony fun Spamalot, it was very shocking to me. Although I did love Spamalot.

[millie_dillmount]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 1:29am

I think to the general public, Ave Q over Wicked winning Best Musical. Wicked is so hyped that I thought that there was nothing that was going to stop it, and was 101% positive it was going to win. Never did I expect Q to win...I'm not criticizing that they did or anything like that.

Posted: 2/27/06 at 1:31am

agreed Millie.

Who did Hairspray beat out for Best Musical?

[Wanna Be A Foster]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 1:33am

Movin' Out.

The rest was just filler: Amour and A Year With Frog And Toad

Updated On: 2/27/06 at 01:33 AM

Posted: 2/27/06 at 1:34am

No contest there- no upset: Hairspray is so great.

[millie_dillmount]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 1:35am

Yeah I think everyone knew for sure Hairspray would win...no competition that year really.

[HeyMrMusic]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 1:35am

O, I loved Movin' Out. If I were a voter, I would have a tough time with that one.

~Steven

[frontrowcentre2]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 2:32am

Because the votes are secret, we never know how close some of those races were.

In the end, the Tony is just a marketing tool and only really prolongs the runs of marginal shows. MISS SAIGON ran 10+ years without winning best Musical. GREASE ran 8 years.

The best part of teh awards is the chance to see 5 minute excerpts on TV. Sometimes these help shows that don't win teh big award. GRAND HOTEL was saved from failure by being showcased at the top of the 1990 Tonys.

I don't always agree with end results. In 1995 they should have NOT given an award since SUNSET BLVD was teh only new musical and it was hardly an award wrthey show.

When a show takes Best Book and Best Score it SHOULD automatically be named Best Musical!

Revues and Juke Box shows (FOSSE, AIN'T MISBEHAVIN') should be special events and not eligable for Best musical.

Revivals of shows that were born before the Tonys should be eligable for Best musical. (I.e. in 1995 SHOW BOAT would have won Best musical.)

[OasisBroadway]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 11:26am

Another vote for The Lion King over Ragtime.

[children&art]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 11:29am

hello? anyone going to comment on "2 Gentlemen of Verona" over "Follies"???? What was that about?

[nealb1]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 11:33am

"Ragtime" losing to "The Lion King" and "Miss Saigon" losing to "The Will Rogers Follies."

[MargoChanning]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 11:54am

Lots of people found FOLLIES to be a morose and depressing indictment of marriage and what it had to say about getting older and regretting the mistakes of the past hit way too close to home for many who were turned off by it. While the score, staging and design were all very well received (and all won Tonys), the book was viewed as a banal, nihilistic soap opera.

Best book and Best Musical went to TWO GENTLEMEN that year which I could never understand until I saw the production of it in the Park last summer. It all made sense. TWO GENTLEMEN is in many ways the anti-FOLLIES -- fun, splashy, multicultural with a terrific score and a strong satirical anti-war sentiment which obviously resonated with the Vietnam era audiences and Tony voters. FOLLIES was a show to be admired and respected (hence the 7 Tonys), but perhaps not loved. I think TWO GENTLEMEN felt like a smart, life-affirming, youthful celebration which may be what people wanted and needed to see during that difficult moment in time, rather than a show that forces you to confront all your failures and disappointments and regrets and perhaps even question whether you married the right person.

[children&art]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 12:04pm

Margo:

Having never seen "2 Gents" i guess my opinion doesnt hold much water, but while I agree "Follies" book needs serious help the commentary it makes is not necessarily morose and depressing - it uses the theatre and it's arts to comment on these people's lives, they suddenly "come alive" when singing and dancing like they used to. I think it is absolute genius the way that things unspoken and hidden in the dialogue are presented as psychological glimpses into these people when they go into the follies. Then again, maybe it is appropriate that "Follies" lost to "2 Gentlemen" - the message of the former is that theatre is dying from what it once was and is being reborn as something more contemporary.

[Enjolras77]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 12:08pm

Once again...most of these are not "upsets". An upset is when the clear favorite is defeated. Avenue Q beating Wicked IS an upset. Ragtime losing to The Lion King is NOT an upset (although it is very UPSETTING!). The Lion King was picked by many pundits to win the award. Maybe a better title for this thread is 'Which "Best Musical" Loser most deserved to win' or 'Which show was robbed of the Best Musical Tony'.

There was an minor upset in 1998, however. Even though the vast majority of us probably agree that Audra McDonald deserved the supporting actress Tony that year, The Lion King's Tsidii Le Loka, was actually the pundits clear frontrunner for the award. Audra's win was a minor upset.

[MargoChanning]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 12:14pm

Oh make no mistake, while TWO GENTLEMEN is a fun, well-crafted show, FOLLIES is a complete masterpiece, despite certain issues with the book. All I'm saying is that I understand why the Tony voters selected the fun, youthful, multicultural, anti-war show over the very serious and adult and sobering masterpiece. I think the daily images on television of young kids coming back dead from Vietnam may have played a role in the choice and it makes sense. No TWO GENTLEMEN is not a better show than FOLLIES, but it is a very good show and I think its hope and optimism ultimately won over the voters.

Posted: 2/27/06 at 12:44pm

Aveque Q won fair and square over that green ****.

Kidding aside, when I watched the Tony's back in 04, I thought Q had more spunk in their performance than Wicked. Just on that alone, I could see why Q won and not Wicked.

[Cenoern]

Posted: 2/27/06 at 1:15pm

Spamalot over ANYTHING, but ESPECIALLY with the talented competitors Light in the Piazza and Spelling Bee