Hamilton Tix Horror Story - — Page 2

The frustrating thing for me is that my first call is always to group sales - Anthony is the best, by the way - and I was told, "listen, we haven't placed a group order in months to Hamilton and we probably won't be able to place one for the next 6 months to a year". Obviously, all bets are off when talking about a show like Hamilton (which I saw in October), but it breaks my heart that my students can't see this show. And by the way our 35 seats were spread out over 4 different shows -

I'm glad you guys read and try to decipher all the fine print before ordering anything online. I sure don't. I just accidentally bought too many tickets for that November to January period because I didn't see the fine print you have to scroll all the way down the app to find. I had previously checked the ticket limit but it was for a different time period, and I had no idea it changed. So I'm probably going to have the same thing happen to me. (I've tried to preempt having all of them cancelled by contacting them, explaining the error, and specifying which orders I'd like to have cancelled, but we'll see.)



The rules are poorly written and hard to find. I wouldn't assume "other identifying information" includes IP address unless it says that. It is within the letter of the rules for different people with different accounts and from different households to all buy tickets from the same computer if each of them does not exceed the limits. I understand ticket master is doing this to try to cut down on scalpers but I don't think the OP did anything that violated the express written policy. In fact, they clearly tried to comply and still didn't.



Ticketmaster could help this by making the policy clear and putting it in a prominent location when you buy tickets. If different people with different accounts can't place orders from the same computer, it should say that. Even that November to January policy is confusing. It says "maximum ticket limit for performances 11/1/16-1/22/17 is 10 tickets per person." I could see how someone could think that meant it was 10 per show for shows during that time period.



Thats a bit of a non-sequitur but the point is the people who write these things don't do a good job of making them clear.



Anyway OP I wish I had a solution to suggest.

bwaybri2 said: "The frustrating thing for me is that my first call is always to group sales - Anthony is the best, by the way - and I was told, "listen, we haven't placed a group order in months to Hamilton and we probably won't be able to place one for the next 6 months to a year". Obviously, all bets are off when talking about a show like Hamilton (which I saw in October), but it breaks my heart that my students can't see this show. And by the way our 35 seats were spread out over 4 different shows -



"



I genuinely feel bad for you. I know your students were probably really excited to see it. The show is touring soon so it's possible they can see it maybe in Chicago when it comes to town unfortunately Hamilton seems to be bucking down on scalpers. It's too bad you were affected though. I would just sell the tickets and maybe try and pay for another show if there's know way Ticketmaster can get you tickets.

"The rules are poorly written and hard to find. I wouldn't assume "other identifying information" includes IP address unless it says that. It is within the letter of the rules for different people with different accounts and from different households to all buy tickets from the same computer if each of them does not exceed the limits. "

This is industry standard for online purchases. I've worked for several online companies that have routinely been doing the exact same thing for several years.

It's actually not within the letter or spirit of the rules. The rules are fairly clear. 10 tickets. They bought more. They were trying to work around the rules with technicalities. They weren't doing anything morally wrong and I'm genuinely bummed it didn't work out for them... but Ticketmaster is not in the wrong here.

I'm not saying they're not within their rights under the terms and conditions. I'm saying its poor customer service to not make those terms and conditions clear. If the ticket limit policy changes, they should make it clear. I already checked the policy last time I bought tickets. You shouldn't have to spend 15 minutes searching the website for every ticket you buy. If you did so, you'd time out on every order.



But that's about me. I broke the rules because I didn't know they'd changed and now I'm trying to remedy it by proactively asking TM to cancel the orders above the limit. On the other hand, I've read the rules and I don't think the OP broke them. Four different people from four different households and separate billing addresses and credit cards each bought tickets within the limits. The rules don't say anything about that. If you read all the boilerplate it's actually within ticketmaster's rights to cancel tickets for any reason without notice, so in a legal standpoint they did nothing wrong. But they still provided poor customer service.



The problem is, for most business, if they provide poor customer service they suffer lost business. That's not true for ticketmaster since if you don't live in NY, it's the only way to get a ticket to Hamilton. And outside of New York it's even worse. At least in NY most shows use telecharge. (Which I've found to have EXCELLENT service by the way.)

The single IP address is the problem. Based on your logic a scalper should be able to go and get 10 prepaid debit cards, register them at different addresses and under different names, and then sit at his computer and buy using 10 different Ticketmaster accounts.

Right I get that. I'm not saying they shouldn't be allowed to make it a criteria. What I'm saying is the terms and conditions should say that. If it says it's a per household or per person limit its not clear at all from the language that IP address is the way that's defined since people can share computers/IP addresses (I.e. At work). All they'd have to do is say the ticket limit is per household or per IP address.



Unfortunately I actually don't think IP address is a barrier to scalpers because I think the software they uses generates new IP addresses as well. I really don't know what the solution is other than preventing resale altogether (which of course comes with its own host of difficulties and disadvantages). They're always going to come up with some technical work-around.

I don't think you can contact the cc company and dispute cancellation--only a charge. I feel bad for the OP for trying to do good and play by the rules not knowing what "other information" meant. I'm sure hearing statements like "you broke the rules" isn't helping him or her more. For what it's worth, I would contribute to crowd-funding. While this would sadly help the resellers, I loathe Ticketmaster more.

Updated On: 5/13/16 at 03:11 PM

Do you have a "help me Howie" type at your local news station? Do you know a lawyer who can make a call to TM on your behalf and explain how their unclear language is causing a financial penalty for many people? Don't be a Burr, be a Hamilton and get your plan through Congress!

franch2 said: "I'm sure Ticketmaster's terms and conditions are vetted extensively by internal and external counsel and your lawyer friend isn't going to rattle them.



"

It's not about rattling them, they're a freaking monopoly but sometimes in the interest of good publicity they might be more amenable to changing their minds. She's got a very sympathetic situation, school kids, plane tickets, etcetera. I would try all options before giving up.

I just want to check and make sure I'm in the clear here. I know people are saying 10 is the max number, but I've seen other numbers elsewhere. I bought 6 tickets on Wednesday night (3 pairs for 3 different shows). These tickets are for friends who have been trying forever to see the show and couldn't get their hands on a reasonably priced ticket. With that being said, I want to make sure that I didn't break any rules and my tickets aren't going to disappear on me.

Updated On: 5/13/16 at 05:02 PM

bwayandstuff said: "I just want to check and make sure I'm in the clear here. I know people are saying 10 is the max number, but I've seen other numbers elsewhere. I bought 6 tickets on Wednesday night (3 pairs for 3 different shows). These tickets are for friends who have been trying forever to see the show and couldn't get their hands on a reasonably priced ticket. With that being said, I want to make sure that I didn't break any rules and my tickets aren't going to disappear on me.



"

You should be fine. The limit was 14 tickets over 7 days and for some future shows its 10 for the entire time period. If you go to ticketmaster and go to the date you bought tickets and click under "ticket limit" it will tell you what the limit is for that specific show. (As I've now learned, it changes! So go to the date you're buying tickets, not just any date.). But 10 in the three or so month period from November to January is the lowest limit I've seen.



I sent ticketmaster an email specifying which tickets I wanted to cancel since I didn't know the ticket limits changed and accidentally bought too many. I tried to call but couldn't get through. I'll be fine if they cancel the ones above the limit (although I'll have some disappointed friends who were planning to go on some of the dates) but I just hope they don't cancel them all since it was an innocent mistake.



Interestingly, even the NYT says the limit is 14 tickets over 7 days! It's really unclear that you have to check on a performance by performance basis.

ChiTheaterFan said: "Unfortunately I actually don't think IP address is a barrier to scalpers because I think the software they uses generates new IP addresses as well. I really don't know what the solution is other than preventing resale altogether (which of course comes with its own host of difficulties and disadvantages). They're always going to come up with some technical work-around."

And that's the saddest part. The scalpers already know how to game the system, and I'll bet you that not a lot of "professional" scalpers lost their tickets - only the innocent people like the OP who just didn't know what they were doing was "illegal" and didn't know how to game the system.

When I checked the Ticketmaster maps for December and January dates there were still lots of blocks of "fan-to-fan" (scalper) seats available. And those jerks are the ones who scooped up all of the available tickets lost by honest folk in this last 'purge' and are now...yup...scalping them. It's infuriating.