Grey Gardens vs. Caroline, or Change.- Page 2

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 10/20/06 at 6:09pm

every performance, the audience is howling with laughter, cheering for ebersole and crying at the end. they are entertained. you are in the minority.

i'm just saying.

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 10/20/06 at 6:12pm

We see Grey Gardens tomorrow. I would have to see GG will win as we did not care for Caroline

[Tricky Joe]

Posted: 10/20/06 at 6:12pm

I loved Caroline and HATED Grey Gardens. If we're taking a vote.

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 10/21/06 at 6:38pm

Saw GG today

We enjoyed it & Ebersole will definitely get the Tony. Having said that , we could not see ourselves seeing it again. No idea why anyone would want to see it multiple times but so be it

The cast was top rate especially Bob Stillman & John Mc Martin.Ebersole was mesmerizing. The sets were quite good & the score was as well . We have the CD out now & based on the additions, cannot see ourselves rushing out to buy a new CD based on 4 new numbers should it be recorded

Definitely superior to Caroline & we give is a 9 1/2. We took 1/2 off as they were not selling a magnet - just kidding

[Ciaron McCarthy]

Posted: 10/21/06 at 6:45pm

Definitely superior to Caroline & we give is a 9 1/2.

You gave a show you would not see again 9 1/2 stars? Is that out of ten?

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 10/21/06 at 6:49pm

First of all, rather than spend money seeing the same show over & over agian, we would rather see something else

We would rather see 20 shows than 1 show 20 times. The subject matter , to us, does not lend it self to repeated viewings no matter how well it is done.We gave it 9 1/2 as we really liked it but simply do not see the same shows over & over again. If this is your cup of tea and you have unlimited resources, more power to you

[Ciaron McCarthy]

Posted: 10/21/06 at 6:50pm

I didn't mean that to be rude. I was just curious.

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 10/21/06 at 6:53pm

Fine- no problem

[Roninjoey]

Posted: 10/21/06 at 9:58pm

-wondering to self if Mr Roxy is using the royal we.

[Broadway Matt]

Posted: 10/22/06 at 1:59am

I haven't seen GREY GARDENS, but I have trouble believeing that it could hold a candle to the genius that is CAROLINE OR CHANGE. I may be wrong, and if this is the case when I do see GG- I'll happily report on it. But until then, nothing in the past 5 years has even come close to CAROLINE.

[Nick Plasia]

Posted: 10/22/06 at 2:09am

From TheaetreMania.com

August 21, 2006
How I Love Their "Corn"

So what’s the song of the year? I’ll tell you my choice, and I’m not kidding: “Jerry Likes My Corn.”

I’m serious. The song in the middle of the second act of Grey Gardens is close to a masterpiece, both in its music (by Scott Frankel) and lyrics (by Michael Korie), which show quite a bit of character and subtext.


--Peter Filichia



Somehow, "Mr. Gellman's Shirt" from Caroline didn't make the cut...




http://www.theatermania.com/peterfilichia/index.cfm?date=20060821

Updated On: 10/22/06 at 02:09 AM

[Broadway Matt]

Posted: 10/22/06 at 2:23am

that can easily be explained. first off, it's a different year so nothing from CAROLINE would be eligible. secondly, "Mr Gellman's Shirt" isn't a very good song.

so it's probable that this song from GG is better than that particular cut from COC. but does it stand up to "Lot's Wife" or "Gonna Pass Me A Law" or "The Bus" or "Moon Change/Trio"?

[LostLeander]

Posted: 10/22/06 at 3:22am

I'm in the middle of the debate.

I certainly do love "pointless" theatre... the Millie's, The Producers, etc of the world.

And I love the heavy psychosis, sometimes moralistic (though best when subtle) musicals of Sondheim and LaChiusa.

But more and more I am moving toward the idea that the theatre doesn't have to make you go out and change the world, but just make you think about people in a whole different light.

In Wicked, we never really struggle with accepting Elphaba because we know it'w wrong to discriminate. We're alaways basically on her side. Of course, this is a slight simplification, but the "point" is pretty obvious.

But in something like Light in the Piazza, there certainly isn't a sententious, easy, put it in a to-go box, easy to digest "moral" of the piece. The play is about a mother struggling to let her child go. But it is ALL in the way it's written. The show is beautiful, and unabashedly romantic, but the writing is such that you MUST think for yourself.

Caroline is, in its simplest, most bare bones plot structure, about a maid grappling with the decision to take the change. When she does, she does something she regrets, but then comes back to work. There is an amazingly miniscule amount of plot, but there are SO many issues brought up, that I could not help but be so entralled . In fact, my only complaint is that there it was a tad overreaching, and I blame Kushner's "Gulf of Mexico" geographical and metaphorical tropes. But gee, I left that theatre THINKING. And I still think about it.

Sondheim's plots are generally always wrapped up neatly, and buttoned in the end, but the brilliance comes from the inner action of the play, and how the characters behave, though they come to a conclusion. Some might look at the end of Into the Woods and say "Cop-out, crowd pleaser" but there is so much to think about during the play. There is never really a clear hero.

Contemporary theatre likes to leave the ending open, like in Piazza and Bernarda Alba, and certainly Caroline or Change. Perhaps because audiences are less willing to endow themselves in a play, these endings FORCE you to at least consider what might happen, if not for just that one minute as you leave the theatre.

It's 3:30 and I'm rambling, but I can't really comment on Grey Gardens as I have yet to listen to the CD, and I was unable to see it this weekend.

Updated On: 10/22/06 at 03:22 AM

[Broadway Matt]

Posted: 10/22/06 at 3:32am

nobody overreaches as brilliantly as Tony Kushner

[VeuveClicquot]

Posted: 10/22/06 at 5:17am

"I don't think you mean point at all. you mean moral and that is an awfully trite expectation--especially when good theatre should ask questions, not provide the answers. and you ask questions by simply presenting the story."

No, "moral" is not what I'm reaching for. But you do have a point. I'm not looking for answers in Grey Gardens. I'm simply wishing it asked more questions.

Honestly, JRB, tonight I went to see "Evil Dead" and I was wishing the whole time that I was sitting through something as intelligent and thoughtful as "Grey Gardens."

The reason that I keep "harping" about "GG" is that I care. And I think there are lessons to be learned by examining it.

And I think that chatting about it can illuminate ideas. Let's keep the dialogue going.

[giddyup]

Posted: 10/22/06 at 6:48am

I think they're both equally great.

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 10/22/06 at 12:28pm

Updated On: 10/22/06 at 12:28 PM

[VIETgrlTerifa]

Posted: 10/22/06 at 1:43pm

I don't understand why "Mr. Gellman's shirt" is being spoken as it was something bad. IMO, it works because it comes right after Caroline and the radio were reminiscing about her husband and past and what went wrong, then Mrs. Gellman comes and unintentionally interupts it. Caroline is feeling raw not to menton earlier you know Caroline does not really want to take the money (with how the line "dig for the money!" keeps repeating) but it's just too tempting not to.

I think for it's purpose, it works very well.

Nick Plasia, are you saying that every song in Grey Gardens is a masterpiece? Is Grey Gardens sung-through? I ask because it's easier to not make any unspectacular songs when the show isn't fully sung-through.

[uncageg]

Posted: 10/22/06 at 3:03pm

I decided that I wanted to hear "Grey Gardens". I was going to wait until I saw it but I was going crazy! Since I couldn't find it anywhere here in Denver, a friend gave me his copy to listen to (He saw it this past Tuesday and purchased it at the theatre. He has been raving about the show since he got back). I will say that I like COC's music much better. But, my friend said that he feels I need to see Grey Gardens to have a better appreciation for the music. And I feel that may be the case for me. However, having seen the documentary, just listening to Ebersole in the second act gave me goosebumps. She SO NAILS "Little" Edie. I am also very interested in hearing the songs that replaced the ones that were cut. I still think that after seeing the show, I will still like COC overall much better. It's just a masterpiece, in my opinion.