Gay presence at the Tonys- Page 4

[MrMidwest]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 2:02pm

A lot of shows have political elements, does that mean the Tonys are being political if they win?

I can sort of understand not wanting political elements in an award show, but in the end they're all sort of intertwined.

I personally didn't find anything last night to be very political, but if it had been, I wouldn't have minded much.

[cserannie]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 2:03pm

I just don't understand one thing: CBS let women kiss each other but they don't let actors sing the original text of their show because of the word "****"?

Posted: 6/6/05 at 2:05pm

Theatre Trash how can you tell if a Kiss is a spontaneous gesture of affection or a political act? Isn't it true that "A kiss is still a Kiss?"

Let's move on now to how James Earl Jones was openly black! And what was with "Phylactery" as a Spelling Bee word? Could they BE more Jewish?

This thread is doing me harm-- I can feel my blood pressure rising as I read it. Elphaba, let's go have a drink somewhere!

[DayDreamer]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 2:06pm

Hm... lets see... here's an awards show for something where gay people thrive and can be open, and it's televised nationally. So why he hell not be open? And if it turns out to be a little of a political statement (that gays deserve the same rights as heterosexuals), then so be it.

The only sad part is that they're prolly preaching to the choir.

I'm more bothered by this thread that I ever will be about gays (or anyone, for that matter) kissing and expressing their love for someone in public.

[Elphaba]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 2:06pm

Joe, you have a deal, I'LL BUY!

Updated On: 6/6/05 at 02:06 PM

[DTC]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 2:20pm

"I want to thank [...] my partner, Eric Shure, who gives me unconditional love. Harvey and Jerry you have written a story about unconditional love and our country needs to hear it today more than ever. Thank for that. Thank you for this. Thank you, I love Broadway!"

Considering the message of the show that Jerry Mitchell won his Tony for, I believe he can be forgiven for being "political" in his acceptance speech.

[BobbyBubby]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 2:22pm

I'm still trying to see what's wrong with a speech being slightly political. Straight people do it all the time, and nobody seems to blink an eye.

[LucilleAndLeoFrank]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 2:22pm

"This thread is doing me harm-- I can feel my blood pressure rising as I read it."

If you really feel that way, you should request that it be deleted.

[rKrispyt]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 2:25pm

Elphaba and Joe - be sure to have one for me! lol. Perhaps a shot of tequila...or a body shot off of someone of the same sex (but only if the cameras are rolling or there's some other chance to make a widely seen political statement...otherwise, have a light beer or a soda)

I have to say, I think I'm so convinced that it's just natural because it's the theatre community. Had it been the oscars or the emmy's...I jsut feel like they all get so much pressure from agents etc. and being in the media that they're trained to think before doing because of the tabloids and the cameras and the papparazzi and all that....something like this happening so much at a bigger, more 'hollywood' venue would possibly raise an eyebrow for me and make me think something was up - cause people don't seem to be jsut themselves as much as we all know they are in theatre, or supported as much by the environment that we know theatre provides for members of its community.

I dunno, perhaps I'm in the minority, but I don't think art and life should be so separated. For homosexuals...well, laws banning you from a ceremony vowing your love for someone and allowing you to spend the rest of your life with them...kind of effects your life, it's not just politics. I gots no problem with people taking a stand and voicing their opinion and not just doing what they should or are told on these award ceremonies...however I just dont' think that that's at all what happened last nihgt.

and I concur with Peter, that when you have people who are in the same boat as you questioning your motives for kissing your partner...then we're in some serious trouble my friends.

and yeah, the existence of this post is definitely more disturbing than any kiss between loved ones celebrating recognition for pouring your heart and soul into something...

[Elphaba]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 2:50pm

beer, GLORIOUS beer!

[DayDreamer]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 2:51pm

Joe... can I tag along with you and Elphaba... after this thread I'm in dire need of a drink!

[Tom1071]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 2:53pm

"i'm a bit opposed to the gay presence at the TONYS. i just feel like it might, unfortunately, turn people away. There are enough ignorant people in this world already who accept the stereotype that so many people involved with theatre are homosexual. if some of those ignorant people decided to give theatre a chance and watched the tony awards...they would probably be turned away. it's sad and unfortunate, but not everyone in this world is accepting of homosexuality. i'm not saying people should lie or try to hide things. i just think the actors should maybe be a little more discrete before deciding to be so bold." -cathywellerstein

Cathy- You are clearly one of those ignorant people that you wrote about. Your statement disgusts me. You should be ashamed.

Updated On: 6/6/05 at 02:53 PM

[BlueWizard]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 2:53pm

I thought I'd throw my voice in.... (I'm responding to a lot of people's posts here):

Tony's celebrate theater and theater doesn't equal homosexuality. Also, why can't we spend the evening celebrating theater without touching on politics?

The western theatre tradition has ALWAYS been intimately tied with politics. I think we're living in a dangerous age when art is becomming increasingly disconnected with the world we live in. I think it was very appropriate for Jerry Mitchell to point out a relevant theme of the show he won for.

Furthermore:
However, had no idea Albee was gay. [...] It amazed me considering how incredibly well his plays are written for married couples. He writes women so wonderfully.

That comment is rather disturbing: are you saying gay men don't normally understand women or heterosexual relationships, and thus are incapable of depicting them in art? What a shock that a gay man could create a woman character as well as....well, a straight man!

One must remember that when a straight couple kisses on TV, it's political too. It's just that today's US politics seem to agree with that kiss.

Updated On: 6/6/05 at 02:53 PM

[DayDreamer]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 2:56pm

*sigh*

Tom... I'm so glad I just re-read your message and realized you were quoting and answering Cathy. You almost got a pageful from me.

[erinrebecca]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 2:59pm

Exactly, bluewizard, if anyone knows women, it's certainly gay men! Much more so than straight men.

[BlueWizard]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 3:14pm

I'm slowly reading through the rest of this thread. Wow, some of these comments are reeking of (internalized) homophobia. Gay artists shouldn't express thanks to their life partners because middle America wouldn't like it? BACK INTO THE CLOSET, EVERYONE!

"We won't die secret deaths anymore." Anyone remember that line?

[Marquise]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 3:17pm

OH.
MY.
GOD!

You mean to tell me that there were actual homosexuals on the Tony Awards telecast last night?!!!!!

NO FRIGGIN' WAY. IT CAN'T BE! I REFUSE TO BELIEVE IT! YOU PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO DEFAME THE PRESTIGIOUS TONYS WITH YOUR SLANDER AND LIES! STOP IT! JUST STOP IT!
Updated On: 6/6/05 at 03:17 PM

Posted: 6/6/05 at 3:20pm

OK I called the doctor and he upped my dosage so I could wade back in for a second.

It made me glad to live in the Bluest City in a very blue state when even the Republican paper in town could throw this into their Tony coverage:


From Today's Chicago Tribune: "For those playing the popular Tony parlor game of timing how long would pass before we saw two men kiss, the first such smack came after 42 minutes."

[rKrispyt]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 3:24pm

I have to say, earlier this year I stumbled across a website of a (I dunno, I guess you could prolly say up-and-coming - how does one define what qualifies as such?) composer's website and fell in love with the music because it was like it'd come out of my diary or something. Every female friend I made listen to it immediately fell in love with it as well because it captured something we'd all as women gone through, and it was all written by a gay man.

I don't even know that it's gay men persay, I just think it depends on the person and their upbringing and such - who the person is, how they group up, etc. that makes it well written for a certain sex or ethnicity or social class or economic class, etc., I don't really think you can generalize it.

[Elphaba]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 3:27pm

daydreamer, sure!

[MargoChanning]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 3:28pm

And to follow up on Blue Wizard's point, another gay man, Tennessee Williams wrote many of the the greatest female roles in the history of the American theatre -- Amanda Wingfeld, Blanche duBois, Maggie the Cat, Serafine Delle Rose (Rose Tattoo), Alexandra Del Lago (Sweet Bird of Youth), Lady Torrance (Orpheus Descending).......

And what about the female characters written by gay men like Oscar Wilde (Gwen, Cecily and Lady Bracknell in The Importnace of Being Earnest), Noel Coward (Amanda in Private Lives, Gilda in Design for Living, Elvira, Ruth and Madame Arcati in Blithe SPirit), William Inge (Lola in Come Back Little Sheba; Cherie in Bus Stop), Kushner (Harper and Hannah in Angels in America; Caroline in Caroline, or Change) ...... I could name more......

Updated On: 6/6/05 at 03:28 PM

[Elphaba]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 3:30pm

Barvo Margo, well said!

[rusmic]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 3:40pm

"Anyone who doesn't want to accept Gays should not be allowed to listen to songs by Stephen Sondheim. It's sort of how racists shouldn't be allowed to listen to Al Green. You folks go enjoy Nascar or something."

Ummm Wow..talk about being stereotypical and offensive! I love theatre, I am not gay, I watched the Tony's last night and wasn't offended at all by the kisses, and guess what? I also am a huge NASCAR fan. All this time and I didn't realize since I watch NASCAR I'm not suppose to like theatre...elitist aren't we???

[adamnyc]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 3:49pm

he seems really nice and genuine- an all around good guy and handsome too! The kiss he gave his partner was sweet.

[rKrispyt]

Posted: 6/6/05 at 3:53pm

Joe-that's crazy about the newspaper. I wanna write coverage of the Emmy's and take note of all the heterosexual pda's and send a letter to the editor, lol. I kid.

Just makes me shake my head.

I thought last night was nice because it wasn't some big deal. People were jsut being themselves and not "I'm gay, look at me make out with my partner!". Sad to see that...apparantly homosexuals being happy is political or morally-threatening to people.

Makes me sad that we live in a world that reacts as such...or should I say a nation?

ps. my apologies on all my posts today for having the most typos I've ever seen in my life and making me look like a 13 year old, lol. I'm so ashamed...

pps. Elphaba, I must know what your avatar is? It's making me smile each time I see it :)